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10-18-2015, 10:55 AM   #1126
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There's no secret, if they do like they did with the APSC line, they'll do a high-end FF, then a cost reduced version of that full frame. That might mean a drop of the APSC line after a few years. Anyway, if that is the case, that makes sense from a business standpoint because it forces customers to buy new lenses (DFA lenses) , so to generate more revenue from the existing k mount base.

10-18-2015, 11:54 AM - 1 Like   #1127
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
There's no secret, if they do like they did with the APSC line, they'll do a high-end FF, then a cost reduced version of that full frame. That might mean a drop of the APSC line after a few years. Anyway, if that is the case, that makes sense from a business standpoint because it forces customers to buy new lenses (DFA lenses) , so to generate more revenue from the existing k mount base.
Especially since by releasing a lower end version of the high end model, it will allow those of us who never make enough from our photography to cover the cost of our equipment to try out a Full Frame, without paying the big bucks. I'd be happy to use a K-50 version of a Full Frame.
10-18-2015, 11:56 AM   #1128
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
This first FF is mostly aimed at the pro's..So the features will be there after. So it won't come with all the strange stuff people are talking about and hoping for.
strange stuff? like 5 axis SR, like newest sony sensor,like PS, like..well why don't you tell us what strange stuff own't be there Kenspo,which shouldn't get you in trouble with the lady with the Whip
10-18-2015, 11:58 AM   #1129
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
"This first FF is..."
First? Gotcha Kenspo !!
Well, I certainly hope this isn't planned to be Pentax's last FF!
It would be hard to justify the R&D expense, it would be hard to sell this, if no followup product were planned.
I heard Kenspo saying that they are going to get this FF right, and then they can go on to other dreams.
Nothing wrong or unexpected with that.

10-18-2015, 12:05 PM   #1130
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Well, it should or be a surprise that this is the first FF...and that it is aimed for pros.

Question still remains tha how long does it take to have a FF model for amateurs.
10-18-2015, 12:41 PM   #1131
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QuoteOriginally posted by repaap Quote
Well, it should or be a surprise that this is the first FF...and that it is aimed for pros.

Question still remains tha how long does it take to have a FF model for amateurs.
The thing I'm not clear on is how a camera specifically aimed at amateurs would differ from one specifically aimed at professionals.

Let me give an example of my thinking: Last night, our senior cat was staring and staring at a file cabinet. The last time I saw that kind of behavior from her was ten years ago, when she had stared and stared at a bookcase at our then-house in Kansas. When I had pulled the bookcase away from the wall, we had discovered a field mouse; in this case, the file cabinet was too heavy for me to pull it on the carpet, so I got a small flashlight and managed to peer back behind the cabinet to reveal ... a deer mouse (the kind that carries Lyme disease!!). I thought this might be an interesting picture, but I knew that my K-30 lens was too big for the situation, so I grabbed my Q-7. I spent a couple of frustrating minutes trying to get the camera to focus, and then I suddenly realized that it was somehow set in manual focus mode; just before I was finally focused on the mouse, he apparently tired of having the flashlight shining in his face, and he took off, only to be grabbed by our junior cat who had been standing right there. That cat then dashed into the dining room ... and released the mouse (apparently he is still somewhere in the house, since neither cat has produced a mouse body yet!).

The reason for this story is that it illustrates a basic point. As an amateur, I take a limited number of pictures. I have time to forget the minutia of operating my two cameras, so I'm glad that they are so similar. I also greatly prefer simple controls, so there is less to remember and fewer opportunities to mess things up when I want to take a picture now. Reading other comments here, though, I'm beginning to think that I'm not typical; lots of people seem to want lots of options on their cameras, and that may include amateurs as well as professionals. Lots of amateurs also seem to have lots of money they are willing to spend on their hobbies.

So, what would distinguish a camera aimed at professionals from one aimed at amateurs??
10-18-2015, 12:48 PM   #1132
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
So, what would distinguish a camera aimed at professionals from one aimed at amateurs
Usually the quality of build materials and components, to give the pro version the required durability for day in day out usage.
10-18-2015, 12:51 PM   #1133
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QuoteOriginally posted by repaap Quote
Well, it should or be a surprise that this is the first FF...and that it is aimed for pros.

Question still remains tha how long does it take to have a FF model for amateurs.
Maybe best not to rely on the idea that the first Pentax digital FF will be more or less for pros in a gritty traditional sense. Who are pros these days for a start? Second, professional users need very good reasons indeed to give up what they have or forego having it in the first place by not buying into the two established DSLR brands used by professional photographers for many years now. Even a cursory look at what's on offer across a whole system isn't all that flattering to Pentax. So, why would an experienced professional give up Canon or Nikon for Pentax or, if a budding professional, choose Pentax instead?

Perhaps more likely, to be a bit cynical, is a package aimed at amateurs and "prosumers" with all the right "pro" labels attached, something that in truth isn't really for seasoned professionals with paid support packages, though they could use it of course, as for people who'd like to think they are. There people out there who buy a Canon 5D Mk III and then use it on full auto via the rear LCD like a P&S. Pros? If they think they are then who are we to say they aren't. Often these days it's just a label. And there are likely far more potential customers like this than there are among people who depend on dedicated, full-time photography for their living. Few of those left and perhaps even fewer who can be persuaded to give up the big two brands.


Last edited by mecrox; 10-18-2015 at 03:08 PM.
10-18-2015, 01:14 PM   #1134
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@Kenspo: Would you count a hybrid viewfinder (or even an EVF) as being "strange stuff"?
10-18-2015, 02:22 PM   #1135
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QuoteOriginally posted by zeitlos Quote
@Kenspo: Would you count a hybrid viewfinder (or even an EVF) as being "strange stuff"?
Yes...
10-18-2015, 02:24 PM   #1136
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Especially since by releasing a lower end version of the high end model, it will allow those of us who never make enough from our photography to cover the cost of our equipment to try out a Full Frame, without paying the big bucks. I'd be happy to use a K-50 version of a Full Frame.
I remember the splash they made when they released the KM, KX and K2 simultaneously in 1975. Too much to expect such a broad range of releases now, though, but they could have made something of the 40th anniversary, this year, if this release hadn't been deferred to 2016.

Come to think of it, the K2DMD was released in 1976…

Last edited by RobA_Oz; 10-18-2015 at 02:31 PM.
10-18-2015, 04:48 PM   #1137
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Also @kenspo: Man,

Do you think we have a chance with ANY or SOME of these points?? I mean, most of this is no big deal!

look:

•) lock pictures with AE-L Button when in Review Mode for instance ....---- Extremely important and saves you a lot of time that you would waste with pushing buttons.
•) zooming to at least 8x in deletion-mode
•) a function to tag pictures with different color dots so you can:
•) send the pictures to a destined server or online-service according to the color dot you tagged them with over WIFI... (That would also work for Flu-Card enabled wifi-capable models)
(IMHO this should be a feature most pros should appreciate... - a lot of reportage photographers who work for APA or other picture agencies who get the pictures delivered by uploads via FTP-Server...
i guess this may be the reason for Nikons Ethernet connection... ) -- so i really do not see any candy4kids in that one....
•)Tethering enhancements: Capture Pilot style where you can view the images on a remote device and even rate, colorlabel and colorbalance the images besides controling the camera.
•) Enable a 1 key suppression button (instead of suppress+confirm) --- this functionaly could make use of a button that would otherwise not have a function when navigating through a menu.
•) Add a stars mark for each picture in review mode (something easy and highly compatible) -- i also consider that point for an easy one... for instance one could hold the AF-button in review mode whilst changing the star rating with the front wheel.
___patarok & sbh & gorme & ... ?___

I would love you for handing those requests through to PENTAX....

Yes I am an addict and i would really like to see such improvements in the PENTAX-firmware - That should not be a real big deal for a bunch of professional programmers... PLZ..
10-18-2015, 05:21 PM   #1138
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It is smarter for someone in the know not to show they are in the know to this group.. we go nuts with this. Similar to knowing someone who has just won a big lottery, now we want to cozy up and get favors done. haha
10-18-2015, 05:58 PM   #1139
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QuoteOriginally posted by patarok Quote
Also @kenspo: Man,

Do you think we have a chance with ANY or SOME of these points?? I mean, most of this is no big deal!
Why not send your quirky requirements direct to the Ricoh distributor in your country? Call or email them directly.

No need to harass kenspo about such stuff.
10-18-2015, 06:20 PM   #1140
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QuoteOriginally posted by Shanti Quote
strange stuff? like 5 axis SR, like newest sony sensor,like PS, like..well why don't you tell us what strange stuff own't be there Kenspo,which shouldn't get you in trouble with the lady with the Whip
I believe 5 axis SR is strange enough that it would require a new revision on the K-mount and new lenses for it to work.
Existing K-mount lenses do not report focus distance to camera with enough accuracy to be able to use it for 5-axis SR.

Had it been easy to implement 5 axis SR on K-mount, we would have had it years ago.
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