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02-28-2016, 09:45 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote


Why would you think that? Sensors don't actually have different ISO settings. Sensor have a base ISO and gain is applies to the image by the image processor for any ISO over 100.

Basically Ricoh is saying the new image processor is applying the same amount of gain as the D810, but creating less noise in the process.
Mmm I thought there were a set of hardware g gain/iso settings provided by the sensor and more settings by the image processor.
This was said related to the K5 sensor which went up to iso 1600 (hardware), rest being software pushed.
This is just whaty I remember but things may be a bit more complicated than what you say.

02-28-2016, 09:57 AM   #32
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Hi JPT,

Thanks for the informative and well-written report!

Did you get a chance to look in the viewfinder? If yes, how would you say it compares to others you have used in terms of brightness, magnification, etc.? How does it compare to an APS-C like the K-5 IIs or an old full-frame like the LX FA-1? (Don't know if you have used that one.) Obviously the K-1 specs are different from both of those, but I am interested in real world impressions.
02-28-2016, 10:34 AM - 2 Likes   #33
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P

QuoteOriginally posted by interested_observer Quote
Thanks for this -

Again, new information that I had not read anywhere else!

And it is misinformation, goes to show that even Ricoh reps are obsessed with the wish for the K1 to have the same sensor as the Nikon D810. And it is pure nonsense too: the Nikon D810 sensor has a native iso of 47, and a TRUE base iso (user selectable) of 64, NO expansion going on.
The K1 sensor 99% sure IS the Sony A7r sensor, with a native iso of 87, and a TRUE base iso (user selectable) of iso 100.
But I am afraid that the obsession with beating the Nikon D810 will add to spreading misinformation for a long time.... Sigh.....

Chris

---------- Post added 02-28-16 at 06:52 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
Surely this refers to the jpeg engine. The D810 is 1-1/5 stop cleaner than the K-3 in raw. There's no way in hell Pentax have managed to gain 4/5 of a stop over the D810 raw performance with the same sensor.
Nikon D810 vs Pentax K-3
The wish for the Pentax K1 to trump the Nikon D810 is on track to spreading all kinds of nonsense on the topic of the sensors in both cameras. Including the idea that Nikon is stretching the iso range artificially. Remember: the Nikon D810 is a thoroughly professional camera, not a consumer apsc. The sensor was most likely especially designed by Nikon itself to gain a true base iso of 64, for landscape and portrait shooting in bright light conditions and maximizing DR. The K1 has no such setting, because it has a more standard FF sensor like the one found in the Sony A7r.
Still a wonderful sensor (I have the sony A7r), but no Nikon D810 sensor.

Chris

Last edited by Chris Mak; 02-28-2016 at 10:42 AM.
02-28-2016, 11:28 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Seems to me they did pretty much the same thing with the D7000 and K-5. Same sensor, DxO measured more dynamic range from the K-5.
More DR, but only at ISO 80, which the Nikon did not have. Noise and DR tracked exactly the same at ISO 100 and above. That is very different from what is being claimed here for the K-1.

We shall see when DXOMark does the actual test. Until then no one will convince me that the K-1 has more than 1-1/3 stops at best on the K-3.

02-28-2016, 01:42 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by JPT Quote
Features1 | PENTAX K-1 | RICOH IMAGING
on this link there's a picture under the ISO section, and under it is ISO 102,400. The picture seems impossibly noiseless for that to be true, and the ISO 102,400 isn't there on the Uk site, so it's almost certainly a mistake - but i would be nice to see what the high ISO capabilities look like - yet again, just have to wait, I guess ;(
02-28-2016, 01:57 PM   #36
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Excellent report JPT. The fact that Ricoh rep is comparing ISO between k5iis and K1 shows even Ricoh thinks K3 output was fairly noisy compared to K5iis.
Also is it confirmed that K1 uses D810 sensor or simply a Ricoh rep speculation?
02-28-2016, 02:13 PM   #37
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It is Ricoh' rep. clear assessment i understand.
So basically same raw potential.
Unless Chris Mak is correct, which is likely
02-28-2016, 02:22 PM - 1 Like   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by danny09 Quote
Also is it confirmed that K1 uses D810 sensor or simply a Ricoh rep speculation?
make what you will of this:-

"35mm full-frame CMOS image sensor Exceptional imaging power assured by a large-format sensor
The K-1 incorporates a newly developed 35mm full-frame CMOS image sensor..."

02-28-2016, 02:36 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Zygonyx Quote
It is Ricoh' rep. clear confirmation. So basically same raw potential.
Do you mean working with the same array of photo-sites, or same RAW files? Too many people think RAW is just raw, like raw meat. This sensor is an active electronic device, with input from the camera along with programming embedded in the component supplied by Sony. Sony can alter that embedded programming to suit different customers and the camera manufacturer can alter the inputs to Sony's sensor component to suit which performance characteristics are most important to them and their experience in getting those performance characteristics from Sony's sensors.
QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
The wish for the Pentax K1 to trump the Nikon D810 is on track to spreading all kinds of nonsense on the topic of the sensors in both cameras. Including the idea that Nikon is stretching the iso range artificially.
Manufacturers don't have the same freedom to spread nonsense that you or I have.
02-28-2016, 03:42 PM   #40
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Yeah, you are correct, by the way that would not mean so much, depending on the components and processing, including raw file making up for sure.

We still will have to rely on field tests and DxO
02-28-2016, 03:50 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by souless Quote
Thank you for the 1st hand report!
Very informative and concise!!

just one little thing that I am confused
Did you mean at 1:09, the print on the wall with many ladies dressing like maidens in it?
Sorry about that. I meant the posed picture of the models that you're referring to. I must have read the total length of the video by mistake.

The ISO comparison shots they had were of the K-1, an 50mp camera from "A company" and a 36mp camera from "B company". I asked whether it is the same component as B company and he confirmed that it was, but implemented differently.

I looked in the viewfinder, but I had the slower zoom on the camera. It struck me as being of similar brightness to the Nikon models. I liked the markings in the viewfinder. They all flash red when the camera achieves focus. Apparently there are options in the menu to change the behaviour of the viewfinder markings.

I did confirm that there is no setting for 1:1 crops, so to do that you will have to shoot the full frame and crop afterwards.
02-28-2016, 04:16 PM - 1 Like   #42
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Nice report. I didn't expect pixel shift resolution could be used hand held.

@chris mak the d800 sensor has the following specs:100 - 6400 in 1, 1/2 or 1/3 EV steps (50 - 25600 with boost) the a7r 100-25600. The k-1 100-204800. It is not the same sensor. Not with three extra stops iso. It is probably a new incarnation. So no the same as the d810 either.
02-28-2016, 04:47 PM - 1 Like   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
And it is misinformation, goes to show that even Ricoh reps are obsessed with the wish for the K1 to have the same sensor as the Nikon D810.

Well, in a post somewhere, a Ricoh rep showed one of our members pics taken with the 810, and comparison ones with the K-1 that were better ... make of that what you will!
02-28-2016, 05:00 PM   #44
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The difference between the K-5 and D7000 image quality was negligible.
Nikon and Pentax are very good at getting the most out Sony sensors!
I am sure the K-1 will surpass the D810 by a 1/8 of a stop
Nikon D7000 vs Pentax K-5
02-28-2016, 05:45 PM - 1 Like   #45
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I SAID it was hand held PixelShift but doubters gotta doubt. Just wait.

I made another assertion that will be justified if Roger Cicala tears down a K-1.
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