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06-28-2008, 06:49 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenyee Quote
We analyzed the FF lens issue already. They're not that many lenses away since a lot of the DA ones work on FF except for the ultralight zooms.
That said, I'm sure they will *ADD* FF eventually (my guess is within 2 years). This doesn't mean APS-C will go away...
What do you mean "work"?

The following definately would NOT work - at least not well enough to gain any performance advantage.

14, 21, 40, 70, 12-24, 16-45, 16-50, 50-135, 50-200, 55-300 - and some of these have edge performance issues on an APS sensor.....

So that leaves DFA 50 and 100 and DA* 200 and 300. Hardly what I would call "most".

06-28-2008, 01:35 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by *isteve Quote
What do you mean "work"?

The following definately would NOT work - at least not well enough to gain any performance advantage.

14, 21, 40, 70, 12-24, 16-45, 16-50, 50-135, 50-200, 55-300 - and some of these have edge performance issues on an APS sensor.....

So that leaves DFA 50 and 100 and DA* 200 and 300. Hardly what I would call "most".
AFAIK DA40 and DA70 are fine.
06-30-2008, 07:50 PM   #33
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The D700 is now official:

Nikon D700 : boîtier du D300, capteur plein format du D3 : 2800 euros - Focus Numérique

Although we might need benjikan to translate the page. Looks very large, especially with the battery grip attached. But knowing Nikon it will be quite comfortable to use. I do wonder why anyone would buy the D3 now. I fail to see $2000 worth extras in the D3 over the D700.

Translated via Bablefish:
"Remain the price. 2800 euros, naked case. A price which can appear an excessive bit, but Nikon probably benefits from its small advance on its competitors (Canon and Sony) to preserve an high price. The nearest arrival of competitor cases should probably cause a harmonization of the prices.

Another interesting point, Nikon D700 would be available as of the end of July"
I guess Pentax has no choice but to announce a FF camera this fall if they don't want to be left behind (again). If nothing else they shouldn't have an issue coming in well under Nikons price. I would be worried about the new Canon 5D though. It won't surprise me at all if the new 5D sports a $2,000 street price.
06-30-2008, 08:39 PM   #34
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Yep the rumors were true. its appeared on nikon netherlands website too
Nikon Nederland - D700

uk as well
http://www.europe-nikon.com/product/en_GB/products/broad/1627/overview.html

so now nikon has 2 FF cameras. canon has 2 as well. waiting for sony to relase their FF, they are slow. I guess not until photokina. then pentax/samsung will be the only ones using 35mm mount that doesnt have one.

06-30-2008, 10:30 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by Richard Day Quote
I guess it's inevitable!

It's obviously where the large boys (C, N & S) feel they need to concentrate, or (me being cynical!) that maybe Nikon aren't moving as many of the FF bodies as they thought and have to introduce a "cheapie" to move the inventory of their FF sensors!
Nikon has had no problem selling D3 cameras even at $5,000, but Nikon knows that it will need to have an "affordable" full frame, since the 5D is now $1,900 after rebate and the 5DMKII will be available soon at around the same price as the current model.

QuoteQuote:
I'm surprised that the long rumoured D3x hasn't surfaced as yet, as I know a few Nikon D2x shooters that aren't interested in going FF (i.e. with the D3) and are desperately waiting for that one. Maybe it's next from Nikon, or that Nikon will introduce a higher MP sensor D3 so that D2x shooters (with DX lenses) don't suffer a MP loss when using the cropped format.
Sony is producing a full frame sensor for the very first time. And it is higher resolution than the Nikon full frame, so it may have more technical difficulties. Nikon is going to use the Sony sensor so it has no control as to when that sensor may be ready.


QuoteQuote:
I think Photokina will spring a rash of new models as the makers all chase a bigger share of the market in an increasingly tough economic climate.

I believe that Canon are facing far tougher conditions than Pentax, due to the attack from Nikon, and an increasing degree from Sony, on their mid and top range models.

How Pentax will react to all of this, is anyones guess!
I think Pentax (or Hoya) would much rather be in Canon's shoes.
06-30-2008, 10:38 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
Outside of the extremely wealthy what kind of a person would pay $3000 for a camera body that may or may not produce noticeably better results instead of getting the entire kit I just listed? I have to think that is a very, very low number of people. I personally think that could be a very good reason for Pentax to hold off on full frame for the time being unless they can unleash as sub $2000 body.
Pentax has no choice but to wait for Samsung to finish designing the full frame sensor. When Samsung has finished its design and testing, Pentax will be able to compete with the other camera makers since it will now have a cheap source for full frame sensors. I would say a Pentax full frame could be announced in Photokina 08, and a working prototype could be displayed by PMA 09, and it will likely be shipped by the fall of 2009.
06-30-2008, 11:01 PM   #37
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Well they can use the Sony sensor when it comes out but something tells me they will avoid it if they can ...
06-30-2008, 11:05 PM   #38
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On a different note, this image shows part of why I want the K1D to have an integrated grip. Also worth mentioning is the loss of the rear shooting info lcd which I happen to relly like.



Some ppl complain the d3 is big and then they get a d300 or d700 with the grip and lo behold.

06-30-2008, 11:15 PM   #39
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Sure but you can remove the grip... that's the whole point.
07-01-2008, 12:52 AM   #40
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Now on dpreview with a hands-on preview Nikon D700 plus hands-on preview: Digital Photography Review
07-01-2008, 04:19 AM   #41
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Hope to see Samsung FF DSLR this year too.
07-01-2008, 04:49 AM   #42
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Hi all

Having seen the photo of the forthcoming Nikon D700, IMHO it's simply too damned BIG yet again ! Just one more monstrosity to lug around, but I'm sure it'll be simply ideal for F1 racing drivers as they apparently have necks like tree-trunks, due to extreme G-forces they encounter on the track ! Erm, thanks, but NO THANKS if you get my
meaning and I just pray that Pentax don't follow this clumsy design route when they eventually go Full Frame courtesy of Samsung !

Best regards
Richard
07-01-2008, 05:00 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Art Vandelay II Quote
Unless someone has way, way, way too much spare time on their hand's to do some serious Photoshop work this one looks legit.

Specs:

* FX Format
* 12.1 Megapixel CMOS Sensor
* EXPEED Image Processor
* 14 bit A/D Conversion
* 16 bit Image Processing
* Magnesium Alloy Body
* Compatible with MB-D10 Battery Grip

I still think Nikon is screwing up by *only* using a 12 megapixel FF sensor. Canon has had a 12 megapixel FF sensor in the 5D for 3 years now, and the popular rumor is it will be replaced with a 16 megapixel version this fall. I know 12 megapixels is more than enough for 99% of most users, but people dropping $3k on a camera body tend to be pros that need all the resolution they can get. Besides, 12 megapixel APS-C sensors are just fine. IMO the only worthwhile reason to go FF is to get higher resolution noise-free images.

12 megapixel D300 + $1200 worth of glass or 12 megapixel D700 without a lens. That's a no brainer for me.
I totally agree with you. I need megapixels for my work and a 12 megapixel camera although being a FF is not what I would consider news breaking. If it was a 16+ MP camera yes, but this is not the case.

Ben
07-01-2008, 05:47 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Sure but you can remove the grip... that's the whole point.
I second that. I'd much rather have the option to remove the grip. I especially like how Pentax integrates theirs on the K10D/20D. Without grip = smallish portable well made camera. With grip = extremely comfortable camera for serious use. I personally would never buy a camera with a built in grip. If I did nothing but studio photography then I wouldn't mind a built in grip, but unfortunately I haven't done any studio work since college.
07-01-2008, 07:13 AM   #45
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The best move for Hoya/Samsung is to make FF camera on the base of K20D with the same processor and functionality only with new sensor and with a bit changed body...
It could be only 3-4 fps and 1/4000. With price lower than 2000 USD. It could be hit!!!
But...No hopes and no rumors from Pentax.
Sony will has A900, Nikon has D3 and D700, Canon - Mark3 and 5D (and it will be new one to change 5D with more MP)...Pentax (Samsung) - ???
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