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10-16-2015, 10:18 AM   #106
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
In one corner there's "use the center of the 645 lens". On the other, the "Super FF Composit" you're talking about.
Can't you see the contradiction? If not, know that I'm a Nigerian prince and I want to share my wealth with you
I'm not saying I think it's true because of the slide (which looks fake to me), but it could be true (or partly true) because the technology exists, in spite of the fake slide.

10-16-2015, 12:28 PM   #107
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Ok... one of the things I don't want to do is to start serious "what if" discussions based on an obvious fake. Because it might impart the idea that fake can lead to good things. No, it's "garbage in, garbage out".

The idea of combining Composition Adjustment with Pixel Shift Resolution to increase the effective size of the captured image is not new. It has some merits - in theory - but in practice, it depends on how much you can move the sensor; because just adding a tiny border is not enough.
To reach 44x33mm - which is about the smallest digital medium format size - you'd need to move the sensor almost 1cm, horizontally and vertically. That, with no component (mirror box, mirrors, mount with it's ancillary equipment (e.g. aperture lever)...) interfering through mechanical vignetting. The K-mount was made for small format, and it's not the largest - can it support an unobstructed 44x33mm image? I doubt it; the difference is not small.

Actually 44x33mm is clearly larger than my ME Super's mirrorbox.

I'm quite sure we won't see it in the new camera.
10-16-2015, 12:37 PM   #108
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote

...

Actually 44x33mm is clearly larger than my ME Super's mirrorbox.

I'm quite sure we won't see it in the new camera.
Unless the upcoming FF has new a mirror box of some sort. In the end, we just don't know. All we know is we're having some fun guessing.
10-16-2015, 12:45 PM   #109
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Yes, a slightly larger mirror box is possible; however there are limits to such approach. The focusing screen (and thus the mirrors) can't be moved upwards. The bottom of the mirror box and thus the AF system might be moved downwards a bit, but is it enough? The mount has a fixed diameter, and there's the aperture lever sitting in the way.
Until a magical solution is presented, I'd rather trust my eyes and say that it can't be done.

10-16-2015, 12:49 PM   #110
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Or maybe it won't match a MF sized image but something in between? That could make it an attractive feature with less potential cannibalization of their 645D/Z customers. It could also get more 645 lenses in people's hands with the hope of them buying a body for them some time.

Again, not making a prediction, just wondering what if.
10-16-2015, 12:57 PM   #111
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Without a significant improvement, why bother? Making the camera larger than necessary, cumbersome feature as you can't view the entire captured frame at once (only partially, and only in live view...
Sorry, but we'll have to settle for just 36-42MP with Pixel Shift Resolution
10-16-2015, 01:05 PM   #112
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Yes, a slightly larger mirror box is possible; however there are limits to such approach. The focusing screen (and thus the mirrors) can't be moved upwards. The bottom of the mirror box and thus the AF system might be moved downwards a bit, but is it enough? The mount has a fixed diameter, and there's the aperture lever sitting in the way.
Until a magical solution is presented, I'd rather trust my eyes and say that it can't be done.
What if the mirror didn't move? It could be a variably translucent mirror and be fixed in position.
10-16-2015, 01:10 PM   #113
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Without a significant improvement, why bother? Making the camera larger than necessary, cumbersome feature as you can't view the entire captured frame at once (only partially, and only in live view...
Sorry, but we'll have to settle for just 36-42MP with Pixel Shift Resolution
I could probably settle for that.

10-16-2015, 02:36 PM   #114
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QuoteOriginally posted by 6BQ5 Quote
What if the mirror didn't move? It could be a variably translucent mirror and be fixed in position.
The focusing screen will still have to stay in its position.
10-16-2015, 02:39 PM   #115
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The focusing screen will still have to stay in its position.

True. But what if ...
10-16-2015, 03:09 PM   #116
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The focusing screen will still have to stay in its position.
Does it? If you move the mirror forward you should be able (and required) to move the focusing screen up.

(And if the mirror doesn't move you can move it forward.)
10-16-2015, 03:16 PM   #117
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QuoteOriginally posted by 6BQ5 Quote
True. But what if ...
What if the camera comes with a gnome, that fits in the trunk/boot of your car, and pops out and sets up your lighting equipment whenever you push a button on the steering wheel (indicating you are getting out to take a photo).

I think this has as much potential to occur as to what you are currently suggesting.
10-16-2015, 03:17 PM   #118
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
If not, know that I'm a Nigerian prince and I want to share my wealth with you
Hey - you're that guy who sold me the Brooklyn Bridge! I never received my title, and I waited all night in that lousy pumpkin patch! ... Should I send more money?
10-16-2015, 03:42 PM - 1 Like   #119
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oh boy this is a bad fake ... cant believe some of us believed this stuff. when I ask my 10 year old nephew to make a ricoh-looking presentation he could do better
10-16-2015, 03:48 PM   #120
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QuoteOriginally posted by THoog Quote
Hey - you're that guy who sold me the Brooklyn Bridge! I never received my title, and I waited all night in that lousy pumpkin patch! ... Should I send more money?
Sorry... there were some rust points so I decided to clean them and repaint the bridge before giving you the title. Unfortunately I'm out of paint, so please, do send more money

QuoteOriginally posted by 6BQ5 Quote
True. But what if ...
I'm afraid I have to ask you to prove that it can be done, instead of endlessly attempt to prove you that it can't - for every idea you (or someone else) might have

QuoteOriginally posted by drougge Quote
Does it? If you move the mirror forward you should be able (and required) to move the focusing screen up.

(And if the mirror doesn't move you can move it forward.)
Oh, great. More conditions to satisfy in order to make it work.
In fact it's:
- having to use a fixed mirror (which will steal light from the imaging sensor, unless they manage to implement the variable transmission mirror idea).
- the 'pellicle' mirror might introduce defects in the resulting image (IIRC Sony SLTs had such issues).
- the fixed mirror frame would introduce mechanical vignetting, and a resign where you could easily remove the mirror (for cleaning the sensor) requires such a frame. And it puts restrictions on the mirror's size.
- no secondary mirror to send light to a dedicated AF system, which means no dedicated AF system. Bye-bye excellent low-light AF capabilities.
- viewfinder prism and everything around it moved forward, viewfinder optics extended
And it still won't be enough.

Last edited by Kunzite; 10-16-2015 at 03:55 PM.
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