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10-26-2015, 03:22 AM - 1 Like   #481
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QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
The Pentax FF is going to be aimed at serious photographers, much like the D810 or 5D cameras.
That is what i have been trying to say for a long time. This first FF, is mostly aimed at pros and serious photographers!

10-26-2015, 03:52 AM - 1 Like   #482
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I think it doesn't change much. We don't really know how close to release this camera is (Spring 2016 is just as far away as it was before the photo show) and we don't know how close to a finished product this pre release camera is (seems pretty close). For die hard Pentaxians, it is a little bone thrown our direction to keep us interested, but to folks who own other brands, there is certainly little here that would make them start saving up for a camera in a different mount.
We only seem to register those who migrate from Pentax to other brands, and rarely note when it happens the other way around. We also have no way of knowing what the migration rate is between other brands. If we all paid a bit more attention to welcoming new members here, we might notice that, even without a current 35FF body, there's enough in the current range to attract migrants from other brands and formats, and they're only the ones who tell about us about it.

I suspect the churn rate might be higher than people think, even if the numbers aren't enormous.

As for the mooted new Pentax 35FF, we'll have to wait and see how attractive it is to potential movers and returners. We don't even know its specs or features yet, so it's a bit early to start writing it off.
10-26-2015, 04:01 AM   #483
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
there is certainly little here that would make them start saving up for a camera in a different mount.
Agreed. If shifting [high-value] users from other mounts is Ricoh's goal, this clumsy 'reveal' hasn't helped much. It looks like a stumble, not the start of a marketing and outreach campaign.
10-26-2015, 04:57 AM   #484
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
I just got through reading "Luminous Landscapes" very lengthy, two-part review of the Photo Plus Expo 2015 in NY, NY, USA. This is the very same show that the full frame photos found at the start of this thread were taken.

I believe that LuLa is the largest photography website on the Internet. Their Expo articles reviewed dozens of new products that were shown at this show. Everything from cameras to straps to printing papers. But there was not one mention of the Pentax Full Frame camera!

This oversight is a bit of a surprise to me, because in the past, LuLa was a fan of Pentax medium format digital cameras.

The unveiling of the full frame at Photo Plus Expo is certainly a big topic of discussion here on this blog. Why is it that the non-Pentax centered internet photography websites are treating it as a non-event?
Actually Day One was Thursday, I was there Wednesday night for the test drive and it didn't look at all like that first picture he posted.
They still had stuff in boxes and the place was literally a mess with companies setting up. He also didn't show anything from Samsung, Olympus or Fuji who were all pretty close to the Ricoh set-up. I was lucky enough to see the FF Pentax Thursday morning since the minute they let us in, I made a bee-line to the Ricoh booth.
PDN Photo Plus Expo 2015 photographs for all three days I took can be viewed here: https://flic.kr/s/aHsknGAXsy

10-26-2015, 05:37 AM   #485
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QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
We only seem to register those who migrate from Pentax to other brands, and rarely note when it happens the other way around. We also have no way of knowing what the migration rate is between other brands. If we all paid a bit more attention to welcoming new members here, we might notice that, even without a current 35FF body, there's enough in the current range to attract migrants from other brands and formats, and they're only the ones who tell about us about it.

I suspect the churn rate might be higher than people think, even if the numbers aren't enormous.

As for the mooted new Pentax 35FF, we'll have to wait and see how attractive it is to potential movers and returners. We don't even know its specs or features yet, so it's a bit early to start writing it off.
I feel like folks that aren't "invested" in a lot of glass swap brands pretty easily. Not a big deal to go from a K30 and kit lens to a D5200 with a kit lens, but a lot bigger deal if you own a D750 and 70-200 f2.8 and some primes to sell those and swap over.

I have always felt that it is better to build a base -- get people to buy in to your entry level and then hopefully as they move up they will buy more expensive glass and bodies.
10-26-2015, 07:06 AM   #486
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
Not a big deal to go from a K30 and kit lens to a D5200 with a kit lens, but a lot bigger deal if you own a D750 and 70-200 f2.8 and some primes to sell those and swap over.
In my country the Pentax SH market is very very poor as compared to CaNikon. Selling a D750, a 70-200 and some primes could be easier than selling some cheaper Pentax body and lens.

I only have 2 lenses right now and a K5IIs. I will relocate to Norway in a shortwhile so I was considering getting a D810 and a 14-24 to capture those landscapes...unfortunatelly I have broken my leg, so I won't be able to do much hiking till summer anyway... why not wait for the Pentax FF? Besides I'm curious to see how Sigma 35mm 1.4 will perform.
10-26-2015, 07:14 AM   #487
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QuoteOriginally posted by Hattifnatt Quote
In my country the Pentax SH market is very very poor as compared to CaNikon. Selling a D750, a 70-200 and some primes could be easier than selling some cheaper Pentax body and lens.

I only have 2 lenses right now and a K5IIs. I will relocate to Norway in a shortwhile so I was considering getting a D810 and a 14-24 to capture those landscapes...unfortunatelly I have broken my leg, so I won't be able to do much hiking till summer anyway... why not wait for the Pentax FF? Besides I'm curious to see how Sigma 35mm 1.4 will perform.
Yes.

I currently own the new DFA 24-70, FA 31, DA 40, DA *55, FA 77, DFA 100, and DA *200, all of which are full frame compatible. The only thing I would want at this point to go full frame would be a 20-ish mm prime (I'm not interested in telephoto lenses at all).

Selling those and getting a similar set up in Canon or Nikon would be difficult.

My experience with selling Pentax gear has been good as long as I price it appropriately (I have sold everything through the forum). I would expect prices to go up at the time of the full frame release, as there will probably be an influx of new people interested in trying something new. Unfortunately, a lot of those folks will move because they are dissatisfied with their current gear and within a year or two will probably be unhappy with Pentax too.
10-26-2015, 07:45 AM - 1 Like   #488
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
The only thing I would want at this point to go full frame would be a 20-ish mm prime
They could always revive this one: SMC Pentax-FA 20mm F2.8 Reviews - FA Prime Lenses - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database

10-26-2015, 08:07 AM   #489
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote
That would not be a bad idea.
10-26-2015, 08:36 AM   #490
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Nic shot of FF from behind

QuoteOriginally posted by Sportsgal501 Quote
Day One was Thursday, I was there Wednesday night for the test drive and it didn't look at all like that first picture he posted.
PDN Photo Plus Expo 2015 photographs for all three days I took can be viewed here: https://flic.kr/s/aHsknGAXsy
Nice clean shot, maybe the cleanest I've seen so far for this angle.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/sportsgal501/22211800188/in/album-72157660143730032/lightbox/


I have two thoughts, tho' not related to this poster.

I haven't seen video for the FF anywhere at least up 'til now... anyone seen anything clean enough to link to?

I've not seen a shot that clearly shows the left rear taken from behind, maybe nothing of interest for the effort to see. Was that side of the camera up near a wall and not easy to get behind?

TIA
10-26-2015, 10:07 AM - 1 Like   #491
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fenwoodian Quote
I believe that LuLa is the largest photography website on the Internet.
Sorry, but do you mean "largest" as in most pages(?), most content (?), most visitors (?), or it just fills the biggest screen?

Seriously, LuLa is only a bit more viewed/ popular than the very brand-focused site we are on! Yes, it's a small world of photo enthusiasts out there, but please don't ascribe too much importance to an expo report by one guy at LuLa. DPReview has a gallery of images (and lots of comments) on the Pentax FF prototype, and that site is, ahem, a bit "larger" (more viewed/read/popular) than LuLa.
10-26-2015, 10:46 AM   #492
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LuLa actually is quite enthusiastic about Pentax. One of the site owner, owns a 645z and made a quite thorough review. https://luminous-landscape.com/pentax-645z-in-depth-review/ He even retracted what he said in his initial impression review. Remember if you were a professional landscape photographer before digital you had a good chance of using MF. Im sure the value proposition of using 645 film era glass on a modern digital body with the best dynamic range of any sensor period, is a very tempting proposition for many landscape photographers and especially those who actually have 645 glass lying around somewhere.
10-26-2015, 12:53 PM   #493
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QuoteOriginally posted by solar1 Quote
I've not seen a shot that clearly shows the left rear taken from behind
If you look at these two shots [didn't note the source], you can pretty much see everything along the left side of the camera.



10-26-2015, 01:38 PM   #494
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QuoteOriginally posted by y0chang Quote
LuLa actually is quite enthusiastic about Pentax.
Not really.

Michael Reichmann did not understand the K-7 at all and he and Nick Devlin criticised the 645D for being too good a camera (that it wouldn't slow them down sufficiently). They also compared the 645D to a four-thirds Olympus and questioned where the big difference is.

IIRC, Reichmann also initially rejected the 645Z with a lukewarm review, i.e. it took him a while to realise that he wants to own a copy.

I don't like their premise of "subjective reviewing" which only appears to be a pretext to write opinion pieces that are sometimes more and sometimes less informed and typically just confirm prejudices. You can do the latter but just don't call it a review.

Plus, as history shows, Reichmann is not even consistent with his own opinion. Viewed positively he has demonstrated the ability to learn from mistakes. Viewed negatively, it makes his verdicts a bit arbitrary.

I wouldn't be surprised if he rejected the K-1 on the basis of "living in the past" and preferring the Sony A7R II on the basis that the latter does panoramas, or something stupid like that.

Last edited by Class A; 10-26-2015 at 02:03 PM.
10-26-2015, 01:54 PM   #495
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QuoteOriginally posted by Class A Quote

I don't like their premises of "subjective reviewing" which only appears to be a pretext to write opinion pieces that are sometimes more and sometimes less informed and typically just confirm prejudices. You can do the latter but just don't call it a review.

Plus, as history shows, Reichmann is not even consistent with his own opinion. Viewed positively he has demonstrated the ability to learn from mistakes. Viewed negatively, it makes his verdicts a bit arbitrary.

I wouldn't be surprised if he rejected the K-1 on the basis of "living in the past" and preferring the Sony A7R II on the basis that the latter does panoramas, or something stupid like that.
I agree that the site has a bunch of Post-purchase rationalization, trying to justify their latest shiny new toy. It is no different than any site that buys their own gear say Steve Huff, or lowest dreg of the dreg, Ken Rockwell. All reviews are subjective, even the most seemingly objective one. Yet, I appreciate actually seeing the camera in use, and taking more than static chart shots. I want to see what the camera is capable of producing, rather than comparing ISO or sharpness tests.
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