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06-26-2008, 12:13 PM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by cateto Quote
I agree too:

If you forget about the mumbojumbo from canikonist sites, the embarassing truth for the marketing guys at both at Canon & Nikon is that Pentax is offering a stunning camera at a price that puts into shame their offerings. It is truly too good, too cheap, just as it was the K10D when released.
Well, whether its too good I do not know. But it's interesting to see that the A700was part of the comparisons in the D300 and the 40D reviews. So back than it was a match, now it's not anymore.
I think they wisely chose not to compare the D300 and the 40d with the K20d. Otherwise, if you do not want to shoot UZI-wise, nobody would decide to buy the d300 for that amount of money. The 40d would get a similar verdict for different reasons.
If we consider the banding issue as something that really isn't as common as suggested, and the hotpixels being solved, what would the picture quality have been as well as the value ??? Particularly after Richard's nice words about the exchange of detailed against noiseless pictures, but the latter at the expense of "smearing". That was some judgment I would not have expected rom Phil.

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06-26-2008, 02:22 PM   #62
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What I found noteworthy.

QuoteQuote:
Noise reduction settings

As we've seen, the K20D tends to apply very conservative levels of noise reduction by default. There are three options for increasing it, however. High ISO noise reduction can be set to Weakest, Weak and Strong, as well as the default Off setting, using option 18 in the Custom Menu setting.
Our tests show that these options have no effect below ISO 800. Their effects from ISO 800 upwards can be seen below. (It's worth noting that, although the Operating Manual states that all "Noise Reduction is set to Strong when shooting with a sensitivity of ISO 3200 or high, regardless of the setting in the Custom Menu," this doesn't appear to be true. We have only tested the results in whole stops but the settings clearly behave differently at ISO 3200)/
WTF Pentax? Which is it?



QuoteQuote:
The Samsung co-developed sensor may well prove to be a turning point for Pentax, giving the company a little more control over sensors it uses and, in general terms, it delivers high resolution images with noise levels that are comparable with its competitors (and presented with a commendably hands-off approach to noise reduction that allows the user to decide how they wish to deal with noise, rather than smearing it all away). However, the hot pixel problems, combined with the sample-to-sample variability (in this instance ISO 3200 banding), represent the sorts of problems we haven't seen in DSLRs launched in the past few years. Which makes us wonder whether Samsung has over-reached itself with such an ambitious design. This is reflected in our image quality score that without these niggles would have been even higher.
Really? Pretty certain banding has been seen in just about every camera out there at high ISO's at some point (didn't the D300 1.02 firmware have something to do with that?). But I do suppose they are right. The kinds of problems we have seen were only things like severe AF issues from way more expensive models.
06-26-2008, 08:26 PM   #63
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Hmmm. Banding you say. D300 banding? Never heard of it. Pay no attention to the firmware update behind the curtain.

D300 - Nikon issues firmware update for D300: Digital Photography Review

There's also been a D3 firmware update. That either added or fixed some D3 issues.

The D3 update was pulled from availability shortly after it's release.

Nikon updates D3 firmware update: Digital Photography Review

This isn't Nikon bashing, it's more pointing out that there is a link to firmware updates for the D300 on the same site that chided Pentax for having problems and needing to issue a firmware update...

Last edited by brothereye; 06-26-2008 at 08:33 PM.
06-28-2008, 09:39 AM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jodokast96 Quote
What I found noteworthy.
WTF Pentax? Which is it?
Richard is correct. The statement in the manual does not apply for iso 1600 til 3200, but I'm not sure about iso 6400. looking at the graphs I think its max NR then.

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06-29-2008, 03:05 AM   #65
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K20D is getting serious clicks on DPR this week...

But you already knew that
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06-29-2008, 03:40 AM   #66
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Why they didn't compare the 40D & 300D

A reason given by Richard Butler as to why they didn't compare the K20D to some "other" models, (i.e. 40D and 300D?) which seems quite plausible.

"Also, do you have any idea of how long I'd have to spend on the forums justifying the inclusion of two Canons, if I then criminally (and at the behest of INSERT BIG BAD EVIL CORPORATION OF YOUR CHOICE HERE), ignored INSERT NICE, FRIENDLY CAMERA MAKER'S NAME HERE's product?"

I guess that all is not rosy in the land of camera reviews! I certainly wouldn't want that job!

I think that, on balance, the review was pretty reasonable. I detected no more favour or otherwise to any other make. Considering how much fervour can be drummed up by the interpretation of some words or phrases, I think it's a very good result for Pentax.

I did notice some very civilised and complimentary posts by users of other brands that came over and visited the Pentax forum. We all focus far too much on the negative and not enough on the positive.

In fact if there was no bad stuff, then how the heck would we appreciate the good stuff?
06-29-2008, 05:13 AM   #67
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Ah, I see Pentax is the third overall brand to receive the most clicks. As it should be.
06-29-2008, 05:30 AM   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by ftpaddict Quote
Ah, I see Pentax is the third overall brand to receive the most clicks. As it should be.
To be fair: the K20D has been their top-listed story on the front page ever since the review came out. If you subtract out the interest in the K20D (even if you also remove the interest in Olympus's E420), Pentax is down with Ricoh and Kodak, well below Canon, Nikon, Sony, Panasonic, Olympus, and even Fujifilm.


That isn't necessarily a bad thing, but shows how important it is for Pentax to keep their name in the public eye.

06-30-2008, 03:59 AM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by Richard Day Quote
A reason given by Richard Butler as to why they didn't compare the K20D to some "other" models, (i.e. 40D and 300D?) which seems quite plausible.

"Also, do you have any idea of how long I'd have to spend on the forums justifying the inclusion of two Canons, if I then criminally (and at the behest of INSERT BIG BAD EVIL CORPORATION OF YOUR CHOICE HERE), ignored INSERT NICE, FRIENDLY CAMERA MAKER'S NAME HERE's product?"

I guess that all is not rosy in the land of camera reviews! I certainly wouldn't want that job!

I think that, on balance, the review was pretty reasonable. I detected no more favour or otherwise to any other make. Considering how much fervour can be drummed up by the interpretation of some words or phrases, I think it's a very good result for Pentax.

I did notice some very civilised and complimentary posts by users of other brands that came over and visited the Pentax forum. We all focus far too much on the negative and not enough on the positive.

In fact if there was no bad stuff, then how the heck would we appreciate the good stuff?
I couldn't agree more Richard. I actually went back and read the whole review and it seemed to be fair and balanced to me. It actually made me want to buy the body, which I heretofore have been able to resist. Of course, part of that may be because my wonderful K10D is now out of action. In any case I could find very little to fault with in the review. There were some niggles, but nothing really remarkable. The K20D is a great camera, DPR has acknowledged that. It's not an extrodinary camera, but then again there are very very very few of those.

NaCl(just my nickle's worth)H2O
06-30-2008, 08:12 PM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
K20D is getting serious clicks on DPR this week...

But you already knew that
I like the way the K20D's 12% click share is breaking the sidebar layout on the front page

Last edited by ricardobeat; 07-01-2008 at 07:38 PM.
07-05-2008, 02:14 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by NaClH2O Quote
I couldn't agree more Richard. I actually went back and read the whole review and it seemed to be fair and balanced to me. It actually made me want to buy the body, which I heretofore have been able to resist. Of course, part of that may be because my wonderful K10D is now out of action. In any case I could find very little to fault with in the review. There were some niggles, but nothing really remarkable. The K20D is a great camera, DPR has acknowledged that. It's not an extrodinary camera, but then again there are very very very few of those.

NaCl(just my nickle's worth)H2O
I agree with both your and Richard's nickel's worth. I was diappointed to read that the AF suffers the same issues as my K10D and DS2 - but not surprised, since I think Pentax would have touted any major improvement in AF.

Anyway, like you I'm a bit more interested in one. Let's see where the price goes.

Jer
07-16-2008, 07:33 AM   #72
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Just saw this posted and couldn't help but notice the massive amount of hot pixels in the ISO 25,600 shot. D3 and D700 samples from me to you - dslreports.com Nope, we never see these sorts of problems on DSLR's released in the last few years. Having said that, I really do like how the D3 handles noise.
07-16-2008, 07:46 AM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jodokast96 Quote
Just saw this posted and couldn't help but notice the massive amount of hot pixels in the ISO 25,600 shot. D3 and D700 samples from me to you - dslreports.com Nope, we never see these sorts of problems on DSLR's released in the last few years. Having said that, I really do like how the D3 handles noise.
The D3 is a high-ISO beast.
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