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08-16-2015, 03:59 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I wouldn't be surprised either way, but I would think releasing just one camera (the more expensive one) to start with would be the way to go, with an indication that another full frame camera would follow down the road. Seems like they could damage their flagship sales if they release a cheaper full frame at the same time.
Not if the two FF models differ from each other like night and day. A full specced K3-like FF camera would not compete in any way with a somewhat slower and less specced K-01-like FF model.

08-16-2015, 04:20 AM   #17
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I would be very surprised. Two bodies means means lower volume for both without a significant increase in the overall Pentax FF marked, which is limited to start with.
I wouldn't expect another FF body before the first one has proven a success.
I trust egyptian photostore employees to get the rumors from sites like this, where two bodies speculation is nothing new.
08-16-2015, 04:22 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by luftfluss Quote
The entry-level Pentax FF will be K-02...
I think that would be one of the few ways Pentax could rope me into getting FF..
Anyway, I still won't hold my breath waiting for this. I would rather see we get one FF, but with no problems. No sensor stains, no mirror flop, no AF hesitation. I know this happens to all brands, but with FF, Pentax needs to make sure its damn near perfect..
08-16-2015, 05:09 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by quant2325 Quote
This makes sense from a marketing perspective, since Ricoh seems to value market share more than margins with the 645Z (it isn't like this segment adds much to the Ricoh bottom line).
Source? I suspect the 645Z is quite profitable, thank you very much.

I think you have it exactly backward. Canon and Nikon and Sony compete for market share at the expense of margin. That's their business model.

08-16-2015, 05:19 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Asahiflex Quote
Not if the two FF models differ from each other like night and day. A full specced K3-like FF camera would not compete in any way with a somewhat slower and less specced K-01-like FF model.
I don't think they are talking about a K-01 with a 24 megapixel full frame sensor (although that would make me happy). It is just a low end full frame/high end full frame -- D610 versus D810. It would make more sense to see a flagship full frame released with indication of a lower end full frame 3 or 4 months down the road. Logistically, it seems a lot for a company the size of Pentax to release two full frame cameras at the same time and be working on a whole lens line up for those cameras as well.

But I have no inside sources and am content to wait.
08-16-2015, 05:40 AM   #21
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Ricoh could do two full frame models, with the same body and same sensor, same application processor, with firmware limitation for the cheaper one, at nearly no extra development cost. One could be 24Mpixel decimated from 36 or 42Mpixels and base ISO100, and the other body could have the full resolution and iso50 unlocked. Since 24Mpixels or 36Mpixels cost about the same. In addition, the 24Mpixels limited camera would not need any OAA filter (better than Nikon D610/D750). So, it's actually very realistic that Ricoh would release two full frame cameras, priced between K-3 and 645Z, for instance $1900 (24Mpixels) and $2900 (36Mp or 42Mp).

Last edited by biz-engineer; 08-16-2015 at 05:51 AM.
08-16-2015, 06:54 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
I don't see why any company in its right mind would adopt this approach. Treating your customers like complete idiots is never a good strategy, particularly when you are targeting the most informed segment of your potential customers (those looking to purchase a FF). You'll alienate potential customers at both ends - buyers of the low model will ask why they can't have high end features when it would cost Ricoh literally nothing more to add them, while high end purchasers will ask why the heck they had to pay so much more for features that were already there but just hidden away on the low end model.
A lot of products are developed this way: that's what we call technology platforms. We don't reinvent the wheel, we reuse. As far as I understood, the 645Z uses the same AF as the K-3, nobody complained about that. Since the full frame camera is likely to sell in less quantities, because prices tend to increases and production quantities are dropping (market trend) , it would make perfectly sense if the Pentax full frame(s) would be firmware customized.

Last edited by biz-engineer; 08-16-2015 at 07:01 AM.
08-16-2015, 07:00 AM   #23
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We know that they are coming out with the FF body. We also know that they will be coming out with a new replacement for the crop body (K3/K3II). They will both be full featured, and the crop replacement will be due sometime in 2016 (probably the first half). I am guessing that something got confused in the translation somewhere. A second FF would be nice, but right now Ricoh/Pentax has their hands full with what they have.

Also, if you look at how Ricoh/Pentax has approached the feature relationship between the flagship (K3/K3II) and the "entry" line K50/K-S2, they have been pretty successful in terms of delivering a pretty full set of features with out really causing confusion and dismay - along with anger over who got what for what price. I would expect this to continue - regardless of what they do with the models that they bring out.

The one thing that I am still waiting for is a decent reliable tethering capability that would work. How long has it been since the K20? Now, that is just plain stupid and inexcusable.



08-16-2015, 08:35 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
they will be getting ripped off either in terms of capability or in price.
Well, you can have crippled hardware and software for the same price at Nikon. What if Ricoh could sell you a 24Mpixels FF at the price of a D610 or D750, and unlock it into a D810 in the future for an additional fee, when you want / or have the money, without having to purchase a new body ?
08-16-2015, 08:55 AM - 1 Like   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by zapp Quote
Now we are waiting for two FF cameras that do not exist yet....
Perhaps that means now we're gonna have to wait twice as long.
08-16-2015, 09:12 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by interested_observer Quote
How long has it been since the K20? Now, that is just plain stupid and inexcusable.
Hey what (wakes up), somethings changed? I'm still using K20d's... has there been newer models or something?
08-16-2015, 09:22 AM   #27
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I predicted this thread when I posted the rumour in the 3 rumors thread....
08-16-2015, 10:05 AM   #28
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You want see a FF before March 2016.
08-16-2015, 10:23 AM   #29
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Remember who we are dealing with here. We are talking about Pentax. The same company (well -Ricoh) that released the k10 and smashed the TIPA awards with its performance and innovation. They released the ist then waiting till it what the right time to go berserk and I am 100% sure they will do the same with FF. they will release one new body stacked with new technology and performance unlike any other on the market, show the world who that are again and then slowly release other models. Pentax are not behind and are not going to make a stupid move.
08-16-2015, 10:50 AM - 1 Like   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by zapp Quote
Now we are waiting for two FF cameras that do not exist yet.... it is gettng worse with announcements and story telling.
I am waiting for one FF camera that definitely exists (it's just not ready yet) .

---------- Post added 16-08-15 at 09:04 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Well, you can have crippled hardware and software for the same price at Nikon. What if Ricoh could sell you a 24Mpixels FF at the price of a D610 or D750, and unlock it into a D810 in the future for an additional fee, when you want / or have the money, without having to purchase a new body ?
It means Ricoh would sell D810-level hardware at D610/D750 prices, which would hurt their margins a lot (probably taking significant losses, but the most incredibly optimistic scenario is that of unnecessarily degraded margins).
And if after some time, some people would want to "transform" it into a D810-level camera... guess what: the hardware would be obsolete, Nikon would have a better D810 by then. So it's: pay now for a crippled camera, and later for an obsolete one

P.S. As a side note, Ricoh is considered "the most ethical company" by the Ethisphere Institute.
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