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09-27-2016, 03:24 PM - 19 Likes   #316
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Sorry for being little late.
Was a hard and long double day.

Photokina.
My number one visit was Pentax,of course.
A couple of ours like every year,visit at my bodies
I checked the firmware 1.30 and could get it on my camera,but nope thanks....forgot my antia bug spray
Had a lot of small talk with Pentax stuff and Pentax customers and newbies.
Talked about sports,high ISO,durability and all the stuff and showed them my pictures for examples.
Every visitor was positive in his reaction,Pentax got a very nice reaction of the public.

Behind the lines.
I talked again with different bodies and with Ricoh stuff,2 years ago a short talk with Saiki san,this year he was stressed up
Had no time
But,I have more contacts and much better and more intense contacts.
The result for me of couple of hours at Pentax :
Q is still in action,but in the second row this time,full frame is the first.

!!! Attention !!! Q is out of production !!!

!!! Project Q is on ice,maybe over,maybe paused !!!
I asked different persons again,cause of the interview with the informations it is off.

New fullframe body next time?
NOPE and double no!

Fullframe lenses?
Yes,5 lenses!! in 17 and later new zooms.
Pro and consumer in the class of 28-105.
Than there is the developers roadmap,it's different to the public roadmap.
Public roadmap inserts the ready and clear projects,currently in production.
No fiction,full reality.
In production or pre production,but in direct line to the market and sale.
The developers roadmap,here we have lenses in development,ideas short before to be a prototype,check ups if it's good enough for the market or only a good idea.
But it shows what the development team is thinking and will figure out if it's needed or not.
But,not for public.

Mirror less fullframe,nothing about this,no idea,no information,no comment,not in right or a absolute high class secret.
It looks more like a project,if it's anything.

Pentax is in full progress lens production,maybe first look at cp+.
Pentax hoped they could show anything this year,but Ricoh decided for a big nope
At the weekend before the Photokina,Pentax Japan was sending a mail with a roadmap inside,but....it was the current one
The other thing is,Pentax is still looking inspiration for the lens roadmap,Pentax is still figure out what the customers are wanting,so it could be changing everything.
Pentax knows that not only the old community is in love with the Limiteds,also the newbies are fans.
That was a big surprise for Ricoh that the Pentax style is so special and the reactions are so positive.
Same with K-1,I remember the talks all the years and month before fullframe made by Asahi
The result is,Ricoh gives a lot of financial power to the development team in Tokyo.

The new APS-C high end model,K-3ll replacement...
Here we have the same big problem like Nikon have.
Only with the different that the Pentax is still invisible and not ready for show but existing.
Only,not currently in full production.
So,Ricoh decided to show and tell nothing.
Absolute nothing,only maybe cp+.
But nothing about what and how,only a maybe and we hope....
Nothing to keep in the hand.

Video will be not the important thing in a Pentax,so it looks not like that we get an cinema Pentax like red or Sony A 7s.
Pentax will give us photo machines with video function nearby
The other result of the Sony sensor production disaster is,Pentax will have no K-1 on stock till end of this year!
Only small numbers are going direct to the shops and than direct to the consumers with pre order,Pentax will see the K-1 only on paper.
No stock because of the small sensor production.

At last,the numbers of sales are much better than the years before and Pentax is the only company with a little increase in dslr!

The Ricoh theta is still a big success,lots of new consumers and areas.
Google bought a couple of thousand theta and lot of different companies in different branches also.

The 645 is also still a nice success and a very important line in the Pentax portfolio.

What can we do for Pentax?
The marketing and development teams are watching us,hearing us and follow us if we give them real and usable points and ideas for new stuff and lenses.

So let us stay clear and positive in arguments and wishes,Pentax will follow us if it's profitable and feasible.
So,not so much the big news,but my little insides of the Photokina.
Maybe I will find anything more in my brain memory,than I will come back.

Best regards


Last edited by asahi man; 09-29-2016 at 05:14 AM. Reason: changed 5 primes in 5 lenses,cause one is the fish eye zoom.
09-27-2016, 04:01 PM   #317
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
.....
Q is still in action,but in the second row this time, full frame is the first.
Q will be in right next year.
.....
What can we do for Pentax?
The marketing and development teams are watching us,hearing us and follow us if we give them real and usable points and ideas for new stuff and lenses.

So let us stay clear and positive in arguments and wishes,Pentax will follow us if it's profitable and feasible.
So,not so much the big news,but my little insides of the Photokina.
Maybe I will find anything more in my brain memory,than I will come back.
Thank you.

This is the most encouraging word I've heard with respect to the "Q" in the nearly two years I've been around here. It is much easier to be positive when I hear something which says more than they'll continue to sell what they currently have {which is what the PF Forum's interview sounded like to me}
09-27-2016, 04:04 PM   #318
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
What can we do for Pentax? The marketing and development teams are watching us,hearing us and follow us if we give them real and usable points and ideas for new stuff and lenses.
No lack of ideas here
09-27-2016, 04:44 PM   #319
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
Yes,5 primes in 17
QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
The other thing is,Pentax is still looking inspiration for the lens roadmap,Pentax is still figure out what the customers are wanting,so it could be changing everything.

I assume the 5 Primes are set? These are not set to change? Did they have a clear list of what we 5 lenses would be?

Is Ricoh going to update the existing Limited FA lenses?

Are we going to get a D-FA* 85mm F/1.4 or a D-FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited? Both?

09-27-2016, 04:45 PM   #320
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
Sorry for being little late.
Was a hard and long double day.

Photokina.
My number one visit was Pentax,of course.
A couple of ours like every year,visit at my bodies
I checked the firmware 1.30 and could get it on my camera,but nope thanks....forgot my antia bug spray
Had a lot of small talk with Pentax stuff and Pentax customers and newbies.
Talked about sports,high ISO,durability and all the stuff and showed them my pictures for examples.
Every visitor was positive in his reaction,Pentax got a very nice reaction of the public.

Behind the lines.
I talked again with different bodies and with Ricoh stuff,2 years ago a short talk with Saiki san,this year he was stressed up
Had no time
But,I have more contacts and much better and more intense contacts.
The result for me of couple of hours at Pentax :
Q is still in action,but in the second row this time,full frame is the first.
Q will be in right next year.

New fullframe body next time?
NOPE and double no!

Fullframe lenses?
Yes,5 primes in 17 and later new zooms.
Pro and consumer in the class of 28-105.
Than there is the developers roadmap,it's different to the public roadmap.
Public roadmap inserts the ready and clear projects,currently in production.
No fiction,full reality.
In production or pre production,but in direct line to the market and sale.
The developers roadmap,here we have lenses in development,ideas short before to be a prototype,check ups if it's good enough for the market or only a good idea.
But it shows what the development team is thinking and will figure out if it's needed or not.
But,not for public.

Mirror less fullframe,nothing about this,no idea,no information,no comment,not in right or a absolute high class secret.
It looks more like a project,if it's anything.

Pentax is in full progress lens production,maybe first look at cp+.
Pentax hoped they could show anything this year,but Ricoh decided for a big nope
At the weekend before the Photokina,Pentax Japan was sending a mail with a roadmap inside,but....it was the current one
The other thing is,Pentax is still looking inspiration for the lens roadmap,Pentax is still figure out what the customers are wanting,so it could be changing everything.
Pentax knows that not only the old community is in love with the Limiteds,also the newbies are fans.
That was a big surprise for Ricoh that the Pentax style is so special and the sections are so positive.
Same with K-1,I remember the talks all the years and month before fullframe made by Asahi
The result is,Ricoh gives a lot of financial power to the development team in Tokyo.

The new APS-C high end model,K-3ll replacement...
Here we have the same big problem like Nikon have.
Only with the different that the Pentax is still invisible and not ready for show but existing.
Only,not currently in full production.
So,Ricoh decided to show and tell nothing.
Absolute nothing,only maybe cp+.
But nothing about what and how,only a maybe and we hope....
Nothing to keep in the hand.

Video will be not the important thing in a Pentax,so it looks not like that we get an cinema Pentax like red or Sony A 7s.
Pentax will give us photo machines with video function nearby
The other result of the Sony sensor production disaster is,Pentax will have no K-1 on stock till end of this year!
Only small numbers are going direct to the shops and than direct to the consumers with pre order,Pentax will see the K-1 only on paper.
No stock because of the small sensor production.

At last,the numbers of sales are much better than the years before and Pentax is the only company with a little increase in dslr!

The Ricoh theta is still a big success,lots of new consumers and areas.
Google bought a couple of thousand theta and lot of different companies in different branches also.

The 645 is also still a nice success and a very important line in the Pentax portfolio.

What can we do for Pentax?
The marketing and development teams are watching us,hearing us and follow us if we give them real and usable points and ideas for new stuff and lenses.

So let us stay clear and positive in arguments and wishes,Pentax will follow us if it's profitable and feasible.
So,not so much the big news,but my little insides of the Photokina.
Maybe I will find anything more in my brain memory,than I will come back.

Best regards
Thanks for the information. These points are a lot to think about. Like I've said in one of the threads, this is where you learn about Pentax.

I don't need a K-1 but the lack of sensors for its production is bad news. The delay might lead those non-Pentax users who want the camera to divest their funds into another system. I hope the sensors will be available soon.

Still no news with the K-3II replacement. I'm not ready to replace mine but, most APS-C users are waiting for this camera as their upgrade path. Like me, some of us don't want a full frame. I hope this camera will be out next year with improved image quality and a much improved AF system.

Regarding lenses, I'm still waiting for a better substitute for my HD 55-300 WR. I guess it's an okay lens but, it's not something that I'm really please optically. I hope they'll come up with a FF version with better optics and AF.

What can we do for Pentax? There are a lot of comments and suggestions that have been made here. Pentax did a survey a couple of months ago regarding the lenses and I believe it provided good feedback. Maybe there should be more surveys so that Pentax can gather more information of what users want and need. As we all have different wants and needs they should be the one to sort things out and come up with what's best.

One more thing is, I hope Pentax will still be a bang for a buck system. That's one of the reasons I decided to go into it 2+ years ago.
09-27-2016, 05:10 PM   #321
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
The new APS-C high end model,K-3ll replacement...
Here we have the same big problem like Nikon have.
Only with the different that the Pentax is still invisible and not ready for show but existing.
Only,not currently in full production.
So,Ricoh decided to show and tell nothing.
Absolute nothing,only maybe cp+.
But nothing about what and how,only a maybe and we hope....
Nothing to keep in the hand.
Thank you for the thorough update, Asahi man. More information in your post than in all others in many months.

I'm excited to see a K-3 II replacement not only is in the works but is apparently 'existing' in some form already. Unless K-3II prices drop considerably for Black Friday sales, I will probably just hold off until next year to upgrade my camera body then!

Sad that Ricoh Japan put a hold on showing products. I would be curious their reasoning.. I felt that showing nothing at Photokina gave a negative outlook/impression to both current and potential customers of their products. They should have been more forthcoming with information. Even if it was just information on paper and not physical products to show.

I'm so very much hoping for a 16-50 f/2.8 update with a new optical configuration. The current one has horrible Chromatic Aberration and is fairly soft at f/2.8. Plus the horrible old SDM motor.

But happy to read of new Pentax primes in the works. Looking forward to a 24-105 f/4 and 70-200 f/4 full frame in Pentax K mount too. Those I'd love to have when I eventually (God willing) upgrade to full frame K-1. I'd buy the 70-200 f/4 today and use on crop if they offered it.
09-27-2016, 06:00 PM   #322
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thanks!

now i want firmware to add quasi-quick-shift for non quick-shift lenses! seems like it would be easy to disengage the screwdrive after focus lock... anyway, thanks!
09-27-2016, 06:14 PM - 1 Like   #323
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It's not so easy to make screw drive to quick shift,because the gear is still locked mechanically.
You have to push the lens release button to disconnect the gear of the screw unit.
Best regards

09-27-2016, 06:34 PM   #324
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
It's not so easy to make screw drive to quick shift,because the gear is still locked mechanically.
You have to push the lens release button to disconnect the gear of the screw unit.
Best regards

ok, i change my request to an electric button on future bodies for af/mf (current one must be mechanical), then option to auto disengage after focus lock!
09-27-2016, 06:51 PM   #325
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QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
...What can we do for Pentax?
The marketing and development teams are watching us,hearing us and follow us if we give them real and usable points and ideas for new stuff and lenses.

So let us stay clear and positive in arguments and wishes,Pentax will follow us if it's profitable and feasible.
...
Thank you for all that. Most of it made perfect sense to me, and fits with the way Ricoh has been working, since it took over the Pentax photographic business.

The above quote from your post runs counter to the arguments some have been putting here, that this Forum is not taken notice of, which only ever rang true to me in relation to some of the more extreme comments made from time to time.

The current development plans for "consumer" grade D-FA lenses also make sense to me. The real development potential is in the specialist professional areas, of which (sports/action photography aside) I can name architecture, landscape/adventure and studio work (which covers a wide field from product to portrait photography). I'm not sure how many of those fields are covered by members here who gain profit from their photography, but a new thread for informed discussion about them would be helpful.
09-27-2016, 07:24 PM   #326
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Thank you, asahi man!

Great update!

QuoteOriginally posted by asahi man Quote
The marketing and development teams are watching us,hearing us and follow us if we give them real and usable points and ideas for new stuff and lenses.
What is the best way to reach the development teams?

I have a critique of the D-BG6 button layout and would like to know how to maximise the chances that designers will look at it. I created a poll regarding the D-BG6 button layout. The results:
  • 43.48% do not prefer the current layout.
  • Only 24.64% prefer the current layout (to other alternatives).
  • 31% don't care (about half of them because they don't use grips).
That means of those who have an opinion, 63% do not prefer the current layout over alternatives (with only 37% supporting the current design).

The layout I presented in the poll as an alternative (which worked with the size constraints of the current grip design, i.e., was an evolution, not a revolution), was preferred by more voters than the current layout.

I realise that the poll was extremely small but
  1. the current approach can be argued to be ergonomically bad on first principles, and
  2. the numbers of the poll confirm that with a majority (63% of those with an opinion) wanting something else, plus
  3. it is reasonable to assume that many who did not vote would buy any grip, independently of the button layout.
I realise that many won't go as far as I do -- I won't buy a D-BG6 for my K-1 because I'd hate using it -- but a better design could only mean more sales, not less. If one includes those who do not care which layout it is (but use grips) then 28% would prefer the current layout but 72% would prefer or buy another layout. I know that I'm using numbers creatively to make a point, but I'm only doing that because I think the point is worth making and that it seems that so far Pentax has not heard the point.

Finally I realise that the chances of the D-BG6 being changed are virtually non-existent. However, perhaps a future grip design will not repeat the same mistake.

BTW, the D-BG4 does not have the problem and I therefore have one for my K-5 II.

Can you help?

If you agree, of course.

Last edited by Class A; 09-27-2016 at 07:40 PM.
09-27-2016, 07:29 PM   #327
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I do not believe they will update the FA Limiteds any time soon. They are in actual production since January. I believe they will continue them until the cult appeal finally wears off, then replace them with completely new designs.
09-27-2016, 07:46 PM   #328
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I believe they will continue them until the cult appeal finally wears off
(emphasis is mine)

I think the FA Limiteds have real, substantial appeal. I believe they are successful because they are great lenses, not because they have some "cult appeal" that can "wear off".

You make it sound as if they were "in fashion" and are bound to go "out of fashion".
I think such a view is giving them too little credit.

P.S.: I'm sure Pentax is perfectly capable of providing successors that will provide a cleaner benchmark performance. I'm rather unsure whether I'd prefer those modernised variants for making images.
09-27-2016, 08:14 PM   #329
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Nice report. I am glad to see that Pentax has been a pleasant surprise to Ricoh and that is equating to more investment in the brand. I have spent a lot of money on Pentax gear the last 4 1/2 years and I am glad to see that it was not in vain and a viable system will be in place for some time to come.

About all I would really like to see is better tracking autofocus. Simply because my old eyes will need it more and more in the future. The K1 is one awesome camera in all other respects. Simply the best bang for the buck of any system out there,
09-27-2016, 08:23 PM   #330
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Thanks Asahiman for the heads up.

It is good that you mentioned about the status of aps-c as I am not planning to buy any new gear from Pentax. Helps me recuperate my bank account.

TBH, I am a bit upset since their is no clear update re the aps-c roadmap. Where is my standard WR prime? I do not want to settle to the mixed and expensive DA 20-40 as my standard lens.
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