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02-19-2016, 01:36 AM   #631
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
Too many trilingual obscenities would be involved.
I went to Findon High School in the early 70's...... so I'm good for 10 or so languages of obscenities.....


On another note..... where can you preorder a K1 in Adelaide?

---------- Post added 19-02-16 at 07:08 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Sandy Hancock Quote
You're on!
Nice of you to shout DCshooter a plane ticket......

---------- Post added 19-02-16 at 07:10 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
Send me a ticket, and I'll be happy to join both of you and bring plenty of American liquor. It's been over 10 years now since I've last been in Oz, so I figure I'm about due

We could have all the old lenses around Australia sent here...... you could then CLA & anodize them etc as a working holiday...... 50 or so should cover it.....

Oh yeah.... how are you getting along with the 85?


Last edited by noelpolar; 02-19-2016 at 01:44 AM.
02-19-2016, 02:19 AM   #632
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QuoteOriginally posted by noelpolar Quote
On another note..... where can you preorder a K1 in Adelaide?
I am also interested in a response to this....
QuoteQuote:
Nice of you to shout DCshooter a plane ticket......
I missed that nuance
02-19-2016, 03:29 AM - 1 Like   #633
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QuoteOriginally posted by noelpolar Quote
On another note..... where can you preorder a K1 in Adelaide?
Camera house on Grenfell street: just mention my name, that will make them pay attention.
02-19-2016, 03:46 AM   #634
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QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
Camera house on Grenfell street: just mention my name, that will make them pay attention.
You can swear trilingually and scare camera shops?

02-19-2016, 03:50 AM   #635
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QuoteOriginally posted by robbiec Quote
You can swear trilingually and scare camera shops?
both of which are undervalued talents.
02-19-2016, 04:18 AM - 6 Likes   #636
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I guess I shouldn't be surprised at the negativity. There are always two groups of naysayers that come out when there is a new product released. The first is the cheap Pentaxians who are upset because the camera has video, too many megapixels, weather sealing, and too high a frame rate and if Pentax had just dropped or cut down some of those features, maybe the camera would have been in line with their budget. As it is, they're going to be stuck shooting with a used A7 and moving to a Canon 6D later this spring. The other group are those who feel that the new release is under-specified and wish for more -- often a specific feature or sensor -- clean iso 1,000,000, 8K video, face detection in PDAF, 10 fps with a deep buffer, etc. The problem with both groups is that they are actually very small individually. The number of people who are actually bothered that there is video on their camera is relatively small (and would leaving video off actually decrease the price?). The number who need 4K video (and use it regularly) is probably smaller.

In the end, I do believe that Pentax was building this camera toward a specific price point, a sub-2000 dollar price point. Because of that, they ended up with some compromises. Maybe there is a little older sensor. There has not been a lot of R and D focus on video. But to me, this is a mid-level camera that work well with what Pentax's strengths have been over the years.

There is still room for a higher end camera between the K-1 and the 645Z if the K-1 sells well and Pentax sees their market share going up enough, but we need to be honest and say that if Pentax had released a 3000 dollar camera, even if the specs were top notch, the response would have been underwhelming.

Last edited by Rondec; 02-20-2016 at 03:16 AM.
02-19-2016, 06:03 AM - 1 Like   #637
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I totally agree with you.
K-1 looks like a very good camera, it could be better but it's just impossible to satisfy everyone.

I'd love to have a DSLR able to shoot 4K video but in fact i just don't need 4K.
I'd love to have a 12 FPS camera but i don't shot so much sport photos and a 12 FPS camera is way too expensive.
In fact this K-1 is going to be a very comfortable compromise.
02-19-2016, 06:27 AM   #638
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I think the mistake that most people make is that they think that Pentax should make a camera targeted just for them. Pentax needs to leave off any features that they don't personally need and include any features that they personally need. People have this impression that if Pentax made a digital K1000, they could sell it for 800 dollars or something astronomically low. But the actual sales would be so abysmal that it is pretty unlikely that they could sell it for less than they are selling the K-1 for (it would probably actually be more expensive to make such a low volume item).

02-19-2016, 06:28 AM   #639
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All of us have our dream camera or dream feature. Would have been wonderful (for me) if the K1 had cracked the "50mp barrier" (Next logical uptick, perhaps, would be 64mp), but that would probably have been at the cost of greater noise at high ISO and low light conditions. How many lenses would profit from such a sensor? How many images, viewed on screen or as prints, would look different coming from a 64mp sensor versus a 36mp sensor? I think it's safe to assume a higher pixel count will not enhance bokeh.

PS: Raise the cry: CARPE K1!

Last edited by WPRESTO; 02-19-2016 at 06:47 AM.
02-19-2016, 07:31 AM   #640
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
clean iso 1,000,000
That's the one! Screw everything else
QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
they think that Pentax should make a camera targeted just for them
Yes, and what's your point
02-19-2016, 07:34 AM   #641
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ISO 1,000,000 = to be selected only for the (in)famous black cat on a pile of coal in an unlit windowless cellar on a moonless night. Way back, a photo magazine actually published just such an image, in B&W of course.
02-19-2016, 07:40 AM   #642
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QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
K-1 will give you similarish MP count in crop mode as your trusty K-5 but have all the nifty goodies included that you don't have with your dusty K-5.

THAT SAID K-3s are cheap these days.. really cheap. One third of the cost actually.. you could get multiple K-3s and have a K-3 party instead of a party of 1 with the K-1. That would be a sad party.
I am pretty rough on my gear so K3s on the cheap aren't a bad choice. I will always keep an apc-c camera on hand. I shoot motorcycle racing mostly. Flat track and ice racing are with a telephoto/tripod combination from a pretty good distance. Motocross is much closer with a shorter lens and burst mode and hand held. I also do some bird and wildlife shooting, also where a crop sensor camera has an advantage.

I'm certainly not going to be one of the first to run out and buy a K1. I want to see the tests and reviews. If the K1 was spec'd closer to the D750, it would peak my interest much more. It will also call for a road trip to NYC because I won't buy one without actually handling it prior to purchase. To me, ergonomics are more important than all those features that I will never use. While not bad, the K5 (and K3) is a little small for my hands which is why I still keep a K10D as my second camera.

While $1700 isn't a budget camera, it's not out of the ball park either. I could swing it but it would also trigger some lens purchases, the 24-70 in particular. Keeping this camera under $2K was a good move and I think that factor alone will help insure that it will be a success as long as the actual camera doesn't turn out to be a real dog.
02-19-2016, 07:48 AM   #643
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QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
you could get multiple K-3s and have a K-3 party instead of a party of 1 with the K-1. That would be a sad party
Kenspo has a post up in the Pentaxians facebook group which seems to indicate that a one-K-1 party is a pretty good party right now. Everyone else in the group who doesn't have one wants to be there.
02-19-2016, 07:56 AM   #644
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QuoteOriginally posted by reeftool Quote
I am pretty rough on my gear so K3s on the cheap aren't a bad choice. I will always keep an apc-c camera on hand. I shoot motorcycle racing mostly. Flat track and ice racing are with a telephoto/tripod combination from a pretty good distance. Motocross is much closer with a shorter lens and burst mode and hand held. I also do some bird and wildlife shooting, also where a crop sensor camera has an advantage.

I'm certainly not going to be one of the first to run out and buy a K1. I want to see the tests and reviews. If the K1 was spec'd closer to the D750, it would peak my interest much more. It will also call for a road trip to NYC because I won't buy one without actually handling it prior to purchase. To me, ergonomics are more important than all those features that I will never use. While not bad, the K5 (and K3) is a little small for my hands which is why I still keep a K10D as my second camera.

While $1700 isn't a budget camera, it's not out of the ball park either. I could swing it but it would also trigger some lens purchases, the 24-70 in particular. Keeping this camera under $2K was a good move and I think that factor alone will help insure that it will be a success as long as the actual camera doesn't turn out to be a real dog.
I think there are plenty of situations where it makes sense to shoot a fast APS-C, like the K3, along side a K-1. The K 3 has better frame rate, deeper buffer and probably isn't going to that much different with regard to focus as compared to a K-1 (assuming the same lens).

For sports and wildlife, I still think APS-C has a lot going for it. Full frame is probably not particularly beneficial if you are cropping your images down to APS-C anyway.
02-19-2016, 10:37 AM - 1 Like   #645
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No more megapixels!

QuoteOriginally posted by WPRESTO Quote
All of us have our dream camera or dream feature. Would have been wonderful (for me) if the K1 had cracked the "50mp barrier" (Next logical uptick, perhaps, would be 64mp), but that would probably have been at the cost of greater noise at high ISO and low light conditions. How many lenses would profit from such a sensor? How many images, viewed on screen or as prints, would look different coming from a 64mp sensor versus a 36mp sensor? I think it's safe to assume a higher pixel count will not enhance bokeh.
Full frame (36 x 25 mm) 36 MP sensor as the one K1 is equipped with has pixel resolution of 7360 x 4912. That means the effective pixel site is roughly a square 5x5 microns. For typical lens apertures used in normal cameras for mortal people (as opposed to CIA, NASA, science labs and some such) that means the diffraction limit is reached with Airy disk 4-5 microns in diameter. Therefore more pixels in full frame format is a boneheaded idea - there will be no more detail visible, period.

The proper way to higher resolutions is through bigger sensors. And here comes P645Z, or for those inclined to self inflict financial wounds - Phase One. This is the end of the road folks. The wall put there by the laws of physics. You can venture outside if you are rich or don't mind to become poor. But in the world of small format cameras - 36 MP is the upper limit with which we'll have to live from now on.

But that's not bad. Look how fine we ended up with microprocessors that hit the wall of 3 GHz. See? The sky is not falling. We'll be fine. Some stupid reviewers in stupid pseudo photo magazines may have to starve to death, but that's fine with me. Now we can concentrate on actually making photographs. :-)

---------- Post added 02-19-2016 at 12:05 PM ----------

Just to add to my previous rant/prophecy: I've always been a resolution freak in the most generic, Fourier transform sense, that is regardless of problem domain (spatial, measured in pixels or temporal measured in dB). That paradoxically drove me away from digital 10 years ago back to the realm of film photography. Scanning film at 3200 px/inch (highest reasonable resolution of my scanner and only slightly higher than the actual resolution of film, as it should be) I get 13.6 MP from 35mm film on still fabulous Nikon F5, 56.8 MP from freakishly awesome Pentax 67II and 195 MP from heavenly Wista 45 (4x5 format).

These 13.6 MP images can easily be printed at least up to 11x14 and that's what really matters. Film photography tought me that the point of making a photograph is to print it, not to convert it to a tiny, post stamp size blob of pixels left to die on some stupid facebook or other twitter.

Having said that I will gladly acquire K1. To pursue photography as an art it will contribute not the resolution (as my other cameras show, I have more than enough pixel real estate when I need it). What K1 has and film does not is the insanely high sensitivity. ISO 200k opens possibilities that previously were only abstract. Also, it appears to be a perfect camera for astrophotography. ISO 200k and no low pass filter! Yummy.
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