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07-01-2015, 06:26 AM   #976
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I feel fortunate that in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada I can go to a local camera store (McBains) and handle any Pentax product available. If I find a cheaper online price, I take it to them for a price match, which they will do >90% of the time. I would rather support my local dealer than some on-line company from wherever.

07-01-2015, 06:31 AM   #977
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
I was asked recently to do a one hour (up to 90 minutes) talk about photography, Pentax sportsimages and portraits in a store that was newly Pentax Premium dealer. This question came from Ricoh Imaging. In the end this didn't took place since I have no intention to do this on my own expenses. There was no budget for compensation, not even the one hour drive in my car.
That kind of thing makes you sick... you want to help them out but, these are corporations. After supporting Apple for years, in presentations to my employer on my own dime, that eventually led to selling thousands of Apple computers to my Board of Education, they dumped iDIsk and I eventually lost thousands of hours of work, because no one could figure out how to retrieve all of my data before they killed it. I will never again do a damn thing for free for a corporation, it doesn't matter how much you believe in what they do, they can change their minds in a corporate second, go a different direction and not even say "Thanks you very much."
07-01-2015, 06:36 AM   #978
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
How can be profitable for a company not to advertise their products?
This is the real kicker. They can't increase sales if only those who already use Pentax know about their cameras. As so many have commented here, Pentax marketing, at least in the US, needs to be significantly increased.
07-01-2015, 06:42 AM   #979
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
I was asked recently to do a one hour (up to 90 minutes) talk about photography, Pentax sportsimages and portraits in a store that was newly Pentax Premium dealer. This question came from Ricoh Imaging. In the end this didn't took place since I have no intention to do this on my own expenses. There was no budget for compensation, not even the one hour drive in my car.
That's sad.
In Romania for example the official Pentax dealer doesn't want to open a simple Facebook page so we can post photos, share experiences and even do some comparison tests with Nikon/Canon cameras. We can make a lot of noise if they help us. But they are not interested in selling, if you ask me.

I mean come on, there are photographers from lots of online photo magazines here in Romania which are interested in Pentax gear and they want to review Pentax K-3 II for example, but Pentax dealer closes the door to them. With that kind of attitude no one will ever be interested in Pentax.

07-01-2015, 06:42 AM   #980
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I guess the problem for Pentax is, their sales were decreasing, even when they were still maintaining a heavy advertising presence. So at least in their minds, it may be hard for them to want to get back into that model. The company never bought in to celebrity endorsements, which seem to be the kingpins of modern advertising. Andre Agassi and Maria Sharapova have sold more Canon cameras than anything Pentax has done.

The question becomes, now that Canon has done it and achieved the market share they did, what's left for Pentax to do? Often, things like that are effective first time through, but with diminishing returns if you keep doing it.

Pentax marketing has to see those dollars come back to them in increased sales, enough to pay for the marketing effort. Or maybe everyone is saying they should increase the cost of each camera 50$ and put that money into marketing? The question is always who is going to pay for that? And the answer is always "you".
07-01-2015, 06:46 AM   #981
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
Every day people see me with my Pentax K-3 II an ask me where can they go and test it. Well, they can not. You think it is ok to tell them to go buy one from an online store and see if it's good for them? Is this a valid Pentax strategy in your opinion??? I hope not...

For the next 3-4 years K-3 II is more than enough for me. I hope that everything will change when full frame will be released. And by that I mean better advertising, better flash system and support from third party manufacturers. If nothing is going to change in the next 3-4 years...then I think I will leave Pentax.

---------- Post added 07-01-15 at 11:11 AM ----------



Yes, for me is important to touch the camera in order to see if the grip is ok, if is to heavy, if I like how autofocus works...

You can buy from an online store if you know what are you buying, but if you never touch a Pentax camera you may end up paying for a camera that is not suits you.
Well, I can definitely check out the K-3II - briefly - by going to Focus94's store (which is the official Pentax distributor). I can hold it in my hands, see if the grip is OK etc. I suppose I could take a few pics with an exposed sample, but for this we can find images on the web, taken in controlled conditions.

I understand your point of view, and I also think there's much to improve (locally and at a larger scale). I consider myself lucky, living in Bucharest I have the options above.
I'm also aware of some occasions where our distributor tried to challenge the status quo through marketing. Launching the K-3 as an official event (held at F64) presented by a pro photographer, for example. They bought advertising pages in some magazines. I doubt there was any positive effect... just the expenses.
So while I think the situations should improve (or else), I don't want to be in their shoes, having to find a solution. They don't just need marketing, but effective marketing - and products to match. It's not possible for example to enter large convenience stores when you don't have the volumes, and you can't match cheap Canikon's prices. So, perhaps something built with enthusiasts in mind? But what could it be...
07-01-2015, 06:57 AM   #982
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Well, I can definitely check out the K-3II - briefly - by going to Focus94's store (which is the official Pentax distributor). I can hold it in my hands, see if the grip is OK etc. I suppose I could take a few pics with an exposed sample, but for this we can find images on the web, taken in controlled conditions.

I understand your point of view, and I also think there's much to improve (locally and at a larger scale). I consider myself lucky, living in Bucharest I have the options above.
I'm also aware of some occasions where our distributor tried to challenge the status quo through marketing. Launching the K-3 as an official event (held at F64) presented by a pro photographer, for example. They bought advertising pages in some magazines. I doubt there was any positive effect... just the expenses.
So while I think the situations should improve (or else), I don't want to be in their shoes, having to find a solution. They don't just need marketing, but effective marketing - and products to match. It's not possible for example to enter large convenience stores when you don't have the volumes, and you can't match cheap Canikon's prices. So, perhaps something built with enthusiasts in mind? But what could it be...
You are lucky if you find one camera in the store. And let's face it, anyone heard of Focus94 in Romania? Maybe, if you heard about Pentax. I saw the official event (held at F64) presented by a pro photographer and the event was sponsored by F64, not by Focus94. They only agree to loan a camera to F64 for that presentation.

F64 and CamereDigitale want to take control on Pentax brand in Romania, but I don't know why Ricoh is not willing to acept their request. If F64 would be the official dealer in Romania I think Pentax will be much more visible in Romania.

Last edited by Dan Rentea; 07-01-2015 at 07:21 AM.
07-01-2015, 07:03 AM - 1 Like   #983
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QuoteOriginally posted by DDoram Quote
I feel fortunate that in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada I can go to a local camera store (McBains) and handle any Pentax product available. If I find a cheaper online price, I take it to them for a price match, which they will do >90% of the time. I would rather support my local dealer than some on-line company from wherever.
I think that anyone will like to buy from a brick store, where he can test the product, can talk with a competent seller, who knows his stuff and can show the functionality of this cameras and accessories.

But if Pentax does not make any sustained advertising, and as a result, only one man from one hundred ask about Pentax product in the stores, of course that some ''bean counters'' will decide to take out Pentax products out of stores.

What RonHendriks is telling is ... I miss the words. And I can't understand how they can makes such decisions. Makes me think that the biggest ''bean counters'' are at the Ricoh. If they will continue to do things that way, I have doubts about a bright future for Pentax. And sadly is not the only reason.

But maybe they will make some changes.

07-01-2015, 07:13 AM   #984
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There are Pentax shooters like myself who'd happily do Pentax presentations at various stores for gas money + 50 bucks. In fact, I'm hoping to be teaching some "getting the most out your camera in the park" type sessions for the Algonquin Park Arts Centre. I don't mind doing this kind of stuff... I just don't want to be out of pocket for it.
07-01-2015, 08:06 AM   #985
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Is Pentax selling their production? Then their marketing is adequate.

Brick and mortar stores are disappearing outside of large markets.

The best advertising possible is the 645Z. Because of that product there will be interest in the coming full frame that wouldn't exist otherwise.

There aren't service arrangements in place yet in many markets which has hurt them in lucrative markets.

I'm in an industry where badly targeted advertising can cost and put you out of business.

I think more interesting is how Ricoh manages to structure the business away from low margin retail price wars to higher margin service based backed by top notch products.

Sony in spite of good sales of their cameras bodies is awash with red ink. Camera bodies seem to be loss leaders, but leading to what?
07-01-2015, 08:08 AM   #986
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
You are lucky if you find one camera in the store. And let's face it, anyone heard of Focus94 in Romania? Maybe, if you heard about Pentax. I saw the official event (held at F64) presented by a pro photographer and the event was sponsored by F64, not by Focus94. They only agree to loan a camera to F64 for that presentation.

F64 and CamereDigitale want to take control on Pentax brand in Romania, but I don't know why Ricoh is not willing to acept their request. If F64 would be the official dealer in Romania I think Pentax will be much more visible in Romania.
They should have it on stock

No, AFAIK it wasn't just loaning the camera, but of course they loaned it to Mr. Grozescu (the aforementioned professional photographer). Though to be sure, I would have to ask Focus94 about who did what. Anyway, F64 was very quiet about it, they don't care much (if at all) to promote Pentax. They don't even have a Pentax sign at their entrance, while more obscure brands are shown. So... I'm not sure them taking over Pentax would be such a good idea.
On a side note, the 645D was similarly launched but at a fancier location (and no F64 involvement). Perhaps they'll held an event - better advertised though - for the FF, too.
07-01-2015, 08:21 AM   #987
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
There are Pentax shooters like myself who'd happily do Pentax presentations at various stores for gas money + 50 bucks. In fact, I'm hoping to be teaching some "getting the most out your camera in the park" type sessions for the Algonquin Park Arts Centre. I don't mind doing this kind of stuff... I just don't want to be out of pocket for it.
I wonder how it works with brand ambassadors? When it comes to monster corporations whose chair or MD trousers seven or eight figures a year, then yes, I'd guess we all expect at least to have expenses paid. Decent places even throw in a meal. One hopes that's not the only way brand ambassadors get to eat ...
07-01-2015, 10:28 AM   #988
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Well there are many signs that there is not to much future........

Last year I was at the WTA and ATP tournament nearby where Ricoh is One of the big sponsors. They where not interested in images made with their own Pentax camera's. They have someone from the tournament doing that payed Job.

So this year I didn't go, since no sales to be expected. What are we talking about....

http://pinterest.com/pin/506936501783762215/?s=4&m=twitter

So these Ricoh presentation are made with a Nikon camera. I bet you that Canon would never do this. Basicly there is nothing between Ricoh and the miniature camera division.

Last edited by RonHendriks1966; 07-01-2015 at 11:00 AM.
07-01-2015, 10:58 AM   #989
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Well there are many signs that there is not to much future........

Last year I was at the WTA and ATP tournament nearby where Ricoh is One of the big sponsors. They where not interested in images made with their own Pentax camera's. They have someone from the tournament doing that payed Job.

So this year I didn't go, since no sales to be expected. What are we taking about....

http://pinterest.com/pin/506936501783762215/?s=4&m=twitter

So these Ricoh presentation are made with a Nikon camera. I bet you that Canon would never do this. Basicly there is nothing between Ricoh and the miniature camera division.

Ron, I've never been a "Pentax is doomed" guy. And this is the kind of thing that doesn't seem like much at first. But the more I think about it, I have to wonder if selling off all of my Pentax gear now might actually be a prudent idea.
07-01-2015, 12:28 PM - 1 Like   #990
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The first idea, before quiting on Pentax, would be to try to make some pressure on Ricoh. To make them aware of all those things we are seeing, and which are not good for their own business, and there own money. I'm sure that Adam has some connection, also is Kenspo, who can express our concern.

Maybe we can make an open letter, get as many signatures as possible, maybe, maybe they will listen and even if they will not do anything quickly, at least they can give us a sign for the future.

A more comprehensive sign than the launches of two lenses which are over must Pentax users budget, and a promise of a FF camera. I think that their future business will not be affected if they will talk about advertising and service and collaboration, and more, about communication with their consumers.
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