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07-18-2017, 09:01 AM   #466
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
(...)
Maybe you were in a 'Ron moment' of some sort.
Since I mentioned APS-H, definitely so .

07-18-2017, 01:01 PM   #467
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Dear Ricoh...
K-01s
Move the hot shoe forward and eliminate the pop up flash, convert it to a pop up evf..
domo arigatou gozaimasu..
J.L.
07-18-2017, 03:16 PM   #468
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Clearly but a lot of FUD spreaders do so too
M aybe you were in a 'Ron moment' of some sort.
By the way, any joke set aside, why are you qualifying as potential FUD the prospect of all Sigma Global Vision lenses being henceforth available in Pentax K mount with the added bonus of a K mount, Pentax branded SD Quattro?
07-18-2017, 03:46 PM   #469
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
By the way, any joke set aside, why are you qualifying as potential FUD the prospect of all Sigma Global Vision lenses being henceforth available in Pentax K mount with the added bonus of a K mount, Pentax branded SD Quattro?
I would be all for that if it gained us more quality lenses. The 24-105 f/4 and the 100-400 f/5-6.3 would be instant buys here.

07-18-2017, 04:10 PM   #470
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wow

there is a lot to absorb here. I am still learning so I like all the thoughts from everyone. from film to digital is a big jump and costly.
07-18-2017, 04:19 PM   #471
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QuoteOriginally posted by elf photo Quote
there is a lot to absorb here. I am still learning so I like all the thoughts from everyone. from film to digital is a big jump and costly.
I think you'll ultimately save money, Elf photo.
07-18-2017, 04:31 PM   #472
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I think k mount mirrorless is an answer to a question that hasn't been asked for awhile. At this point, other than the appeal of EVFs, the biggest appeal of mirrorless seems to be split between slightly smaller size (not actually a huge difference once you mount a lens, but still) and the ability to mount nearly any lens with an adapter. By keeping the k mount, you decrease the size difference (probably couldn't make it smaller than a KS-1 or kx) and make it so you can pretty much only mount k mount lenses. Which begs the question, what's the point?
EVF is always a benefit of MILC; see what sensor sees.
07-18-2017, 04:35 PM - 2 Likes   #473
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Or a drawback - see what sensor sees, then it would show you a lame approximation.

07-18-2017, 05:50 PM - 1 Like   #474
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Or a drawback - see what sensor sees, then it would show you a lame approximation.
Yep, a grainy, laggy 8-bit JPG version of reality. I have two of them on Sonys.

Apparently, if you spend $4000 they can improve on that EVF!
07-18-2017, 07:00 PM   #475
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They don't tell you the REAL point

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I think k mount mirrorless is an answer to a question that hasn't been asked for awhile. At this point, other than the appeal of EVFs, the biggest appeal of mirrorless seems to be split between slightly smaller size (not actually a huge difference once you mount a lens, but still) and the ability to mount nearly any lens with an adapter. By keeping the k mount, you decrease the size difference (probably couldn't make it smaller than a KS-1 or kx) and make it so you can pretty much only mount k mount lenses. Which begs the question, what's the point?
Less manufacturing costs (especially labor & health care for workers). At least according to the earlier discussion about the Sony MILC teardown. Trying to "sell" us on EVF's is like telling us 1.5 quart ice cream containers (compared to 1/2 gallon) is NOT inflationary, it's an "improvement in quality"!!

Last edited by goldenarrow; 07-18-2017 at 07:37 PM.
07-18-2017, 07:11 PM - 1 Like   #476
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
EVF is always a benefit of MILC; see what sensor sees.
Both parts of that statement are false.

First, you don't see what the sensor sees but the monitor's low fidelity rendition of it. (And actually the sensor in live EVF view is seldom run at exactly the shutter speed, aperture, and ISO parameters that the actual photo will use.)

Second, even if you saw what the sensor sees, it's not always a benefit. The sensor clips both the highlights and the shadows (the display worsens the clipping). But even if you saw the full DR of the sensor for true WYSIWYG, it's still not the whole scene. I'd rather have a what-you-see-is-what-is-possible (WYSIWIP) view that does not clip the ends of the tonality spectrum. (That's not to say I would not welcome a quick glimpse of an EVF just after I take a shot but I often don't want it before.)

Finally, an EVF will always lag even if the refresh rate is infinite and the sensor read rate were infinite because the whole system must wait for a sufficient number of new photons to accumulate to form a changed image in the sensor before it can be read, processes, and displayed.

There's ALWAYS some drawbacks to both EVF and OVF that drive different people to pick different designs.
07-18-2017, 07:35 PM   #477
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
I have two of them on Sonys.
That's what you get for buying $$$ony.

I have 4 EVFs....Pano/Oly/Fuji/Sammy....all work well.

---------- Post added 07-19-17 at 01:38 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
There's ALWAYS some drawbacks to both EVF and OVF that drive different people to pick different designs.
And for fence sitters theres the X pro 1/2(if ya wanta change lenses).
07-18-2017, 07:58 PM - 1 Like   #478
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
That's what you get for buying $$$ony.

I have 4 EVFs....Pano/Oly/Fuji/Sammy....all work well.
AFAIK, they're the same Epson EVF as the Sonys, Surfar.

As I understand it, nobody has worked as hard as Sony did with the A9 to reduce the defects of EVFs compared to OVFs. And it's at gigantic financial cost, including CPU cycles to keep up the frame rate.



07-18-2017, 08:47 PM - 1 Like   #479
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
AFAIK
I can see thru the 4 of them,just like the 3 in my Pentax Dslrs...they all work!
07-18-2017, 09:42 PM   #480
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A lot to read but interesting. I think I'll stay away mirror less for now. I'm still reading about my K3II. Very interesting reading. thanks guys
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