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09-18-2015, 01:43 PM   #16
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How about two bodies, first one with the 42MP for the landscape/studio crowd and the other with the 12MP high ISO high FPS etc for the sports/bird/moving insect crowd? They're making sure that 70-200 can refocus at 15FPS.... Dreams are good...

09-18-2015, 02:06 PM   #17
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5. Troubles getting image/data processing pipeline working to desired spec: Fujitsu sold their Milbeaut image processor line last March - price/availability issue? The latest Milbeaut processor maxes out at 12 fps for a 12M px image and its architecture is not amenable to parallel processing like Canon's DIGIC iirc. Fast enough for a 42M px sensor? Difficulty getting their (couple of generation behind state of art) AF algorithms to run fast enough with increased number of points and integration with larger exposure meter expected for FF?
09-18-2015, 02:33 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by cfraz Quote
5. Troubles getting image/data processing pipeline working to desired spec: Fujitsu sold their Milbeaut image processor line last March - price/availability issue? The latest Milbeaut processor maxes out at 12 fps for a 12M px image and its architecture is not amenable to parallel processing like Canon's DIGIC iirc. Fast enough for a 42M px sensor? Difficulty getting their (couple of generation behind state of art) AF algorithms to run fast enough with increased number of points and integration with larger exposure meter expected for FF?
That is a very good point. Who knows of course but the digital processor(s) in cameras are becoming more and more important and are often overlooked when folks talk about specs. The amount of processing required for a 42 mpx unit with a gazillion focus points etc is huge.
09-18-2015, 02:46 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
But APS-C lens users might. I suspect this is what they found to be worthy of delay - that resolution in crop sensor mode on their new flagship didn't match up to native APS-C on the K-3 or K-3-II, so they had to go one better and delay accordingly.

I suspect that Ricoh are allowed to possess the sensor now and have probably had it for some time (how easy is it to go out and buy the relevant Sony camera?). So integration of the new sensor in hardware and firmware is probably either proceeding or already complete for field tests; they just aren't allowed to sell cameras featuring it until the agreement expires.
This. The resolution on a K-3 is very nice, it crops very well. Going full frame and losing resolution knowing that cropping is going to be even more necessary is not attractive.

I suspect the spec needed to be changed in response to the change in the market. Why did they pull back the 70-200? It just wasn't good enough.

Or, on second thought, the toughest challenge of all getting the software ready. It isn't hard during testing to run into a portion of your code that simply needs a rewrite. Often it can be fixed to good enough with intention of the firmware update being the fix, but I don't think they can afford to do it especially if it has to do with AF or other critical performance area.

Or on third thought, reading the rumour that Samsung is pulling out of the camera business made everyone take a second look. It isn't quite finished, not quite good enough. The reality of the business is that the first enthusiasm is what sticks. How many Sony bodies haven't been sold because of the compression algorithm? How many K3II's were not sold because of the recall?

Or on fourth thought. Remember the flucard being delayed by months? There were a number of things, a third party supplier, heat generation. I posited at the time that a Ricoh executive called in a product manager with a body and the card in retail packaging, handed his phone to him and said "show me". The meeting ended soon thereafter with a chastened manager with a new delivery date. Maybe the product manager showed up to a desk covered with Sony, Nikon and Canon products and lenses, and the executive took the body and took a picture with each one. Pentax default settings are not optimum, in fact suck. Or asked how do I get the shot from my office window to my granddaughter?

09-18-2015, 03:59 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by grahame Quote
That is what they said: originally pentax planned to use 36 mp sensor, now wanted to use 42 mp

I want 24 mp! I don't need to print 5 ft, and I don't need intensive crop. If I do, I use APC camera. 42 MP sensor will show all the imperfects of old lenses.
... Or they'll show the imperfects of NEW lenses !!!
09-18-2015, 04:52 PM - 1 Like   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by GordonZA Quote
How about two bodies
That would have been a good idea - a 24 MP, pretty conventional and affordable D750 clone goes out first, followed by a 42 MP wonder camera with all the latest tech.

Gets the wagon train rolling, spreads the risk, broadens the revenue stream. As it stands, it seems they have put all their FF eggs in one basket.
09-18-2015, 05:10 PM   #22
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Surprise! The surprise surprised them.

FWIW, I think the finance guys said no at the last minute.
09-18-2015, 06:23 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
That would have been a good idea - a 24 MP, pretty conventional and affordable D750 clone goes out first, followed by a 42 MP wonder camera with all the latest tech.

Gets the wagon train rolling, spreads the risk, broadens the revenue stream. As it stands, it seems they have put all their FF eggs in one basket.
No, I think it makes more sense for the flagship product to come out first. Otherwise everyone gobbles up the low end version just to have the FF and there's nobody left to buy the biggie.

09-19-2015, 03:37 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
But APS-C lens users might. I suspect this is what they found to be worthy of delay - that resolution in crop sensor mode on their new flagship didn't match up to native APS-C on the K-3 or K-3-II, so they had to go one better and delay accordingly.
people who buy ff cameras don't spend big $$$ just to turn around and cripple their photos with crop mode.

if you ever do step up to ff, you'll see that crop shooting is the last thing that you'll want to do.

---------- Post added 09-19-15 at 03:45 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by derekkite Quote
I suspect the spec needed to be changed in response to the change in the market.
that makes more sense... perhaps pentax started out with a 36mp sensor, without knowing that canon was coming out with 50mp, sony had 42mp, nikon was coming out with who knows what...

24mp ff would have been a loser for pentax, it was never an option... they want to compete in ff just like they do with mf... you can see their corporate attitude with the 645z, it's a solid performer at a low price point.

they want to do the same thing with ff that they did with mf... but the game is a lot harder with ff, largely because of sony.

Last edited by osv; 09-19-2015 at 03:45 PM.
09-19-2015, 04:02 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Surprise! The surprise surprised them.

FWIW, I think the finance guys said no at the last minute.
Somebody definitely slammed the brakes at the last minute, read the report made by fellow member Zygonyx in another thread:
QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
I can't explain why, although i am a rather "good customer" of "Images Photos - La boutique Pentax" in Paris, having bought there the two last K-mount zooms since last year (16-85 and 150-450), but i recieved a phone call this morning from them.
They seemed aware of potential damage for Pentax sales following yesterday "delay teasing", and seemed keen to reinsure their customers.
They told me that the delay decision is recent - the official announcement was effectively due to be made next october 6th.
They added the K mount FF would be a really good and interesting product, worth waiting until it hits the shelves ; and that it would "not be a simple big sensor K-3II" in the sense that it would have more features.
Finally, they told me there would be more teasing to come re. this product ; and that we should probably have more news before end of 2015.

Nota : these people do sell exclusively Pentax brand photo products ; they are independent from Ricoh. But generally well informed, and often THE very first seller in France for brand new gear, or detender of pre-production stuff (that has been the case for the two last DFA zooms, and they had the DFA70-200/2.8 pre-prod until very recently in store).
09-19-2015, 04:03 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by pathdoc Quote
No, I think it makes more sense for the flagship product to come out first. Otherwise everyone gobbles up the low end version just to have the FF and there's nobody left to buy the biggie.
This is probably true. I will never be able to justify purchasing a $3000 camera body, so I would sure wouldn't mind a Sony 24mp or 36mp FF sensor shoved into a K3 body sometime down the road if it means an affordable alternative. If they don't have enough room they could even do without the SR for all I care. My film cameras all work fine without SR...
09-19-2015, 05:25 PM   #27
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EDIT: Mistral75 is quoting Zygonyx from another thread below.
QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
"Zygonyx" >> They added the K mount FF would be a really good and interesting product, worth waiting until it hits the shelves ; and that it would "not be a simple big sensor K-3II" in the sense that it would have more features.
What additional features could they possibly add?*





*I blocked the other threads. Just too (whatever) to go there any more.

Last edited by monochrome; 09-19-2015 at 05:33 PM.
09-19-2015, 05:29 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
What additional features could they possibly add?*





*I blocked the other threads. Just too (whatever) to go there any more.
Hey, it's Zygonyx you are quoting, not me . He didn't write more in the other thread than what I copied here.
09-19-2015, 05:30 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
Hey, it's Zygonyx you are quoting, not me . He didn't write more in the other thread than what I copied here.
Oops. Quoting a Quote doesn't work right. My Bad - fixed it.
09-19-2015, 05:40 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
What additional features could they possibly add?
Beyond the K-3 II? On-board flash.
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