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07-19-2017, 12:16 AM   #481
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
I can see thru the 4 of them,just like the 3 in my Pentax Dslrs...they all work!
Something seriously wrong with your eyes if they see only in 8 bit, 2.4k dots, blown highlights, lag, and becoming laggier and grainier as the light lessens, Surfar!

Get your DSLR out, look through the OVF, then compare with Live View on the back LCD if you like.

07-19-2017, 12:21 AM - 1 Like   #482
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Ha Ha, @65 I don't read with glasses....and sure, the OVFS are good(especially K-1)....I have no problem with my EVFs or any that ive used of cameras I don't own.

Mind you I don't own a $ony and have never used one of their EVFs...

Maybe Clacka needs an eye check?
07-19-2017, 02:59 AM - 2 Likes   #483
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I just don't think the EVF versus OVF discussion will ever be decided. It is a very personal decision and people like one versus the other based on what they are used to using, their style of shooting, etc. If you like an OVF better, I don't see why people prefer EVFs should be able to say you're an idiot an need to get your eyes checked or vice versa.

I will say that the implementation of EVFs in many cameras is sub-optimal and while the A9 may not have any lag, there are plenty of EVFs that I have used that freeze when you are shooting and get plenty of lag/grain in darker situations. From a cost standpoint, if EVFs were so much cheaper to produce, then I would have thought that Sony cameras would be significantly cheaper than Canon/Nikon, but they don't seem to be.
07-19-2017, 03:16 AM - 2 Likes   #484
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It's the EVF fans who are praising EVFs to DSLR forums, not the other way around... just sayin'

Few years ago, the Discovery Channel was running a "celebrating diversity" campaign. Good advice.

07-19-2017, 09:51 AM   #485
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
.... and get plenty of lag/grain in darker situations.
This issue is an intrinsic design deficiency of the mirrorless technology. In low light conditions, the camera only has two choices: increase the shutter time (creating lag) or increase the ISO (creating grain). As long as people want to take pictures in about EV 6 to 10 conditions or darker (depending on the lens), they'll have to endure either lag or grain with a mirrorless camera.
07-19-2017, 10:32 AM   #486
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QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
This issue is an intrinsic design deficiency of the mirrorless technology. In low light conditions, the camera only has two choices: increase the shutter time (creating lag) or increase the ISO (creating grain). As long as people want to take pictures in about EV 6 to 10 conditions or darker (depending on the lens), they'll have to endure either lag or grain with a mirrorless camera.
So what? That hasn't stopped me from getting plenty of keepers after dark using an EVF. It's about the whole system, not just one component of it. The other system has slightly better IBIS and their lenses are
better wide open => a few more opportunities for handheld shots at reasonable ISOs. Tripod stuff would be the same. Honestly, why people get into such a tizwas about EVF vs OVF eludes me. Use what works for you best. The rest is mostly nonsense anyway.
07-19-2017, 11:05 AM   #487
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
I can see thru the 4 of them,just like the 3 in my Pentax Dslrs...they all work!
Ahh, one doesn't see 'through' an EVF, which is entirely the point of contention.
07-19-2017, 11:08 AM   #488
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K-3II & K-70 missing

Unless I'm missing something, neither the K-3II nor the K-70 appear on the Ricoh Imaging web site anymore. If you let your cursor hover over the "Products" link at the top of the home page, a drop down shows up with the 645Z, K-1, K-3II, K-70, Theta and KP. Clicking on the K-3II or K-70 takes you to another page which shows the 645Z, K-1, GRII, WG-M2, K-50, KP and WG-50, but not the K-3II or K-70. Don't know if that's intentional or accidental. I suppose we'll see in a few days when they finish updating the site and start taking orders again.

07-19-2017, 11:20 AM   #489
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^ Ha! Just noticed that. They're updating the site, so we'll see on July 21st.
07-19-2017, 11:43 AM   #490
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need some clarification please ,what is
EVF =
OVF =
and do you actually see through them ? or just an image on a screen.
07-19-2017, 11:48 AM   #491
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QuoteOriginally posted by elf photo Quote
need some clarification please ,what is
EVF =
OVF =
and do you actually see through them ? or just an image on a screen.
EVF is electronic viewfinder as seen in mirrorless camera's. You don't look through them, it is as a screen that shows so meting that happend a fractioneel of a second before.

OVF is traditional viewfinder as in SLR. So you look true them as they work with a mirror. The only downside is that you see the scene as it is in front of you in real time, but you don't see the picture you take, because the mirror will Block your view for the time to take the image.
07-19-2017, 11:50 AM   #492
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QuoteOriginally posted by elf photo Quote
need some clarification please ,what is
EVF =
OVF =
and do you actually see through them ? or just an image on a screen.
EVF is an electronic viewfinder and is basically a little screen that gives a digital read out from the sensor. It looks more or less like a tiny TV screen.

OVF is optical viewfinder and is what is present on SLRs. Using either a penta mirror or penta prism, they direct light up to the focusing screen where you can see it.

To me, both are showing what the lens sees, just in different ways as compared to range finders or other cameras where you aren't looking through the lens.
07-19-2017, 11:54 AM   #493
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QuoteOriginally posted by subsea Quote
Unless I'm missing something, neither the K-3II nor the K-70 appear on the Ricoh Imaging web site anymore. If you let your cursor hover over the "Products" link at the top of the home page, a drop down shows up with the 645Z, K-1, K-3II, K-70, Theta and KP. Clicking on the K-3II or K-70 takes you to another page which shows the 645Z, K-1, GRII, WG-M2, K-50, KP and WG-50, but not the K-3II or K-70. Don't know if that's intentional or accidental. I suppose we'll see in a few days when they finish updating the site and start taking orders again.
QuoteOriginally posted by The Squirrel Mafia Quote
^ Ha! Just noticed that. They're updating the site, so we'll see on July 21st.
Tomorrow (today in Japan) is a Thursday . The Theta 4K is still to be formally announced.
07-19-2017, 03:21 PM   #494
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QuoteOriginally posted by elf photo Quote
EVF =
is what you get with Fuji Xpro1/2
QuoteOriginally posted by elf photo Quote
OVF =
is what you get with Fuji Xpro1/2

Also in the Fixed lens X100 series, so anyone who likes to use both has the option of a normal Mirrorless or a ML Rangefinder type of thing.
07-19-2017, 03:40 PM   #495
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
is what you get with Fuji Xpro1/2

is what you get with Fuji Xpro1/2

Also in the Fixed lens X100 series, so anyone who likes to use both has the option of a normal Mirrorless or a ML Rangefinder type of thing.
The Fuji's RF-style OVF does not show the view through the lens making it useless for lenses wider than about 18 mm, longer telephoto, and macro.

A hybrid SLR OVF/EVF would be the ultimate design.
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