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09-18-2015, 11:56 AM   #796
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
But by then Nikon and Sony will have a 60mp camera and Canon an 80mp camera, all with better AF, lens support, etc. I hate to say, they are hurting themselves by not getting something out this fall with Black Friday and Christmas. More people will jump to Canon, Nikon, or Sony because people will only wait so long for something that "may" become available instead of something that they can go out right now and purchase. Sorry Pentax/Ricoh, you screwed the pooch on this one. Again.
I initially was thinking it was a mistake as well to miss the Holiday season, but the more I thought about it, the more I don't know if it really matters. It is not like if it was a new release it was going to have a Black Friday deal attached to it. And this is not a gift type of camera. I would never expect my husband to have one waiting for me under the tree. Plus, the whole black Friday thing is a very North American (and more specifically US) thing.

09-18-2015, 11:59 AM   #797
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Guess I'll wait till Black Friday 2016, now, at least.

Works for me.
09-18-2015, 12:11 PM   #798
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QuoteOriginally posted by Allison Quote
Plus, the whole black Friday thing is a very North American (and more specifically US) thing.
You would think so, but my wife is from Brazil, and apparently they are trying to do something similar in Brazil now. The so-called deals are pretty bad though, just because everything is already so insanely over-price there.

I guess they just thought it looked like so much fun when they saw American shoppers throwing elbows and trampling each other for $15 DVD players!
09-18-2015, 01:06 PM   #799
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QuoteOriginally posted by Allison Quote
I initially was thinking it was a mistake as well to miss the Holiday season, but the more I thought about it, the more I don't know if it really matters. It is not like if it was a new release it was going to have a Black Friday deal attached to it. And this is not a gift type of camera. I would never expect my husband to have one waiting for me under the tree. Plus, the whole black Friday thing is a very North American (and more specifically US) thing.
The problem is that people will only wait for so long until they get what they need elsewhere. Bringing something that everyone else has to market after everyone else has it is not good market strategy.

09-18-2015, 01:50 PM - 1 Like   #800
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QuoteOriginally posted by VoiceOfReason Quote
The problem is that people will only wait for so long until they get what they need elsewhere. Bringing something that everyone else has to market after everyone else has it is not good market strategy.
We have seen this before, over several years, but even so there are still people willing to buy, or at least consider a Pentax 35FF body. Some people have gone, but others replace them. It isn't a static population.
09-18-2015, 02:02 PM   #801
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
We have seen this before, over several years, but even so there are still people willing to buy, or at least consider a Pentax 35FF body. Some people have gone, but others replace them. It isn't a static population.
I just failed to see the logic of "Pentax missing a lot of sales opportunities".... whoever needs a D750 or D810 would have gotten it by now... why wait?
Besides, it is all relatively speaking, say, if (and only if) the delay is partially due to accommodating the new 42Mp sensor, then Pentax would be the first DSLR (besides Sony) to come out with that sensor (albeit in 2016). Is that a missed opportunity again (where is the D900, do we expect the pending release as well)?
09-18-2015, 02:13 PM   #802
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Well, of course they've missed out on some sales opportunities, but they also have created more sales opportunities with the APS-C bodies, which still sell in greater numbers than 35FF bodies, and they've more than likely created greater per sale profit on the 645 bodies.
09-18-2015, 03:12 PM   #803
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
I think Kenspo may be and have a right to be more upset than any of us.
Ken is a full time professional who has gone from Nikon full frame to Pentax APS-C on the promise of something special within a certain time frame.
He has every reason to be upset, and I would not blame him one bit if he jumped ship.

On the other hand, APS-C images are more than adequate for my personal stuff, and for the website I shoot for occasionally. As I love my glass, and gain nothing financially from that work apart from free tickets, I will not be investing in another system. I'm irritated at the delay, but the world will keep turning.

Hopefully for Pentax there are many more like me than there are like Ken.


Last edited by Sandy Hancock; 09-18-2015 at 03:52 PM.
09-18-2015, 03:17 PM - 1 Like   #804
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
I think Kenspo may be and have a right to be more upset than any of us.
Im not upset, im pissed off!
09-18-2015, 03:37 PM   #805
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo:
Im not upset, im pissed off!
Hmm, this doesn't sound too good. I bet you've been trying to get official word from Ricoh the whole day, as it seems postponing the release to "spring 2016" hasn't been communicated beforehand?what a shame, I 'd too be pissed alot if I was a premium client/ sponsored pro to make the brand look pro again...
09-18-2015, 05:15 PM   #806
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QuoteOriginally posted by matthewp240 Quote
Does anybody know how the "image cropping" function will work on the FF sensor?
No one really knows, since a Pentax FF does not exist.

Image cropping of APS-C lenses mounted on a Pentax FF will most likely work in the same way as it does for Nikon or Sony FF - there will be a menu in-camera titled something like (eg in Sony A7R): 'APS-C Size Capture' that lets you choose 'On | Off | Auto'. If set to 'Auto' the camera will attempt to detect that a crop lens has been mounted and crop the image size recorded automatically. If set to 'Off', you will be able to shoot a crop lens as if it were a FF lens. Nikon (eg in the D610) has a menu setting called 'Auto DX Crop' with settings 'On | Off' that does a similar thing.
09-18-2015, 11:25 PM   #807
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Barely bigger at all if that holds up.



Nikon D750
840 gm, 149x113x78mm

Temperature: 0 to 40C/32 to 104F; humidity: 85% or less (no condensation)

K-3
1240 gms, 132 x100 x 77mm

Operating temperature: 14-104F (-10 to 40C)
Weather resistant: Yes (92 special sealing parts)

I'm not seeing the D750 as in the same leagues as a K-3 in terms of out doors, and having had two cameras covered with condensation on the last few nights, I'm not so sure about leaving a D750 out where there might be condensation for star trails. So an extra 400 grams for weather sealing, a much lower operating temperatures.

There are a few things missing from the D750 I wouldn't trade weight for. Since I regularly use my camera in -20 and moist conditions.

I can't ever remember a K-3 breaking my back, , in fact I can't remembers a K-3, DA 18-135 and DA*60-250 ever breaking my back... but, I guess all backs are different.

Image with dew covered lens and camera... I kind of like it.


With Pentax, no worries....

You do have a very good point. The D750, and also the Canon 6D for that matter, lack quite a bit in the ruggedness department despite their magnesium alloy frame, and ambiguous weather sealing, that usually makes "common" users see them in the same league as the more flagship bodies.

Then again, in my previous comment I had mentioned that I fear the full-frame camera will wind up being heavier than even the likes of the Nikon D810 and 5D mk3, cameras which may not have the exact same temperature ratings, but are at least proven to be professionally reliable.

Still, I will happily lug a heavier camera all over kingdom come, for certain jobs. My friends and I have lugged various cameras up all sorts of mountains, including Mt Whitney in the Sierras, and some obscene 2+lb lenses such as the Nikon 14-24 and the Tamron 15-30.

So, when the job requires it, my back can handle it. My knees, though, are a different story unfortunately. For me, each extra pound really does matter.

Then again, I know I can make up for it by taking advantage of the amazing, lightweight primes that Pentax offers, both FA an DA, many of which are probably as many grams lighter as however many grams heavier a body might be. I'd rather opt for a Rokinon 14mm than a Nikon 14-24 or Tamron 15-30. I'd rather opt for an f/4 zoom than an f/2.8, for landscapes. And so on and so forth.

While we're on the subject of weight saving, I have also been known to happily "compromise" with a crop-sensor camera, even a beginner one, for lighter weight adventures when I want to bring 2-3 cameras, or when I just want one and I'm really just going lightweight. And in that regard Pentax also wins, since they're the only ones putting weather sealing in their beginner cameras; even the K-S2 is weather sealed if I am not mistaken, for "only" 21 oz.

To that end, Pentax definitely wins across the board, even if the K-3FX is a tad heavier than a Nikon D810 or Canon 5DsR.

;-)
09-19-2015, 12:51 AM   #808
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QuoteOriginally posted by Matthew Saville Quote
You do have a very good point. The D750, and also the Canon 6D for that matter, lack quite a bit in the ruggedness department despite their magnesium alloy frame, and ambiguous weather sealing, that usually makes "common" users see them in the same league as the more flagship bodies.

Then again, in my previous comment I had mentioned that I fear the full-frame camera will wind up being heavier than even the likes of the Nikon D810 and 5D mk3, cameras which may not have the exact same temperature ratings, but are at least proven to be professionally reliable.

Still, I will happily lug a heavier camera all over kingdom come, for certain jobs. My friends and I have lugged various cameras up all sorts of mountains, including Mt Whitney in the Sierras, and some obscene 2+lb lenses such as the Nikon 14-24 and the Tamron 15-30.

So, when the job requires it, my back can handle it. My knees, though, are a different story unfortunately. For me, each extra pound really does matter.

Then again, I know I can make up for it by taking advantage of the amazing, lightweight primes that Pentax offers, both FA an DA, many of which are probably as many grams lighter as however many grams heavier a body might be. I'd rather opt for a Rokinon 14mm than a Nikon 14-24 or Tamron 15-30. I'd rather opt for an f/4 zoom than an f/2.8, for landscapes. And so on and so forth.

While we're on the subject of weight saving, I have also been known to happily "compromise" with a crop-sensor camera, even a beginner one, for lighter weight adventures when I want to bring 2-3 cameras, or when I just want one and I'm really just going lightweight. And in that regard Pentax also wins, since they're the only ones putting weather sealing in their beginner cameras; even the K-S2 is weather sealed if I am not mistaken, for "only" 21 oz.

To that end, Pentax definitely wins across the board, even if the K-3FX is a tad heavier than a Nikon D810 or Canon 5DsR.

;-)
What are you discussing based on wrong weights?
(edit: related to normheads posting) The 750 is 840g and the K-3 800g incl. battery...

Last edited by MMVIII; 09-19-2015 at 01:28 AM.
09-19-2015, 03:08 AM   #809
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
In my house this doesn't even slightly affect his "forum god" status.
I don't think he is worried about his forum god status. I think he is angry that Ricoh promised him certain things when he signed on and they aren't delivering on those promises.
09-19-2015, 04:04 AM   #810
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I don't think he is worried about his forum god status. I think he is angry that Ricoh promised him certain things when he signed on and they aren't delivering on those promises.
Well, that is an issue.... most of us are real curious about an FF, but don't really need one, even to meet our hobby objectives. But there are some of us who need more, who have been waiting forever, etc. it doesn't serve any them well. That being said, Pentax is releasing one FF as far as we know. There are so many FFs out there with different strengths and weaknesses we won't have any idea what the Pentax FF will be until they release it. Some of us are looking for a D750, some are looking for a D810, some are looking for a D3s, some are looking for a D4x, it can't be all of those things. We don't even know what we are waiting for. If the FF is being delayed by a shortage of manufacturing capacity Pentax knows what kind of camera it is. They should just let us know and those for whom it is not appropriate can move on. Some, people are waiting for something that isn't going to come. If this is a redesigned based on new available technology, then that becomes more problematic Essentially "We know nuttinck:

People like me aren't even waiting, we're just watching the circus.
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