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02-17-2016, 10:29 PM   #541
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QuoteOriginally posted by derekkite Quote
A $3500 masterpiece would have been a disaster no matter how exceptional the performance.
+1, yes , absolutely.

02-17-2016, 10:29 PM - 1 Like   #542
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
...thank god I'm single...
All depends. I asked my wife and she said "does that mean I get the k-3?"
02-17-2016, 10:35 PM   #543
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QuoteOriginally posted by MJSfoto1956 Quote
So while it would be awesome if it were 6.5fps @ 36mp, 4.4fps would neither be a significant improvement nor significant liability vis a vis Nikon's FX offerings.
With my photography high ISO performance is essential, so 36 megapixels doesn't cut it at any framerate. I would choose 16 Megapixel camera over 36 Megapixel any day, 36 Megapixels for me means just noisier images and headache when thinking about storage space.
02-17-2016, 10:40 PM - 3 Likes   #544
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I think many old time Pentaxians wanted a home run, beat all the competition, have them shaking in their boots, bring back the glory days camera. I suspect Ricoh could have delivered that, but at a far higher cost. And they wisely did not, but rather did the best they could at the price point they felt they needed to be at to be successful. This might not be the camera of everyone's dreams but it is a solid, honest, feature rich camera at an amazing price.

Swinging for home runs is great if you connect, but not so good if you miss. Pentax felt, I believe, that this camera HAD to be a success. A failure here and that is it for the Pentax FF dream. A success here and there will be more cameras and more lenses. When you only get one shot you make sure you get a hit. And I think have one. Runner on first, nobody out..................

02-17-2016, 11:01 PM   #545
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
Pentaxians wanted a home run, beat all the competition, have them shaking in their boots
QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
I suspect Ricoh could have delivered that, but at a far higher cost.
Although I'm please with the K-1 announcement, I'd comment on your statement: unit cost and R&D costs are two separate things. The K-1 is priced according to goals in terms of revenue and serviceable market, number of customers willing to buy a such camera given its price. Units cost is an internal company figure that customers don't have to know. For example, the unit cost of pixel-shift = $0.0 but since some customers see a value in it, pixel shift contribute to the value they perceive, hence how much money they are willing to pay for the camera. However, R&D cost depends on the amount of efforts Ricoh have put in developing the camera, which , to me is relatively low, they've followed a minimum engineering approach: kept as much as they already had and changed what was needed to accommodate a larger sensor, but that's all. You can clearly see their approach for lenses: no R&D spending , reuse of third party tech. Unit cost of a 50 AF points is the same as 33 AF point, it's a peace of silicon. The trick to make money is to propose features that cost much less than the value perceived by customers. What's funny about this Ricoh full frame is that they tried to teased like for a luxury product, nurturing the dream that Ricoh would come up with some bright features (larger view finder than competition, different sensor or whatever), and they release it as a mass market me too product. Kind of an original approach , since there is a kind of disconnect between the tease and the reality, it's the first time I see that.
02-17-2016, 11:08 PM   #546
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QuoteOriginally posted by Edvinas Quote
With my photography high ISO performance is essential, so 36 megapixels doesn't cut it at any framerate. I would choose 16 Megapixel camera over 36 Megapixel any day, 36 Megapixels for me means just noisier images and headache when thinking about storage space.
The sample high-ISO images I have seen on DPR look insanely clean (RAW). Only exposure was adjusted no NR

6400 RAW


12800 RAW
02-17-2016, 11:32 PM - 2 Likes   #547
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QuoteOriginally posted by Edvinas Quote
With my photography high ISO performance is essential, so 36 megapixels doesn't cut it at any framerate. I would choose 16 Megapixel camera over 36 Megapixel any day, 36 Megapixels for me means just noisier images and headache when thinking about storage space.
The Real Megapixel Myth
02-17-2016, 11:33 PM   #548
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QuoteOriginally posted by bxf Quote
AF-C may be lacking compared to the best, but not ever pro job requires great AF tracking, if at all.
That's part of the issue. To understand a camera's strengths or weaknesses, or even features, you may need to place it in a usage context (or as DxO terms it, 'usage case'). Pros or hobbyists alike.

Great camera features for portrait shooting may not be considered so useful when shooting sports. Wedding pros may also want different features from landscape or architecture shooters. Etc.

The 'problem' with the K-1 is that it kind of has to do it all - satisfy all usage cases - and at a good price. Somehow in getting to that point, Ricoh has chosen to enhance some camera features (eg 5 axis SR) while leaving others less developed (eg the AF or the metering), or by downgrading or removing other features entirely (eg USB, on-board flash).

So naturally users who approach the K-1 with particular needs (eg pro sports shooters who value tenacious AF-C tracking) may be legitimately disappointed with the K-1, whilst others may not notice any problem at all.

QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
This might not be the camera of everyone's dreams but it is a solid, honest, feature rich camera at an amazing price.
Exactly.

I personally think Pentax could have done more in some areas (eg the AF, which still looks very similar to K-3 AF), but it will be interesting to see if in reality the K-1 AF performs a lot better than the spec sheet would suggest.

02-17-2016, 11:35 PM - 2 Likes   #549
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QuoteOriginally posted by Edvinas Quote
36 Megapixels for me means just noisier images and headache when thinking about storage space.
Storage is cheap, and there is nothing stopping you from downscaling the 36mp images to 16Mp - it would actually produce comparable or better IQ than any 16Mp camera by virtue of the reduction in image size.

Sounds to me like you are complaining for the sake of complaining.

---------- Post added 2016-02-18 at 05:08 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
So naturally users who approach the K-1 with particular needs (eg pro sports shooters who value tenacious AF-C tracking) may be legitimately disappointed with the K-1
Really? the camera isn't even in your bloody hands and you are already ripping on the AF.
02-17-2016, 11:40 PM   #550
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
Really? the camera isn't even in your bloody hands and you are already ripping on the AF, saying it won't be good enough.
Note the last part of my post.
02-17-2016, 11:41 PM   #551
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If the pixel peeping feature would be locked, the digital camera industry would suffer a lot.
02-17-2016, 11:45 PM - 1 Like   #552
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
it will be interesting to see if in reality the K-1 AF performs a lot better than the spec sheet would suggest.
So you can project accurately on how well the AF system will perform by looking at the spec sheet? In relation to previous models what are your thoughts on the Nikon D5 then?
02-18-2016, 12:06 AM - 1 Like   #553
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
So you can project accurately on how well the AF system will perform by looking at the spec sheet?
I don't think it's unreasonable to look at the K-3 AF specs, and my usage of the K-3, and then form a view on how the K-1's AF might perform, given the direct technical similarity of the K-1 and K-3 AF systems. The K-3 AF will be a pretty good guide to how the K-1 AF will perform, I bet.

The K-3 AF generally, and AF-C in particular, btw, is really quite good, even compared to some Nikon FF's, particularly when the light is low.
02-18-2016, 12:32 AM - 1 Like   #554
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QuoteOriginally posted by Edvinas Quote
With my photography high ISO performance is essential, so 36 megapixels doesn't cut it at any framerate. I would choose 16 Megapixel camera over 36 Megapixel any day, 36 Megapixels for me means just noisier images and headache when thinking about storage space.
Yes Edvinas, I sympathize with your plight - but then I remember that in a prior post you had told us of your defection to Nikon three years ago.
Now considering that the Nikon D810 tops out at ISO 12800, I have a hard time understanding what you want.
Besides, you had also told us before that you kept your three amigos, which you are now going to sell because the K-1 has inadequate frame rates... Or so you say. Again, considering that the Nikon D810 has only 5fps this is bordering on the ludicrous, particularly as the three amigos are known for many fine properties - but lightning fast is not one of them.
02-18-2016, 12:45 AM - 4 Likes   #555
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I can't understand why some people are croaking. This is a great FF camera that offers too many features that FF from Canonikon can't even dream about (mainly due to the capabilities the SR II offers). There is no PERFECT camera as there is no perfect anything out there. If you feel that this camera doesn't fit your style of photography just go on and buy a Nikon D810. I can't wait to get the K-1 and my 24-70/2.8 for more or less the same price and do some astrophotography that I always wanted to do!

I think Pentax-Ricoh made a very clever move and released a high resolution pro level camera in such an affordable price. This is a groundbreaking move when a few days earlier the sport models of Canonikon were announced at the 6K region... Even if no new users are attracted by the K-1, even if there won't be any switchers from other brands (IMHO there will be many) Pentax with this great release tempts the old Pentaxians to pull their money out of their mattresses and go buy the new DSLR to play with their beloved FF lenses in a modern body for the joy of photography! No other company respects its users-supporters so much! Don't forget that with those 3-6K FF bodies from other companies you get the absolutely necessary features and every new generation cuts some extend of compatibility with older ones so they force you to spend even more.

I'm mostly into aviation, sport and wildlife photography and until today I could work around K-5IIs disadvantages and produce photos that were making many pro FF photographers go "WOW great shot". I'm sure that with the K-1 I will have even greater potential to evolve as a photographer and produce pictures that I'll love. The AF-C and AF in general might not compete with the D5 or D500, but I don't care! I will find my way to bring the game to the sectors where K-1 excels, and I see many! After all I want to be part of the picture that I make and there are many "photographers" out there who know less than basics about photography but carry 15K of the latest equipment that even a mole could get impressive captions with ... That's not my style and thanks God not Pentax's style either that's why I'm a proud Pentaxian and I will remain faithful to what I love...

I could write many things but I'm so excited that I have no time to spend to reply to negativity in here. To conclude, I congratulate Pentax. A few years ago (you can read the posts) everyone was wondering about the existence of Pentax as a company at all. Now I really see a bright future if they go on with this strategy of "the best camera for your money at every DSLR category" Pentax is involved in.

As for the rest: if you wait for another 10 years there will be robot cameras that will provide continuous AF tracking with their embedded AA radars and they will be able to track and shot a 100 burst on a flying may-beetle 15 meters away... Ah just don't forget to mark the resulting photographs with your personal data... after all you were the ones who pressed the button to that remote control while lying in your hammock...
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