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11-11-2015, 08:52 PM   #331
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Nikkor aperture

Actually, pre-AI Nikkor lenses report the actual aperture with the fork. That feature was designed for a non through-the-lens meter.

AI Nikkor lenses use the tab to report the number of stops from fully open.

Later variants (AI-S?) added reporting of the full aperture as well.

Pentax lenses through M report the number of stops from fully open. The A lenses use the contact to report fully open. They also defined a new relationship of stop-down lever to aperture, so they could be used in shutter-priority mode.

11-11-2015, 10:14 PM   #332
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I had been browsing old MF wide-angle prime lenses. I did not actually count them, but my sense was that there were many more M42 and Pentax-M lenses than Pentax-A lenses, I wonder if this difference in ease of using these lenses on modern cameras explains the difference in availability.
11-11-2015, 11:56 PM   #333
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I had been browsing old MF wide-angle prime lenses. I did not actually count them, but my sense was that there were many more M42 and Pentax-M lenses than Pentax-A lenses, I wonder if this difference in ease of using these lenses on modern cameras explains the difference in availability.
Possibly, but Pentax was the leading brand in the days of the M42 mount with the Spotmatics, and the M series cameras sold pretty well, too.
11-15-2015, 04:15 PM   #334
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I had been browsing old MF wide-angle prime lenses. I did not actually count them, but my sense was that there were many more M42 and Pentax-M lenses than Pentax-A lenses, I wonder if this difference in ease of using these lenses on modern cameras explains the difference in availability.
QuoteOriginally posted by Cynog Ap Brychan Quote
Possibly, but Pentax was the leading brand in the days of the M42 mount with the Spotmatics, and the M series cameras sold pretty well, too.
In a word: zooms. They doomed many of the somewhat less popular focal length primes. Early zooms faced resistance just like digital cameras did, but once they started to catch on the number of primes in the lineup dropped to only those that sold in good numbers or were not well duplicated in a zoom. That trend continues today, with primes relegated to niche markets where they can still outshine the zooms enough to be a viable product.

11-16-2015, 08:56 AM   #335
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Unfortunately for Pentax, they made their legacy lenses far too well, so that the remain useful well beyond their expected useful lives. They are the principal product competition for new Pentax lenses: I'm quite shocked Pentax even allows us stop-down metering today, and pretty decent metering at that.
It's hard to claim "unfortunate" when Pentax/Ricoh are actively marketing this as a reason for buying their cameras.
11-16-2015, 09:30 AM   #336
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Yeah, please don't suggest Pentax to dry us up like another applejuice...
11-17-2015, 12:03 AM - 2 Likes   #337
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For me, longing for a de-crippled K mount has nothing to do with legacy glass. It's about having immediate control of each of the exposure settings at your fingertips. I want that functionality for the FA Limiteds. You know, those beautiful little lenses with auto-focus and auto-exposure that Pentax continues to produce today with that funky thingamajig called an aperture ring. And even though that thingamajig was designed way back in the olden times, it turns out it's a great way to conveniently control exposure since your thumb and middle finger naturally cradle the lens right there anyway. How this basic feature for controlling exposure ever came to be considered antiquated is beyond me. I believe it to be just as beneficial as it ever was.

One of the revolutionary new features digital offered was on-the-fly changes to ISO. With this advancement came the possibility of having every one of the exposure parameters at the ready. You'd now be able to instantly control shutter speed and ISO from the e-dials while setting aperture from, of all places, the aperture ring. There's a problem though... That's not possible with a crippled mount.

If only there were a way for the camera body to know what f-stop the lens was set at. Wait, there is! Unfortunately, Pentax has thus far chosen not to implement such a solution. And while the green button is great, it's still fiddly compared to simply being able to twist the aperture ring.

I'm not that old and I'm not that old school but I still want a de-crippled K mount, goddammit! And it's not so I can skip on buying expensive new glass. I would love to see new lenses with aperture rings! I find shooting in manual mode to be the most engaging and gratifying way to do photography. M mode isn't just for manual lenses, folks! I'd manual focus more if my eyes were better but I'd shoot in M all the time if I could just use the aperture ring on my FA Limiteds with normal metering.

I'm going to be disappointed if the FA Limited re-issues don't sport an aperture ring. The omission or inclusion of an aperture ring on any new FA Limited may end up being the clearest indicator of Pentax's intentions for resurrecting, or perhaps reinventing, the step-down coupler.

Last edited by TomTextura; 11-17-2015 at 12:22 AM.
11-17-2015, 01:31 AM - 2 Likes   #338
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Just remember Tom, that weather sealing lenses with aperture rings is much harder, if not impossible.

Everything comes at a price.

11-17-2015, 01:52 AM   #339
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So, for the time beeing, you're good for Samyang stuff

Last edited by Zygonyx; 11-17-2015 at 09:19 AM.
11-17-2015, 02:25 AM   #340
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QuoteOriginally posted by TomTextura Quote
For me, longing for a de-crippled K mount has nothing to do with legacy glass. It's about having immediate control of each of the exposure settings at your fingertips. I want that functionality for the FA Limiteds.[...]
I understand your point but I'am not sure the majority out there share the felling. There Fuji sure.

Personally, I can already control lot of things with the 2 wheels included in my camera. Because I can choose to control 2 parameters, the third one is linked to the first 2 from the choice to have a correct exposure as defined by the camera + a bias. I agree, there still the need to click on a button and move a wheel at the same time to change this bias.

And this is configurable. You can choose to switch by full stop, 1/2 stop, 1/3 stop, if you should turn left or right, if you prefer the front or rear wheel for a given setting. It also allow you to instantly reset parameters or change mode.

And with the FF, the lack of direct third wheel to have all setting directly accessible seems to be solved. It look like the FF has a third wheel + an accessible selector of what it will control. With that you'd be able to control all settings directly if you wish.

To me, it look like a superior solution ergonomically that can adapt to wide variety of needs.

I understand that in a sense it break the old behavior and that's annoying. I am not sure Ricoh see a big enough market to care much.

But I am with you for it to work if this doesn't mean we loose another feature and if it doesn't cripple the ergonomics in anoter way.
11-17-2015, 03:06 AM   #341
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I prefer to control the aperture from the camera, even when using lenses with aperture rings, like the FA Limiteds and KA series. I'm weird that way... (or maybe it's because I don't have to worry what sort of lens is on my camera)
11-17-2015, 08:14 AM - 1 Like   #342
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QuoteOriginally posted by TomTextura Quote
I'm going to be disappointed if the FA Limited re-issues don't sport an aperture ring.
You can take some encouragement (maybe only temporarily)
from the way they've updated this 645 lens:
HD Pentax-D FA 645 35mm F3.5 AL [IF] Reviews - 645 Wide-Angle Primes - Pentax Lens Reviews & Lens Database
11-17-2015, 08:45 AM   #343
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
Personally, I can already control lot of things with the 2 wheels included in my camera. Because I can choose to control 2 parameters, the third one is linked to the first 2 from the choice to have a correct exposure as defined by the camera + a bias. I agree, there still the need to click on a button and move a wheel at the same time to change this bias.
Index finger on the shutter button - DOF switch. Middle finger on the front eDial. Thumb on the rear eDial. Not so hard is it?

And using the aperture ring only gives you increments of 1/2 stop. And one stop at the closed down end. Off speed lenses like f/1.7, 1.8 etc. will have less than one stop on the wide open end.
11-17-2015, 09:07 AM   #344
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
Just remember Tom, that weather sealing lenses with aperture rings is much harder, if not impossible.

Everything comes at a price.
Haven't forgotten but definitely a fair point. Fuji has shown that weather sealing an aperture ring is possible but certainly there is a cost associated with it. Not sure what other WR lenses exist out there that are graced with an aperture ring.


QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
And with the FF, the lack of direct third wheel to have all setting directly accessible seems to be solved. It look like the FF has a third wheel + an accessible selector of what it will control. With that you'd be able to control all settings directly if you wish.
Yes, this is very encouraging!




---------- Post added 11-17-15 at 01:12 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
Index finger on the shutter button - DOF switch. Middle finger on the front eDial. Thumb on the rear eDial. Not so hard is it?
That covers two exposure parameters. For simultaneous and seamless control over a third, being able to use the aperture ring sure would be sweet.


QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
And using the aperture ring only gives you increments of 1/2 stop. And one stop at the closed down end. Off speed lenses like f/1.7, 1.8 etc. will have less than one stop on the wide open end.
I'll take it! That's a much smaller quibble in my book.

Last edited by TomTextura; 11-17-2015 at 09:20 AM.
11-17-2015, 09:38 AM - 1 Like   #345
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
Just remember Tom, that weather sealing lenses with aperture rings is much harder, if not impossible.
I find this completely unconvincing. If they can weather seal focus and zoom rings they can weather seal aperture rings as well. There's just no difference. (Click stops are on the inside, so that's not a difference. Being right up against the mount should be no problem, and if it is they can add as much space as they need before the ring.)
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