Originally posted by *isteve The D300 is selling way more than the 5D even through the 5D is now available at half its original price and there are still stocks of the camera 3 years on. What does that tell you?
It tells me...
1. A crappy 20D body for $1500 doesnt look like good value whatever the sensor
2. If they are still trying to sell them (and still have so much stock) then they over-inventorised and have too much excess stock. Probably why the 5Dmk2 has beem so late to the party.
Canon are suffering primarily because they dont have anything in the D300 league. The gap between the 40D and 5D in price is a yawning chasm, yet the 40D outperforms the 5D in just about every way that counts. I would not look at a 5D twice nowadays. Its like putting a V8 in a ford focus.
And yet even now, no-one can release a FF camera to the market for <$3000 (call it $2000 after a year or two). Still more than I would bother paying precisely because I do run a business.
And for the record, the Nikon D40 was the camera primarily responsible for Nikon pulling ahead of Canon in the DSLR market. I think the D60 is a weak offering but it still feels better than the 450D. However Nikon and Canon have lost the low-midrange plot recently because they have spent so much time trying to murder each other in the high end. As a result Sony have actually been handed a leg up for doing more or less nothing except flooding the low-mid end with new bodies. Did very nicely too, which is why you will see a new low end Pentax this year. They missed the boat too.
Pentax are not competing with Nikon and Canon at the top end so there is no point in trying at this point. They are competing with Oly and Sony. They dont have to take sales from the big boys, they want to be #3 eventually, and that means expanding the core product line not jumping into a market they have no access to.
So dont ask whether Pentax need an FF camera to compete with C&N because its utterly irrelevant, instead ask how many people will buy an A900.
I don't agree that the D300 is selling way better than the 5D. I don't know in other parts of the world, but here the 5D is HOT, i know this for sure. It is not only visible in the photo community, but i also have some numbers from several retailers...and the 5D is in great demand right now.
Less scientifically, i looked on flickr. If there are a lot of D300 users, they sure don't post the pictures they take.
Camera Total no. of images Avg no. of users
Nikon D40-------------12,179,247-------------2415
Nikon D60-----------------669,981---------------383
Nikon D300-----------------47,621----------------29
Nikon D3------------------650,435---------------231
Canon 5D-------------10,672,917-------------1497
Canon 450D--------------850,127--------------511
The D300 is worse even than the D3. Clearly, this is not bulletproof, but i don't think it is very far from the truth.
Also, i think the only reason why Canon will not to keep the current 5D in production is it's relatively high production cost.
I think you are rather unfair to the 5D. The 40D outperforms the 5D in many ways, but NOT in image quality. Basically the 5D and the K20D have almost the same weaknesses compared to the 40D: AF and fps. You can't say that the K20D is better than the 40D because it has better IQ, even if it is slower, and then turn around and say the 40D is better than the 5D because of speed.
The D40 was a smart move from Nikon. But how can the D60 be a better camera than the 450D when you can't actually have AF on ANY reasonable priced prime lens on it? That would be a huge bummer for me. The D40 and D60 are just an upgrade from a P&S or bridge. If you want a fast lens, you gotta go to the D80 at least. And that camera is murdered by the 40D, the 30D, the K10D, the K20D, the A700 and some others. I bet the D90 won't top the 40D or the K20D. So, it is pretty sad in the low end Nikon land.
How many people will buy an A900? How many people will buy an A700 or A300 or A350, because they know they have the possibility to go higher if they need/want to? How many people buy a Mercedes C instead of a BMW 3 Series or an Audi A4 just because the S-Class is (traditionally) a better car than the 7 Series or A8? How many people buy Leica?