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10-07-2015, 12:20 PM   #871
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tom S. Quote
Having more than a passing knowledge of Japanese quick change assembly line processes, I'll stand by my original statement. In fact, I strongly suspect this repair work will not impact the current line process at all, only the labor needed to do the actual work. As for your last paragraph, I'm lost at what you're trying to convey as parts of it don't seem to make sense.
Stupid to say but isn't the actual units made in philipines, not Japan? Also are you sure they can find the required labor? Also you speak general of Japan assembly lines. You mean for cameras? Consumer good in general? Vehicules? Then do you know Pentax/Ricoh and their own efficiancy for that? Are they bellow average? faster? slower?

Do you know exactly what the problem is? What the fix involve?


Last edited by Nicolas06; 10-07-2015 at 12:32 PM.
10-07-2015, 12:22 PM   #872
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Just assimilating all this new information from Kenspro this morning.

With regard to the K3II recall and impact on the Pentax FF - if the K3II issue required circuit board or component redesign and update for the fix, then it is reasonable to assume that the Pentax FF might have been using the same design (or very similar) in the same component areas.

If that assumption is valid, then once Ricoh had completed the design updating, testing and replacement for the K3II then they would need to do the same for the Pentax FF - which would more than adequately explain the delay. They would probably also then use the delay to integrate some features that had just missed the earlier design cut.

I would much rather they shipped the FF well tested and working, not with known or potential problems that have bled up from earlier designs and models.

I am certainly looking forward to the spec release
10-07-2015, 12:30 PM   #873
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Honestly we can dislike what normhead say but he is right.

We have proof that at least one time kenspo communicated plainly wrong information. maybe not his fault, still doesn't mean the information is more reliable. Also he is also under contract by Ricoh so his not neutral in this game.

On Ricoh side, they don't have to give any reason and if they communicate on it, they can say what they want, lie or filter and really we wouldn't know. The reality can really be dismissed by some while a good lie could be accepted as to be likely the truth.

The more people feel like they are insider with privilegied information and the more they think they know about the subject, the more likely they are to be confident in their own deduction without necessarily more accurate.

Now really why do we ever care? It will not change anything anyway. Real information is there delay. How much we will not know until it is actually released.

The wording itself is a strong indication: "Spring" is not something precise.

Last edited by Nicolas06; 10-07-2015 at 12:43 PM.
10-07-2015, 12:33 PM - 1 Like   #874
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^ overanalysis. People investing $millions in Ricoh stock don't scrutinize things so much

10-07-2015, 12:44 PM   #875
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
We have proof that at least one time kenspo communicated plainly wrong information.
I'm unaware of that and would like to make it explicit that at no time I was intending to suggest that kenspo cannot be trusted. On the contrary, I trust him and if he has been wrong in the past then probably just because Pentax just changed their mind mid-course.

QuoteOriginally posted by NZ_Ross Quote
I would much rather they shipped the FF well tested and working, not with known or potential problems that have bled up from earlier designs and models.

I am certainly looking forward to the spec release
+1
10-07-2015, 01:01 PM   #876
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QuoteOriginally posted by Class A Quote
I'm unaware of that and would like to make it explicit that at no time I was intending to suggest that kenspo cannot be trusted. On the contrary, I trust him and if he has been wrong in the past then probably just because Pentax just changed their mind mid-course.
The release date of the FF remind you of something? It shifted to 2016. Before was said to be fall 2015. What ever the reason the practical implication is not all what kenspo say will actually be accurate.

Not to say that kenspo is a bad guy but the past track record is not a 100% success rate, whatever the reason. I don't blame him at all, delays happen all the time in many companies for many things. But the experience show that he has been wrong at least one time already. He could be wrong another time. And really I wouldn't blame him. But that would not make him more accurate.

He say to be under contract with Ricoh. To me then he has a personnal interrest on top of legal obligations... It doesn't make him the most neutral source of information in town neither.

And no I have nothing again kenspo or Ricoh but there a difference between that and being being blindy faithful in what will hapen to the exact delivery date of Pentax FF. There too many variables involved here.

Last edited by Nicolas06; 10-07-2015 at 01:07 PM.
10-07-2015, 01:16 PM   #877
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
The release date of the FF remind you of something? It shifted to 2016. Before was said to be fall 2015. What ever the reason the practical implication is not all what kenspo say will actually be accurate.
Hold your horses; until recently the official information, straight from Ricoh Imaging was that the FF will be announced this year. Kenspo saying (more or less) the same was accurate, at that time.
Unless you think he should have predicted the future, and know about the postponement before even Ricoh Imaging did.

And the stuff about having "a personal interrest"... oh, boy. Don't be an uluru; he's trying to make us a service, because he can understand our impatience.

Last edited by Kunzite; 10-07-2015 at 01:26 PM.
10-07-2015, 01:20 PM   #878
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
The release date of the FF remind you of something? It shifted to 2016. Before was said to be fall 2015. What ever the reason the practical implication is not all what kenspo say will actually be accurate.

Not to say that kenspo is a bad guy but the past track record is not a 100% success rate, whatever the reason. I don't blame him at all, delays happen all the time in many companies for many things. But the experience show that he has been wrong at least one time already. He could be wrong another time. And really I wouldn't blame him. But that would not make him more accurate.

He say to be under contract with Ricoh. To me then he has a personnal interrest on top of legal obligations... It doesn't make him the most neutral source of information in town neither.

And no I have nothing again kenspo or Ricoh but there a difference between that and being being blindy faithful in what will hapen to the exact delivery date of Pentax FF. There too many variables involved here.
No one here blindly believeing anything here, unless it might have been you.

Sorry if you got sucked in, I didn't.


Last edited by normhead; 10-07-2015 at 01:29 PM.
10-07-2015, 01:28 PM   #879
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote

As if Ricoj said it all, for me they should not. We already prooved we are not mature enough for that. To me they should provide the minimum information to have us child stay more or less silent.

????
10-07-2015, 01:34 PM   #880
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
Spoke to Pentax today. It is the callback of all the K-3 II's that is the reason for the delay. The production line can't handle both the callback and the production of the FF. The FF is ready and specs are finished. Will start production as soon as the K-3 II issue is fixed.

And now i'll quote myself. Post # 501 of this very same thread:

QuoteQuote:
According to Pentaxeros admin, the reason of the delay is lack of production capacity created because of the K3II recall (cameras with some kind of switch off problem)
10-07-2015, 01:35 PM   #881
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i think ricoh will redesign the camera body to includ a built in flash.
the lack of built in flash in k3ii gave them a negative feedback.
the delay is to change the design not to chose a new sensor.
and these are my thoughts.
10-07-2015, 01:54 PM - 4 Likes   #882
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After Hoya's raping of Pentax, people need to understand, that the production line with Pentax, is down to a minimum. They have no chance to produce as much as other brands..yet! I asked if i could share this info today, they said it has been cleared higher up in the chain. So take it the way you want. I just want to share what i can, but if people start getting at me for the info, i dont gain anything by sharing, so no stress for me to not share anymore. Like it or not, but dont shoot the messenger! Now back to read about the FF specs!

---------- Post added 10-07-15 at 10:55 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by zmohie Quote
i think ricoh will redesign the camera body to includ a built in flash.
No, they wont!
10-07-2015, 02:07 PM - 2 Likes   #883
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QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote


No, they wont!
And imho they are right to do so.
10-07-2015, 02:11 PM   #884
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I was going in for a sleep...but this conversation has got me still looking...my god. Camera company tried it's best to repair product and is making a very new one at same time. Perhaps this camera-line is not as fast as every one thinks. Or is here so many experts that can tell how long it takes to get back faulty cameras, Set up a line for those and repair them. Send them back. Then prepair a line for new model. Make sure that everything is in order and them make perfect models which are precicelly made. Programming computer for robots...

No, that makes a Kenspro as a liar! Some one want's to get back to him...lol.

Thanks Kenspo for info.
10-07-2015, 02:12 PM - 1 Like   #885
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QuoteOriginally posted by Class A Quote
(...)

I just remembered that the first reason we were given was not an official bulletin from Ricoh, or was it? If the first reason ("more features") was just an unofficial rumour then everything is fine.

Perhaps Ricoh is sometimes handing out different information at different places to see where the leaks are?
QuoteOriginally posted by Class A Quote
(...)

still don't know where the first explanation came from.

(...)
From some forum member named kenspo:
QuoteOriginally posted by kenspo Quote
Pentax answer on the question around being behind schedule:

"No, we are on schedule. But we have decided to enrich some functions and specifications furthermore to satisfy our customers.
We are expecting different launching schedule from previous announcement considering the time we need to develop."
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