3 Rumors

ChristianRock · 08-14-2015, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by Winder

I'm not idolizing him. People are saying Tamron doesn't have the resources to make good glass, and Jun is now at Tamrom. Just pointing out that Tamron has good designers who are more than capable. Designers who know what K-mount users want in glass.

He is good, no doubt. But the designers of the FA 31mm Limited, as far as I know, are still with Pentax. It's very hard to find out what they designed though, by just doing internet searches. I wish someone with inside knowledge could tell us a bit more about the current state of lens design at Pentax. Either way, the way the 150-450 and 16-85 came out, I'm sure it's in good hands

Winder · 08-14-2015, 12:25 PM

Originally posted by ChristianRock

He is good, no doubt. But the designers of the FA 31mm Limited, as far as I know, are still with Pentax. It's very hard to find out what they designed though, by just doing internet searches. I wish someone with inside knowledge could tell us a bit more about the current state of lens design at Pentax. Either way, the way the 150-450 and 16-85 came out, I'm sure it's in good hands

Their names were usually on the lens patent. That should be on record.

ChristianRock · 08-14-2015, 12:34 PM

Originally posted by Winder

Their names were usually on the lens patent. That should be on record.

Yeah but it's hard to find the patent in an internet search because the patent doesn't say "FA 31mm Limited", it says large aperture wide angle system or something like that.

Winder · 08-14-2015, 01:42 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by ChristianRock

Yeah but it's hard to find the patent in an internet search because the patent doesn't say "FA 31mm Limited", it says large aperture wide angle system or something like that.

Takayuki Ito & Masayuki Murata are said to be the designers of the 31mm F/1.8. Jun designed a 31mm F/2.4 which did not get produced. A fourth well known designer Takayuki Sensui ended up at Nikon.

Takayuki Sensui designed the - FA 20-35/4, FA 35/2, FA* 200/4 Macro and then Nikkor 17-55 f2.8G, Nikkor 105mm F2.8G VR Micro, Nikkor 24mm F3.5D ED and etc.

ChristianRock · 08-14-2015, 02:10 PM

Originally posted by Winder

Takayuki Ito & Masayuki Murata are said to be the designers of the 31mm F/1.8. Jun designed a 31mm F/2.4 which did not get produced. A fourth well known designer Takayuki Sensui ended up at Nikon.

Takayuki Sensui designed the - FA 20-35/4, FA 35/2, FA* 200/4 Macro and then Nikkor 17-55 f2.8G, Nikkor 105mm F2.8G VR Micro, Nikkor 24mm F3.5D ED and etc.

I somehow thought Jun also designed the 35/2.

What else have Murata an Ito designed? Do you know?

**Pål Jensen** · 08-15-2015, 01:42 PM

Originally posted by Winder

Hirakawa Jun - Camerapedia
Seems to be a pretty prevalent internet myth.
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/107233-jun-hirakawa.html
RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: NEWS: Mr. Jun Hirakawa Now Works for Tamron and Mr. Blurry Cameraphone has Left Pentax China
Jun Hirakawa's technical report probably explains this: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
Hirakawa Jun - Camera-wiki.org - The free camera encyclopedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jun_Hirakawa
Adios, amigos !...
Lessons from a Legendary Lens Designer | Photographic Ideals, Basic Principles | The Northcoast Photographer
Patents by Inventor Jun Hirakawa - Justia Patents Database Filed Patents for Hoya in 2010. Exactly who told you he was not working for Pentax in the late 90's. They might want to check the patent records.

I didn't say he was not working for Pentax. I said it was on contractual basis.
All the above is from the same source based on nothing but the fact that someone is working for Tamron. Hoya sacked people. Hence, the person must be sacked by Hoya. This is not a rumor. It is speculation and hot air....

---------- Post added 08-15-15 at 10:44 PM ----------

Originally posted by Winder

I'm not idolizing him. People are saying Tamron doesn't have the resources to make good glass, and Jun is now at Tamrom. Just pointing out that Tamron has good designers who are more than capable. Designers who know what K-mount users want in glass.

Tamron sells primarily on price. That provides some limitations.

**monochrome** · 08-15-2015, 03:09 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

I didn't say he was not working for Pentax. I said it was on contractual basis.
All the above is from the same source based on nothing but the fact that someone is working for Tamron. Hoya sacked people. Hence, the person must be sacked by Hoya. This is not a rumor. It is speculation and hot air....

---------- Post added 08-15-15 at 10:44 PM ----------

Tamron sells primarily on price. That provides some limitations.

So then your single-source rumor that you recall from nearly twenty years ago is more credible than decades of registered patents? And how many patents did Hirakawa register with all the other companies for whom he worked 'under contract' during the period?

Ahem.

D1N0 · 08-15-2015, 05:19 PM

This probably belongs in here before someone makes another bs thread: 2 pentax ff not one ..: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
Not that it will stop anybody...

**monochrome** · 08-15-2015, 05:37 PM

Originally posted by D1N0

This probably belongs in here before someone makes another bs thread: 2 pentax ff not one ..: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
Not that it will stop anybody...

Ricoh has said all along there would be a surprise.

rawr · 08-15-2015, 06:09 PM

It's not unprecedented - eg Sony A7/A7r launched the same day.

It's more work to organise, but it has advantages. Adds more steps to the FF upgrade ladder, instead of providing just one big and expensive step.

Zygonyx · 08-15-2015, 06:32 PM

Originally posted by D1N0

This probably belongs in here before someone makes another bs thread: 2 pentax ff not one ..: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review
Not that it will stop anybody...

Note that Pentax can be doomed ^2 !!

virusn3t · 08-15-2015, 06:38 PM

I hope for only 1 FF camera, 'cause 2 models will give to Ricoh some gap to increase the price for the flagship camera

**jatrax** · 08-15-2015, 06:52 PM

Originally posted by virusn3t

I hope for only 1 FF camera, 'cause 2 models will give to Ricoh some gap to increase the price for the flagship camera

But if the flagship is above $2,500 as expected maybe the other model will be more affordable?

**monochrome** · 08-15-2015, 06:56 PM

Originally posted by jatrax

But if the flagship is above $2,500 as expected maybe the other model will be more affordable?

There was that shop in Portugal taking pre-orders at $2000 . . . . . [EDIT: see next]

on the other Forum asahi man said like the 645Z - very good camera at good price and great lenses at higher price . . . .

virusn3t · 08-15-2015, 06:57 PM

Originally posted by jatrax

But if the flagship is above $2,500 as expected maybe the other model will be more affordable?

As i see

1 FF model = $2400-$2800 (my top budget)

2 FF models = Affordable $1800+ : Flagship $2800+

---------- Post added 08-15-15 at 08:58 PM ----------

Originally posted by monochrome

There was that shop in Portugal taking pre-orders at $2000 . . . . .

on the other Forum asahi man said like the 645Z - very good camera at good price and great lenses at higher price . . . .

Spain actually, and it was $2000€

08-15-2015, 06:56 PM	#599
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by jatrax But if the flagship is above $2,500 as expected maybe the other model will be more affordable? There was that shop in Portugal taking pre-orders at $2000 . . . . . [EDIT: see next] on the other Forum asahi man said like the 645Z - very good camera at good price and great lenses at higher price . . . . Last edited by monochrome; 08-15-2015 at 07:04 PM.

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08-14-2015, 10:53 AM	#586
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by Winder I'm not idolizing him. People are saying Tamron doesn't have the resources to make good glass, and Jun is now at Tamrom. Just pointing out that Tamron has good designers who are more than capable. Designers who know what K-mount users want in glass. He is good, no doubt. But the designers of the FA 31mm Limited, as far as I know, are still with Pentax. It's very hard to find out what they designed though, by just doing internet searches. I wish someone with inside knowledge could tell us a bit more about the current state of lens design at Pentax. Either way, the way the 150-450 and 16-85 came out, I'm sure it's in good hands

08-14-2015, 12:25 PM	#587
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by ChristianRock He is good, no doubt. But the designers of the FA 31mm Limited, as far as I know, are still with Pentax. It's very hard to find out what they designed though, by just doing internet searches. I wish someone with inside knowledge could tell us a bit more about the current state of lens design at Pentax. Either way, the way the 150-450 and 16-85 came out, I'm sure it's in good hands Their names were usually on the lens patent. That should be on record.

08-14-2015, 12:34 PM	#588
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by Winder Their names were usually on the lens patent. That should be on record. Yeah but it's hard to find the patent in an internet search because the patent doesn't say "FA 31mm Limited", it says large aperture wide angle system or something like that.

08-14-2015, 01:42 PM - 1 Like	#589
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by ChristianRock Yeah but it's hard to find the patent in an internet search because the patent doesn't say "FA 31mm Limited", it says large aperture wide angle system or something like that. Takayuki Ito & Masayuki Murata are said to be the designers of the 31mm F/1.8. Jun designed a 31mm F/2.4 which did not get produced. A fourth well known designer Takayuki Sensui ended up at Nikon. Takayuki Sensui designed the - FA 20-35/4, FA 35/2, FA* 200/4 Macro and then Nikkor 17-55 f2.8G, Nikkor 105mm F2.8G VR Micro, Nikkor 24mm F3.5D ED and etc.

08-14-2015, 02:10 PM	#590
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by Winder Takayuki Ito & Masayuki Murata are said to be the designers of the 31mm F/1.8. Jun designed a 31mm F/2.4 which did not get produced. A fourth well known designer Takayuki Sensui ended up at Nikon. Takayuki Sensui designed the - FA 20-35/4, FA 35/2, FA* 200/4 Macro and then Nikkor 17-55 f2.8G, Nikkor 105mm F2.8G VR Micro, Nikkor 24mm F3.5D ED and etc. I somehow thought Jun also designed the 35/2. What else have Murata an Ito designed? Do you know?

08-15-2015, 01:42 PM	#591
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Originally posted by Winder Hirakawa Jun - Camerapedia Seems to be a pretty prevalent internet myth. https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/10-pentax-slr-lens-discussion/107233-jun-hirakawa.html RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: NEWS: Mr. Jun Hirakawa Now Works for Tamron and Mr. Blurry Cameraphone has Left Pentax China Jun Hirakawa's technical report probably explains this: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review Hirakawa Jun - Camera-wiki.org - The free camera encyclopedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jun_Hirakawa Adios, amigos !... Lessons from a Legendary Lens Designer \| Photographic Ideals, Basic Principles \| The Northcoast Photographer Patents by Inventor Jun Hirakawa - Justia Patents Database Filed Patents for Hoya in 2010. Exactly who told you he was not working for Pentax in the late 90's. They might want to check the patent records. I didn't say he was not working for Pentax. I said it was on contractual basis. All the above is from the same source based on nothing but the fact that someone is working for Tamron. Hoya sacked people. Hence, the person must be sacked by Hoya. This is not a rumor. It is speculation and hot air.... ---------- Post added 08-15-15 at 10:44 PM ---------- Originally posted by Winder I'm not idolizing him. People are saying Tamron doesn't have the resources to make good glass, and Jun is now at Tamrom. Just pointing out that Tamron has good designers who are more than capable. Designers who know what K-mount users want in glass. Tamron sells primarily on price. That provides some limitations.

08-15-2015, 03:09 PM - 1 Like	#592
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by Pål Jensen I didn't say he was not working for Pentax. I said it was on contractual basis. All the above is from the same source based on nothing but the fact that someone is working for Tamron. Hoya sacked people. Hence, the person must be sacked by Hoya. This is not a rumor. It is speculation and hot air.... ---------- Post added 08-15-15 at 10:44 PM ---------- Tamron sells primarily on price. That provides some limitations. So then your single-source rumor that you recall from nearly twenty years ago is more credible than decades of registered patents? And how many patents did Hirakawa register with all the other companies for whom he worked 'under contract' during the period? Ahem.

08-15-2015, 05:19 PM	#593
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	This probably belongs in here before someone makes another bs thread: 2 pentax ff not one ..: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review Not that it will stop anybody...

08-15-2015, 05:37 PM	#594
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	Originally posted by D1N0 This probably belongs in here before someone makes another bs thread: 2 pentax ff not one ..: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review Not that it will stop anybody... Ricoh has said all along there would be a surprise.

08-15-2015, 06:09 PM	#595
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	It's not unprecedented - eg Sony A7/A7r launched the same day. It's more work to organise, but it has advantages. Adds more steps to the FF upgrade ladder, instead of providing just one big and expensive step.

08-15-2015, 06:32 PM	#596
Zygonyx Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Ile de France Posts: 4,033	Originally posted by D1N0 This probably belongs in here before someone makes another bs thread: 2 pentax ff not one ..: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review Not that it will stop anybody... Note that Pentax can be doomed ^2 !!

08-15-2015, 06:38 PM	#597
virusn3t Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 676	I hope for only 1 FF camera, 'cause 2 models will give to Ricoh some gap to increase the price for the flagship camera

08-15-2015, 06:52 PM	#598
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by virusn3t I hope for only 1 FF camera, 'cause 2 models will give to Ricoh some gap to increase the price for the flagship camera But if the flagship is above $2,500 as expected maybe the other model will be more affordable?

08-15-2015, 06:57 PM	#600
virusn3t Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 676	Originally posted by jatrax But if the flagship is above $2,500 as expected maybe the other model will be more affordable? As i see 1 FF model = $2400-$2800 (my top budget) 2 FF models = Affordable $1800+ : Flagship $2800+ ---------- Post added 08-15-15 at 08:58 PM ---------- Originally posted by monochrome There was that shop in Portugal taking pre-orders at $2000 . . . . . on the other Forum asahi man said like the 645Z - very good camera at good price and great lenses at higher price . . . . Spain actually, and it was $2000€