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07-17-2008, 05:59 PM   #226
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QuoteOriginally posted by Entropy Quote
I have been to at least 3-4 camera stores in New York State that were listed as Pentax Digital SLR dealers. Not a single one of them carried any Pentax products, not even P&S.
(Those would be Hahn Photographic in Rochester, Rowe in Rochester, and Tuthill's in Binghamton/Vestal before they went out of business.)
Last month I visited some of the New York city's camera stores (B&H, J&R and Adorama), I could clearly understand that they are not interested in promoting Pentax. First of all very few Pentax Cameras are there. They are placed on a corner. The salesman in J&R gave me a weired look when I asked about Pentax K20 !!!! He even tried to convince me how bad Pentax is !!!! (lack of lens, lack of proper support, quality issues etc).

B&H places Pentax in less important places in their showroom. You need to specififically ask about Pentax and there also you will get this weired look from the salesman.

I can understand that these big stores getting more money by promoting Canon/Nikon/Sony. Now Pentax is owned by Hoya and they need to invest more money in marketing to create a brand awareness. Atleast they should put some posters/ads of Pentax in these kinds of shops

-IU

07-17-2008, 09:05 PM   #227
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I don't know about other countries, but I can comment on the situation in INdia. The market is dominated by Canon. IN last decade, there was no sign of Canon..Nikon was considered the BEST. even few Pros used Canon..

Canon setup many service centres around the country..almost every big city has one..They introduced cheaper cameras (not only DSLRs) ...They reduced the official price in the sense price in INdia matches well with other countries..This was a huge bonus as it has almost killed the grey market for canon..Also, Canon offers lot of gifts, photography books etc... Once the brand became popular, there is a monopoly..youngsters without knowledge of photography don't know even Nikon!!! EVERYBODY WHO KNOWS CAMERA KNOWS CANON..Sachin Tendulkar is their brand ambassador..Its impossible even for Nikon to upstage canon in india in near future..

Old school photographers, who are now senior citizens know and have pentax..but most of them have turned to P n S due to old age..

Oly is going strong..people don't know and don't care about the 4/3rd sensor..All they see is the weight, MP and money...

Sony has been a very popular brand in India since many years b4 canon and anything sony produces-even CDs- is considered great..Also, Sony already has many service stations in the country..

As for Pentax-
India loved K1000. It is still used by atleast 6 people in my city..
Currently, it is almost impossible to find stores which keep Pentax..WHen K10D was launched in IDdia, its official price was $1775!!!!! Now tell me, who the hell will buy such costly camera in India??? The official dealer in India according to pentax Asia, has no clue about Pentax..

When I decided to buy Pentax, I searched almost every camera shop in bombay and found only 2 shops which had could give me a K10D at one day's notice..and the only lens available other than the kit lens was the Sigma 100-300/4.5-6.7 and its price was $250!! and it was in MAY 2008, not 2007!! A Banglore shop has a FA 100-300 for sale for $275!..Only good thing about Pentax in India is that price of used lenses is very low compared to the West as very few use Pentax anymore..

Prosumers are very popular india..most sales of Canon, SOny and Oly is from the prosumers..

I agree there should be more agressive advertising from Pentax...and more service stations, atleast in the four major cities- Mumbai, Chennai, Delhi and Kolkata...and ready availability of camera and lenses...a cheap model replicating K1000 (cheap, 10-12MPs, very light weight, AA batteries, scene modes) with a kit lens of 18-250mm for $900 would do wonders for Pentax in India..OR may be a good Prosumer with 15x or more optical zoom..
07-17-2008, 09:57 PM   #228
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
I am betting on a FF Pentax in September....Not a lot of money but I have this sixth sense about these sorts of things and my intuition says between 24-28 mega pixels. Under K € and 100 to 6400 ISO. Three to Five FPS...........

Ben
I think one feasible direction would be for an announcement of a joint development of a FF body and sensor under Samsung badge and Samsung thus carries all or most of the development costs and early product risk but benefits from Pentax camera body experience (available next May ). Pentax will then come out with their version several months to a year later with all of the bugs worked out and development costs paid for by Samsung. They may even use the same plant as the volume will be so low. This would allow a lower volume product such as this to have a chance at a small profit margin for Pentax/Hoya and would give time to decide about and design new FF lenses. I would think they would go after the 5d/D700 customer segment (but even lower price) and try to out design Canon, Nikon, and Sony as to the quality of the sensor. To get lower price($1,800-2,500 range), obviously there will still be some compromises as there was with the k20d. Was the 5d considered a pro model? Not by feature set but a lot of pros own one and Canon probably made more profit on this model than higher models. This avoids going head to head in the top of the line pro segment.

To be honest, I am not sure why Samsung would want to do this and the Samsung name will not have the same credibility with this customer segment, but if they are as aggressive as others on this site have described I guess it is possible. Probably, Samsung envisions a camera where 50-70% of the cost of the camera is the sensor and electronics so they are in effect making most of the camera and earning a decent profit on each unit once up and running.
07-18-2008, 02:52 AM   #229
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I liked your report. Interesting facts!

QuoteOriginally posted by hrishi Quote
India loved K1000. It is still used by atleast 6 people in my city..
6 / 4,000,000
That's impressive

07-18-2008, 03:41 AM   #230
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QuoteOriginally posted by hrishi Quote
India loved K1000. It is still used by atleast 6 people in my city....
You guys should all get together, hop in a mini van and drive around your city shouting...FOR SPARTA!!!

Dont forget to flash your Pentax bling right after though or it'll all be in vain.

07-18-2008, 06:28 AM   #231
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QuoteOriginally posted by hrishi Quote
IOnly good thing about Pentax in India is that price of used lenses is very low compared to the West as very few use Pentax anymore..
hrishi:
if you find an FA*85/1.4 or FA*28-70/2.8, or FA*80-200/2.8, would you please let me know?

That is really good marketing by Canon. Hopefully Hoya has deep enough pockets to realize that something like that is needed. It sounds like you guys are in much worse shape than we are in the US...
07-18-2008, 07:02 AM   #232
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
I liked your report. Interesting facts!


6 / 4,000,000
That's impressive
Considering those 6 are out of 13 SLR owners I personally Know it is indeed impressive! The fact that they are using it for day to day purpose is simply super cool!

QuoteOriginally posted by Kaimarx Quote
You guys should all get together, hop in a mini van and drive around your city shouting...FOR SPARTA!!!

Dont forget to flash your Pentax bling right after though or it'll all be in vain.



QuoteOriginally posted by kenyee Quote
hrishi:
if you find an FA*85/1.4 or FA*28-70/2.8, or FA*80-200/2.8, would you please let me know?

That is really good marketing by Canon. Hopefully Hoya has deep enough pockets to realize that something like that is needed. It sounds like you guys are in much worse shape than we are in the US...
I was offered a Super Takumar 85/1.9 in excellent condition but without an adapter for about $60! I refused as I don't do portraits much and wouldnt want to buy a lens which I can't use straight away and hope of getting an adapter in immediate future..
07-18-2008, 08:04 AM   #233
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QuoteOriginally posted by iunknown Quote
Last month I visited some of the New York city's camera stores (B&H, J&R and Adorama), I could clearly understand that they are not interested in promoting Pentax. First of all very few Pentax Cameras are there. They are placed on a corner. The salesman in J&R gave me a weired look when I asked about Pentax K20 !!!! He even tried to convince me how bad Pentax is !!!! (lack of lens, lack of proper support, quality issues etc).

B&H places Pentax in less important places in their showroom. You need to specififically ask about Pentax and there also you will get this weired look from the salesman.

I can understand that these big stores getting more money by promoting Canon/Nikon/Sony. Now Pentax is owned by Hoya and they need to invest more money in marketing to create a brand awareness. Atleast they should put some posters/ads of Pentax in these kinds of shops

-IU
one thing you need to look at is that many stores have product placement dictated by suppliers. Bigger suppliers like canon and nikon probably insist on such high percentage of space that there is no room left for anything else.

Stores get esentually corrupted into ignoring smaller brands simply because they cannot afford to loose the bigger brand.

07-18-2008, 08:28 AM   #234
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I can't comment on camera stores in particular, but I work in retail and it is a fact that the amount and placement of shelf space and displays are sold to the highest bidders.
07-18-2008, 11:09 AM   #235
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QuoteOriginally posted by hrishi Quote
I was offered a Super Takumar 85/1.9 in excellent condition but without an adapter for about $60! I refused as I don't do portraits much and wouldnt want to buy a lens which I can't use straight away and hope of getting an adapter in immediate future..
LOL. You should buy it anyways because it's an interesting focal length in terms of bokeh.
If you do see any of the lenses I mentioned, please PM me
07-21-2008, 08:08 AM   #236
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QuoteOriginally posted by oxford_artist Quote
Pentax will have to have a professional's digital camera if they want to underline their seriousness as a camera maker
They don't have to do that.

There's zero need for a "professional" version of Pentax.

Pentax is more like Leica ...Leica's an "amateur" camera for the most part, but it's plenty "serious." (true for M6, M7, M8 digi)

Pentax has always been "serious," but has never been "professional" with the exception of the professionally-abandoned 645 (they found Canon better).

Nikon's new D700 (quite inexpensive, considering ) is already back-ordered everywhere and for good reason (ie professionals already have the lenses and they're certain D700 will be fabulous, since Nikons always are).

The upgraded Canon 5D will also sell-out fast to existing Canon users (most wedding photographers, who already have collections of expensive and wonderful Canon L lenses) and for the same reason.

Professionals already own Nikon or Canon, Pentax can't offer them anything as well proven professionally. Pentax hasn't bothered to introduce flash systems competitive with Canon or Nikon (or even Metz), which says directly that they have little interest in professionals.

I doubt we'll see a Pentax FF any time soon.
07-21-2008, 01:46 PM   #237
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QuoteQuote:
Pentax has always been "serious,"...
I wish! I love my Pentax gear, but the service in the Netherlands is very close to non existent. I'd love a FF for better noise control and wider angles (if I can afford one) but I'd actually rather see Pentax invest a bit more in their service organisation in Western Europe.
07-21-2008, 01:56 PM   #238
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QuoteOriginally posted by fishy Quote
I wish! I love my Pentax gear, but the service in the Netherlands is very close to non existent. I'd love a FF for better noise control and wider angles (if I can afford one) but I'd actually rather see Pentax invest a bit more in their service organisation in Western Europe.


I'm pretty sure a pro service program is in the works....
07-22-2008, 12:44 AM   #239
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QuoteOriginally posted by janosh Quote
They don't have to do that.

There's zero need for a "professional" version of Pentax.

Pentax is more like Leica ...Leica's an "amateur" camera for the most part, but it's plenty "serious." (true for M6, M7, M8 digi)

Pentax has always been "serious," but has never been "professional" with the exception of the professionally-abandoned 645 (they found Canon better).

Nikon's new D700 (quite inexpensive, considering ) is already back-ordered everywhere and for good reason (ie professionals already have the lenses and they're certain D700 will be fabulous, since Nikons always are).

The upgraded Canon 5D will also sell-out fast to existing Canon users (most wedding photographers, who already have collections of expensive and wonderful Canon L lenses) and for the same reason.

Professionals already own Nikon or Canon, Pentax can't offer them anything as well proven professionally. Pentax hasn't bothered to introduce flash systems competitive with Canon or Nikon (or even Metz), which says directly that they have little interest in professionals.

I doubt we'll see a Pentax FF any time soon.
"Pentax has never been professional" ??????? WHAT????

Pentax was the ipso facto Pro Camera for all of us Fashion Photographers before digital came out and NO it was not the 645, but the 67 that we were all using. Pentax lost their ground when digital hit in a big way. I know guys still using the 67.

Pentax has always been professional. They just have to gain ground in the digital arena to win back their lost fans.

Ben
07-22-2008, 02:47 AM   #240
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Leica is an amateur camera? ....lol You guys are funny. If you put an amateur photographer behind a 1DS-MKIII it becomes an amateur camera.
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