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03-17-2016, 12:38 PM - 1 Like   #871
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
Morally I would say I understand the people that want to try... Typically merchant don't hesitate to maximize profit by selling as high as possible.
Maximizing profit and taking advantage of an error is not the same thing. You, as a buyer, can shop around and attempt to reduce your cost.

I am not even saying that I wouldn't try to take advantage of an unusually low price, but I certainly would not force a reasonable merchant to fight me in order to correct the error.

03-17-2016, 12:39 PM   #872
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Over here, K-1 is priced 2200 Euros, roughtly 400 euros above the price announced in the USA. The D750 (also here) is priced 1800 Euro, which actually makes the K-1 not as competitive as it seemed to be in the product press release. I initially thought that the K-1 would be very attractive. But I don't know if Nikon dropped their prices, currently, the D750 is one of the best offering overhere.
03-17-2016, 12:42 PM   #873
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QuoteOriginally posted by bxf Quote
Maximizing profit and taking advantage of an error is not the same thing. You, as a buyer, can shop around and attempt to reduce your cost.

I am not even saying that I wouldn't try to take advantage of an unusually low price, but I certainly would not force a reasonable merchant to fight me in order to correct the error.
Nor me.
03-17-2016, 12:58 PM - 1 Like   #874
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Over here, K-1 is priced 2200 Euros, roughtly 400 euros above the price announced in the USA. The D750 (also here) is priced 1800 Euro, which actually makes the K-1 not as competitive as it seemed to be in the product press release. I initially thought that the K-1 would be very attractive. But I don't know if Nikon dropped their prices, currently, the D750 is one of the best offering overhere.
You are from Austria? You can buy the K-1 for it's introduction price of 1999,-

http://www.idealo.at/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/4965481_-k-1-body-pentax.html

The D750 is cheaper ( http://www.idealo.at/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/4583512_-d750-body-nikon.html ) but it was introduced for about 2400 if I remember right. The K-1 is a better specced camera. IMHO it is very competitive. Why do people always compare introduction prices to street prices? I cannot speculate on that because that would result in several insulting assumptions.

03-17-2016, 01:01 PM   #875
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote
You are from Austria? You can buy the K-1 for it's introduction price of €1999,- http://www.idealo.at/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/4965481_-k-1-body-pentax.html The D750 is cheaper ( http://www.idealo.at/preisvergleich/OffersOfProduct/4583512_-d750-body-nikon.html ) but it was introduced for about €2400 if I remember right. The K-1 is a better specced camera. IMHO it is very competitive. Why do people always compare introduction prices to street prices? I cannot speculate on that because that would result in several insulting assumptions.
Yes, that's it, and I did not check the prices recently.
03-17-2016, 01:17 PM   #876
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Over here, K-1 is priced 2200 Euros, roughtly 400 euros above the price announced in the USA. The D750 (also here) is priced 1800 Euro,
The K-1 is a 36Mp camera, the D750 is only 24Mp.
03-17-2016, 01:31 PM   #877
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
The K-1 is a 36Mp camera, the D750 is only 24Mp.
But the K-1 is not a D810 competitor, don'cha know.


/sarc
03-17-2016, 01:46 PM   #878
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QuoteOriginally posted by bxf Quote
Maximizing profit and taking advantage of an error is not the same thing. You, as a buyer, can shop around and attempt to reduce your cost.
Some way of maximizing profit are ethical. For example you provide more for your client at a cheap price so everybody buy from you, you get economy of scale, everybody happy.

Another way is to increase productivity and share the benefit on both side.

If you truely have different products that you can make easily that respond to different need same from the same machines and technology, you also have a nice way to ethically improve profit by serving more people. If also you provide a high end version that provide feature necessary to some people and that cost you more, it seems logical to ask for more...

Now playing on the notion of branding so you can ask more for the same product, or making a more expensive version of the extact same thing (K50 vs K30) and asking significantly more for it because it is newer, I don't find it that nice. Asking more for the exact same razor because it is advertized for womens instead of men and seeing that the bigger the shop, the more distance the 2 products can be, the bigger the price difference is because people are less likely to figure it out, I don't find it fair.... Asking more per kg for the familly pack than for the price at unit because people have a bias of thinking the familly pack that can save on wrapping will be cheaper is not ethical neither. The typical strategy to have appealing price for a few products that you know from behavioral studies people will tend to check price but asking for very high price for things people don't think to check, that's not ethical.

This is trying to deceive your clients, hoping they'll make the error to not check the price per kilogram, that they'll make the error to take the product "designed" for their gender, that they'll make the error to assume the newer K50 camera is better than the K30, induce them in error with marketing that the expensive clothes are better than the cheap one while in practice this is the same... That trying to deceive their brain to see when they don't remember that you are trying to deceive as most as you can and they should check every single bit of thing they buy from you extensively...

This is funny how we find ethical to abuse people that are not smart enough, that are not methodic enough, that are too trustfull, that are simply tired at that moment how this doesn't count... But if a merchant make an error when putting a price then benefiting of it is not ethical.


Last edited by Nicolas06; 03-17-2016 at 02:13 PM.
03-17-2016, 01:56 PM   #879
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Business is business.
Don't mix with moral considerations.
Political, why not... oh wait, that even rarely makes sense.
03-17-2016, 02:00 PM   #880
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QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
Business is business.
Don't mix with moral considerations.
Political, why not... oh wait, that even rarely makes sense.
Then let's consider a client buying something as doing business too

Last edited by Nicolas06; 03-17-2016 at 02:10 PM.
03-17-2016, 02:27 PM   #881
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
The K-1 is a 36Mp camera, the D750 is only 24Mp.
I love that segmentation... All theses camera are competitors, even between different sensor format (APSC vs FF etc). That artificial wall we put as market segmentation and marketers love how they can play with that

D750 vs D610 vs K-1 vs D810 vs Canon 6D vs 5DmarkIII vs 5Ds and a few other they are all in competition, they are the same product. All take photo, all share the same basic concepts and features and would give similar results in most cases. Even an APSC camera like K3/K3-II/D7200 or D500... they are in the same pack.

Then the manufacturer try to put have unique selling point, features that distinguish themselves like pixel shift, SR, fancy AF, lot of pixels, low price, great high iso performance or even astro tracer as reasons to go for one model or another.

Saying that the camera that cost 2200 is not worth the difference vs the one at 1800 is putting more weight on the assets of the 1800 camera (among other things price) than the one at 2200 (for example 36MP, pixelshift, astrotracer or SR). And that's perfectly fine. Everybody has different set of priorities.

Other than that if you are already invested in Pentax or if you don't have to buy the day it is out, I don't really see the issue, the price don't look bad by any means and I am sure you'll find it cheaper than that if you look a bit.
03-17-2016, 03:41 PM   #882
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
But the K-1 is not a D810 competitor, don'cha know.


/sarc
But the spec of K-1 is way better and cheaper than D810

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/169-pentax-full-frame/314375-spec-compari...non-nikon.html
03-17-2016, 04:10 PM - 1 Like   #883
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QuoteOriginally posted by rlatjsrud Quote
Yes, I saw the Pentaxeros spreadsheet some weeks ago.

There's a poster here who insists the K-1 competes with the D750, then says the K-1 is overpriced (a Strawman argument). The poster just won't accept the K-1 is Pentax's answer to the D810.
03-17-2016, 04:51 PM   #884
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The primary audience for the K-1 are crop-sensor Pentatians who have been waiting forever for such a camera, no matter its specs or price point. The secondary group are those CaNikon users who are not yet invested in CaNikon FF due to price/features headwinds. A portion of these may jump ship as they are not truly invested in the CaNikon ecosystem (e.g. D5000 owner with two kit lenses). The third group is more nuanced: those who, no matter what gear they currently own, are truly excited about the features/pricepoint that the K-1 offers. The 36Mp is important for this group. Also key for this group is the availability of a rich system of compatible accessories from lenses to flashes to adapters and more. Therein lies the rub: the Pentax ecosystem is not as rich compared to CaNikon or even Sony. There are other marketing segments as well. Notwithstanding, the K-1 is deliberately designed to address a wide range of markets. I "think" they got it mostly right. Can't wait to try one out.

Michael
03-17-2016, 04:52 PM   #885
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I think of course K-1 is a competitor to the D810. Having used the D810 and the D750 alongside my k-5 and a borrowed k-3, unless Pentax suddenly figured out how to track focus quickly and accurately both Nikons will blow Pentax out of the water, if that's something you care about...

Nikon has some really expensive optics to complement the D810's resolution. I hope my collection of old Pentax Primes will be sufficient for the K-1 when I eventually get it.
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