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02-22-2016, 09:09 AM - 1 Like   #706
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QuoteOriginally posted by Simen1 Quote
Remember the FF teaser side from september 2015?
It said spring: http://petapixel.com/assets/uploads/2015/09/pentaxffteaserpage.jpg

---------- Post added 22-02-16 at 18:11 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Digitalis Quote
This is actually a very good point, shunting heat away from a sensor on a floating IS platform isn't exactly easy.
Even if it as fixed it is still a floating sensor system. Moving it about would give of heat quicker.

02-22-2016, 09:24 AM   #707
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QuoteOriginally posted by Simen1 Quote

Remember the FF teaser side from september 2015?
No. Never was.
02-22-2016, 09:51 AM   #708
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Ohh, I just took that image from a link I followed an hour ago (some complaint about a New Zealand distributor). It didn't occur to me it could be fake. (Why would a Pentax distributor fake it to put Pentax in an unfavourable position?)

That makes part of my speculations weaker. I will remove the link immediately and edit the text accordingly.

Edit: I got the image from Ian R. Little home page. His latest Pentax "news" are from 5 months ago.

Last edited by Simen1; 02-22-2016 at 09:57 AM.
02-22-2016, 10:16 AM   #709
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The initial plan - communicated a year ago - was to have the FF before the end of 2015. So its launching was delayed, not advanced.

02-22-2016, 10:31 AM   #710
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
Oh, if you crop? Sure.
I don't think it speeds up the camera - it would probably be casting away the outer pixels after taken, but yep, it's less for your computer to deal with afterwards.
But burst rate of APSC mode is significant faster than FF. Hence I guess speed comes from „physical layer“ and imagine only the APSC pixel area is read out. So it can be faster because less to read out and no cropping of a full raw in post has to be done. The jpeg engine of the camera can directly work on that APSC raw.

Anyway - I’m no hardcore camera techie. So the tech behind the scene in this case is not that important to me. Good thing that we get matched raw files for APSC.
02-22-2016, 10:32 AM   #711
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The initial plan - communicated a year ago - was to have the FF before the end of 2015. So its launching was delayed, not advanced.
+1
I guess
1/ we will have to wait for a few months in order for Ricoh to decide the next step - the plan exist and might have several options
2/ if K-1 is a confirmed success the chances are big that they pursue with an even more affordable yet a bit "crippled" or lower end level body
02-22-2016, 10:44 AM   #712
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Should we already start a thread about future FF cameras?

I guess they will go more expensive first. A faster sensor (fps, video features) and rather reduce the price of K-1 when its in time (maybe a year from now). That makes less room for a cheaper model so it might not be one before we get a K-1 replacement, witch should be at least two years to. I guess the more expensive model could get the same housing as the K-1. The K-1 replacement would probably get a simpler and slightly smaller housing (fixed screen, no GPS, smaller grip, one SD card slot and a control wheel less). A real cost saver that could start at the price point K-1 left at.
02-22-2016, 11:19 AM - 1 Like   #713
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QuoteOriginally posted by Simen1 Quote
The K-1 replacement would probably get a simpler and slightly smaller housing (fixed screen, no GPS, smaller grip, one SD card slot and a control wheel less). A real cost saver that could start at the price point K-1 left at.
If I were running Pentax, I'd put most of their K-mount cameras in cases virtually identical to the K-1's case. It is striking in appearance, and I believe a visual family resemblance built around that striking appearance would be a seriously good marketing tool.

02-22-2016, 04:17 PM   #714
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote

Even if it as fixed it is still a floating sensor system. Moving it about would give of heat quicker.
Nuh, a fixed sensor can be embedded in a metal heat sink.
02-22-2016, 04:28 PM   #715
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*ponders* For a moving sensor, either you move the heatsink (noisy, slow, power hungry) or you need some kind of flexible thermal gel to go between moving sensor and fixed heat sink. That... may be the solution, but it would be a whole new technical challenge to develop.

I wonder if any camera manufacturer is researching along those lines, or if the focus is all on lowering the heat generated in the first place.
02-22-2016, 05:42 PM   #716
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Does anybody know what exactly is the K1's sensor make and model? Could it be the same one as in Nikons D7xx/D8xx?
02-22-2016, 05:52 PM   #717
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jerry_K Quote
Does anybody know what exactly is the K1's sensor make and model? Could it be the same one as in Nikons D7xx/D8xx?
I don't believe anyone has said officially (or if anyone ever will, officially). It is 36Mp, so it isn't the same sensor as the D750. Discussion here ( strongly supported) suggests it is an updated version of the IMX094, same base sensor as the D810. Reportedly Pentax has extensively customized / revised / improved it.
02-22-2016, 05:54 PM   #718
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A popular passive cooling technique in laptops are heatpipes with heatsinks. Phase change cooling are very weight efficient, but the pipes used in laptops are not flexible. If there exists flexible pipes for this purpose then I think heatpipes would be a good way of distributing heat from the sensor to the magnesium body.

Some thermal cameras and microscope cameras have active TEC cooling of the sensor, but the heat from the TEC are normally removed by a heatsink and a fan. TECs are not very energy efficient even in optimal situations. Ordinary refrigerator technology are much more energy efficient in removing the heat. If that could be miniaturized enough, I think that might be an idea. Active cooling can give a problem with condensation. This could be solved by a relative air humidity sensor that stops cooling when the humidity approaches the dew point. A small pocket for a replaceable silica gel package inside the camera should make it possible to cool the sensor quite a lot before approaching the dew point. The purpose of cooling the sensor is not just to protect it from over heating, but thermal noise levels decreases a lot. This could make Pentax the leading camera for astro photography and general long exposure photography.

I don't believe Pentax will introduce active cooling, but its a nice daydream.

Another thing I thought about was that Pentax could move the shutter to the sensor assembly. The shutter could be built smaller because it doesn't have to cover the whole sensor shifted area. Though it would be more to move around so I don't know if it would be a good idea.

---------- Post added 02-23-16 at 01:58 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I don't believe anyone has said officially (or if anyone ever will, officially). It is 36Mp, so it isn't the same sensor as the D750. Discussion here ( strongly supported) suggests it is an updated version of the IMX094, same base sensor as the D810. Reportedly Pentax has extensively customized / revised / improved it.
I hope their own interview series will reveal how they improved it. Maybe someone will comment on that at CP+ too.
02-22-2016, 06:05 PM   #719
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I don't believe anyone has said officially (or if anyone ever will, officially). It is 36Mp, so it isn't the same sensor as the D750. Discussion here ( strongly supported) suggests it is an updated version of the IMX094, same base sensor as the D810. Reportedly Pentax has extensively customized / revised / improved it.
That would be awesome. K1 would then score rather high in DXOMark (if it still means anything). I'm particularly eager to see sample photographs taken at the highest ISO. ISO 200k qualifies for a pretty decent astroimager (an "available light photography" taken to an extreme). Wonder what the noise is though, as a function of exposure time.
02-22-2016, 06:24 PM   #720
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The top ISO number doesn't indicate anything. Its just getting more silly for every time someone increases that. Compare decent ISOs in stead. Lets say ISO 12800 from camera A vs the same on camera B.

Note that even if its improved, the (single shot) DR seems to be lower because K-1 have ISO 100 setting as the lowest, while D810 have ISO 64 (measured 47) as its lowest.

DXO doesn't measure noise as a function of exposure time (aka how much thermal noise it has). They only measure noise in short exposures (photon noise + read noise). I would love to see a thermal noise comparison between cameras. I haven’t seen one test for years.
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