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09-18-2015, 11:06 AM   #226
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QuoteOriginally posted by btnapa Quote
Steve, don't tempt me man!!

If I had not switched from Canon two or so years ago, I would have given the Sony switch a serious thought. All I want is a reasonably priced FF giving me nice hi-res stills. If I did serious video, I would have switched to Sony already. Plus I like my Three Amigos. I get a kick out of what I get with them every time I pick up the K3 and one of those babies. Yes they will work on the A7 series cameras along with the few Pentax 645 lenses I have. For the sake of nostalgia and the fact that I cut my teeth on a Pentax MX (which I loved), I am going to sit tight for now.

Pentax, Ricoh, someone out there in Denver, are you guys listening to what is going on here on PF. We are trying hard not to go to greener pastures! Don't tempt us. We have pledged our allegiance. Don't try so hard to disappoint us!

09-18-2015, 11:06 AM   #227
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QuoteOriginally posted by Foxbat Quote
From similar thread on another forum:

I seldom post but regularly visit (mainly to be amused by you guys tying each other in knots)


Back of camera shot missing and an alleged missing aperture stop-down lever (original post now missing}

How about an electronic lever
Position 1 allows traditional stop-down (electronically rather than mechanically)
Position 2 allows the camera to stop-down automatically only when the shutter button is released (or indeed half pressed)

Good-bye K mount legacy problems

09-18-2015, 11:16 AM   #228

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QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
That is my fear. Someone in PR headoffice could already see things happening that way... delay due to bad global sales and i.o. to try find some new shareholder, before eventual breakdown.
Ah, no! If they were looking for new shareholder they would introduce the FF now with a 24Mp sensor, finished or not, like they did with K-5 in order to show good numbers and create good condition for a financial deal.
Looking for new shareholder is not what I meant, it's the opposite. I explain: when a company need a complete re positioning , radical changes means that the company can afford catastrophic financial figure during the time of a turnaround. Just to illustrate this, some companies get out of the stock market during a 2 years time frame necessary to realign the company without having to report quarterly financial results and forecasts to the financial markets. So, if they afford to bring their finances to the ground (as long as they have enough cash to pay their bills), it is likely a turnaround move, i.e repositioning the company, in order to survive in the future. Radical changes imply more risk, it's a bet, if the turnaround works, then fine, otherwise, it's bankrupt. More specifically, if the new Pentax FF is a big success, it will restore Ricoh's imaging division profitability for a while, but if the Pentax FF sales are sluggish, below break-even (only a few buy it), that's gonna be the end.
09-18-2015, 11:32 AM   #229

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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Well, that nearly always the case that something does not work as expected and need to be reworked, that is including in development and release plannings. So either yes, there were more problems than normal problems.... or IMO, they messed around with the K-S2 and K-3II stuff, and they started FF developments too late. As for the belief that they have worked 3 or 4 years on the FF camera, it just not true, simply because if they used a 42Mp sensor, this sensor was not qualified 4 years ago, and if they developed the FF since 2012, the FF would have a old sensor, not competitive.
You are assuming too much. They might have started the design years ago expecting to use one sensor. Development took longer than planned, for whatever reason, and they later decided the original sensor was too old to release in a new camera. Swapping the design to a newer sensor could have triggered other design changes that added to project delays, hence the new Spring 2016 estimate.

I am not claiming that this is what happened but it's a reasonable possibility. Major companies don't share their internal details so we'll likely never know the full story.

09-18-2015, 11:34 AM   #230
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QuoteOriginally posted by btnapa Quote
Thanks for the heads up.

As I mentioned, I am in no hurry. Pentax, in addition to being a nice (almost complete) system overall, it has always offered value the others have not been able to match. A 36-42MP FF camera priced in the $2,200-2,500 range will be a deal no one has been able to offer yet. As was the K3 value proposition.

Now if the new body has some bells and whistles no one else has, that would be the icing on the cake. But a pure FF still image making machine, priced in the low $2K range would be a camera worth waiting a little longer for.
You sounded like you need FF now in the other post, not me, unless of course you are joking.
09-18-2015, 11:56 AM   #231

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Now, if we google "Pentax Full Frame", the "2016 Spring debut" has propagated like fire, everywhere it is written, even on the front page of Dpreview. On the same page , there's a firmware update announcement of Nikon. Publishing a teaser like that creates great advertising outside of Pentaxian universe, and it's free. This teaser is a free advertising compared to the act of releasing a real camera, but the problem of a teaser versus real camera is that the teaser does not make any money.
09-18-2015, 12:01 PM   #232
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QuoteOriginally posted by btnapa Quote
Steve, don't tempt me man!!

If I had not switched from Canon two or so years ago, I would have given the Sony switch a serious thought.
I looked at the A7 at a local store before buying my K-3 and might have bit except that the EVF gave me an immediate headache and spell of vertigo. I am not kidding!


09-18-2015, 12:02 PM   #233

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QuoteOriginally posted by Daikokuya Quote
Not funny.
No delivery.
No camera.
No future.
09-18-2015, 12:02 PM   #234
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QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
Major companies don't share their internal details so we'll likely never know the full story
True enough, although there are signs this very recent turn of events caught many people at Ricoh off-guard.
QuoteOriginally posted by DeadJohn Quote
they later decided the original sensor was too old to release in a new camera
This is highly unlikely. Contracts with Sony would have been signed in 2014 based on firm engineering specs, budgets were set for all of the necessary engineering work to implement the contracted sensor and penalties would be in place if Sony failed to deliver on its promises. In the same way, you don't put all of that investment on hold, just because Sony says they might have a better sensor to offer.

My best guess is that there is a significant design flaw on Ricoh's part, that only came to light after testing of fully functional prototypes. If there was a reasonable chance to fix it within three months, the prototypes would be on display (disabled if need be) along with publishing the final specs, to build up confidence with distributors and end users. At this point, I doubt if anyone at Ricoh knows with reasonable certainty what is required to fix the FF camera and what little is being said right now is just trying to avoid admitting to a major setback until Ricoh has the necessary information to determine whether or not to continue with the FF project. This "delay" is very costly, not just in terms of lost sales, but also in terms of having to re-do everything, from engineering to marketing, for a project that may have been borderline on meeting Ricoh's internal ROI guidelines in the first place.
09-18-2015, 12:03 PM   #235
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This whole thing is sad.. Even tho this makes me kinda thinking about two upcoming FFs (42 and 24mp) and some (new) lenses likely 24-70/2.8 etc being avaible in spring 2016.
09-18-2015, 12:07 PM   #236
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More time to save money
09-18-2015, 12:12 PM   #237
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The only thing that we can expect from all this delay "new features" thing is that the upcoming FF HAVE TO BE VERY VER VERY GOOD, and that could be a great thing for us.. the bad part? well.. we all had hopes to have the FF box under our Xmas trees and now that wont happen.. perhaps some new lenses could be release from now to xmas??

About the Kmount mods i dont think that they will make big changes with it.. that means a totally.. TOTALLY new system that wont help at all.. that could mean that we are all starting from 0.. and in that case many of us could go to a brand that can give us more.. at this time what i think is that they need to give some info soon, they need to keep the people excited about the release with some news, because if they dont do it, and Xmas coming... more switchers will go to another FF system.
09-18-2015, 12:16 PM - 1 Like   #238
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I'm going to guess that Ricoh doesn't see this "delay" as a problem. We are dealing with a large and intelligent Japanese company and like most Japanese companies they probably have very long term plans that stretch 10 to 20 years. They have a patience we sorely lack. What's a few months here and there?
09-18-2015, 12:21 PM   #239
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I really hope that they know what they are doing. Releasing info that a ff will be out in late 2015 and then putting it forward so much makes me think too that they have lost a lot of sales.

---------- Post added 09-18-15 at 12:29 PM ----------

To mention however, judging from the image on the Ricoh website, the FF shape looms somewhat more ergonomic with respect to the original mock up shown in February.
09-18-2015, 12:33 PM   #240
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Ok, so the FF is coming in 2016.
I'm ready for a "bone" in throw me one.

For my K3, how about...

1080p clean HDMI out.
Tweak the bit rate a bit.

Those three could get me to the spring.

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