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01-24-2017, 12:34 PM - 6 Likes   #1021
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I have also read the whole thread and all the commentary here since the leaked pictures were available.

I think a lot of you are missing the point with this camera.

The market has for the past few years been saying (or shouting) small, light, portable, capable. That is what most of the various mirrorless cameras have been about. This is for hiking, travel photography, biking - those sorts of activities.

If you look at the leaked images of the KP then it is definitely small, and some of the leaked 'spec's' said it would be light due to more efficient electronics use.

The last Pentax digital camera that met the light weight (grams) definition was the K-01 at 560 grams. By comparison the K-S2 is 678 grams, the K-3 800 grams and the Fuji XT2 507 grams. As another reference point the ME Super (one of the smaller Pentax film cameras) is 445 grams

If the KP is about the same weight as the K-01, and still WR then it would make an ideal small light travel camera, and mid-level enthusiast DSLR. Especially when coupled with the Limited lenses. The fact the images show it with the DA 20-40mm Limited should be a clue about that - light weight (grams), good image quality, WR lens.

The fact when travelling there is always a weight verses capability trade-off.

I personally travel a lot. I would be very interested in a small, light, capable, ASP-C, WR, K-mount camera.

It seems the KP may very well fit this description, the specs when they are released will tell the story. Very interesting play by Pentax.

01-24-2017, 12:36 PM   #1022
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote

One nice thing: the flash is back!

I like the decision they made on the K-1. I think it should have carried over to their APS-C flagship this mid-line to flagship (yet to be determined) model. I'm also ok with them losing the top side lcd.... I can honestly say that I don't ever look at mine.

Last edited by jab2980; 01-24-2017 at 12:41 PM.
01-24-2017, 12:41 PM - 1 Like   #1023
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Frankly this looks like a very weird camera. The retro design is cool I guess, as are the hand grips, but the user interface looks like a step back in terms of usability. No top LCD, awkward front e-dial, and a super-sparse settings dial. What's the point of it when there's room for more settings, especially when you lose the top LCD? It looks like there's no Wi-Fi or GPS, either. It also looks like the main LCD could be about half an inch bigger.
I wouldn't call it weird - I quite like it, actually; but for the money it's not what we're used to expect from Pentax. This camera doesn't look as a flagship.
However, other brands' (APS-C and smaller) flagships are at different - higher - price points.
01-24-2017, 12:43 PM - 1 Like   #1024
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QuoteOriginally posted by FantasticMrFox Quote
I am not ignoring them - I think all things combined, both cameras are equal. The Pentax has in-body stabilisation etc., better ergonomics, whereas the Nikon has a more sophisticated flash system, slightly better image quality, and a better AF system.



The D7200 was a proper update of the D7100, with a new and better sensor, processor, video and connectivity (WiFi). The K3 II only got GPS, pixelshift and a minor software update to the AF system, but in turn lost the built-in flash. I think objectively the D7100 and K3 are equal, whereas the D7200 is clearly a better camera than the K3 II.
TBH, if you want a current Pentax camera with AF equal to or superior to the D7200 then you will be waiting for ever. Even when/if Pentax AF improves, by that stage it will be trailing a D7300 or successor, so same gap. Ricoh have had five years already and one has to conclude that Nikon-class AF is not on their agenda or they would have done it by now and supplied some more new modern lenses for APS-C (as distinct from FF) without which top quality AF is neutered anyway. I suspect that the cost of developing adequate new lenses for improved AF plays at least as much a part of Ricoh's decision as anything else. Bear in mind that iterating new camera bodies is also a way of selling off a stockpile of already manufactured lenses. Without a supply of new bodies, the lenses are worthless paperweights since no one will buy them. One has either to accept Pentax for what it is - there is plenty to like, after all - or move on.

01-24-2017, 12:45 PM   #1025
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I'm curious to see the specs. The features it obviously lacks from the K-3ii (no top LCD, it has a smaller battery) are also lacking in pro offerings from non-Canikon manufacturers (XT-2, Em-1, Gh4/5, A7 series). If the performance standards are up to par, and they've managed to make a powerful yet small K mount camera, I can see why they may have taken this route instead of trying to make another 7d/D500 competitor, given their market share. Remember that the K-S1, which the KP looks comparable to in size from the leaked pictures, was actually very similar in size to (or smaller than) the mirrorless cameras I just listed. And for those of us that prefer the size in hand of a DSLR, the front grip L option and battery grip look more than capable of filling that requirement. If this does indeed replace the K-3ii, some K-3ii owners may not want to upgrade, but some may. This camera might be something that looks like it might appeal to a larger group (comprised of both mirrorless and DLSR shooters) than any existing camera Pentax offers.

If the performance specs don't exceed or match the K-3ii, I take that all back (and also I think video needs to be improved if they seriously want to take on top of the line mirrorless cameras). But I see some sense in what they're doing is what I guess I'm trying to say.
01-24-2017, 12:51 PM - 1 Like   #1026
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Sorta looks like Pentax's version of the Nikon Df...
01-24-2017, 12:51 PM - 1 Like   #1027
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QuoteOriginally posted by interested_observer Quote
I don't understand the current naming convention in use - K-s2, K70, KP.....
Does any camera manufacturer have a logical naming convention? One that doesn't have inherent bottle necks and
potential dead ends? Pentax will once again face this problem with a successor to the K-1, (K-1+ ?, K-1II ?, K-1&More ?).

Once again I suggest a brave camera manufacturer break from the sequential naming schemes and simply release
a camera called "Howard". Followed by a camera called "Alice". And another called "Ted". The three may or may
not be related, doesn't matter. Resist the temptation to release "Howard Jr" or "Ted III". Just update Howard and
release the new Howard as "Howard". For those who really need to keep their pegs in order, it would be easy enough
to refer to each "Howard" by year of release. Thus, the 2017 Howard would be a successor to the 2015 Howard. Simple.
01-24-2017, 12:53 PM   #1028
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Frankly this looks like a very weird camera. The retro design is cool I guess, as are the hand grips, but the user interface looks like a step back in terms of usability. No top LCD, awkward front e-dial, and a super-sparse settings dial. What's the point of it when there's room for more settings, especially when you lose the top LCD? It looks like there's no Wi-Fi or GPS, either. It also looks like the main LCD could be about half an inch bigger.

That said, maybe there's a redeeming factor in the official specs, so we'll just have to wait until then! But for now this looks like a stripped-down K-1 to me, and more of a one-off model than a K-3 II replacement.

One nice thing: the flash is back!
That front e-dial looks, well, really silly to me. I wonder if the center of it is actually a button that could be assigned a function like shutter release.

I wonder how much power the rear display takes when displaying the kind of information you would expect on the top LCD as shown in the leaked images. I don't think this camera got enough battery; why didn't they move this thing to the Li90 like the K-5, -3, and -1 use?

It's weird. We got more dials and lost other stuff. The Live View button going to a collar for instance. I really want to read a good review of this thing before I lose too much faith but it's hard to understand so far.

01-24-2017, 12:57 PM - 1 Like   #1029
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QuoteOriginally posted by tvdtvdtvd Quote
Once again I suggest a brave camera manufacturer break from the sequential naming schemes and simply release
a camera called "Howard".
You can still buy a "Diana" if you'd like.
01-24-2017, 12:58 PM - 1 Like   #1030
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
TBH, if you want a current Pentax camera with AF equal to or superior to the D7200 then you will be waiting for ever. Even when/if Pentax AF improves, by that stage it will be trailing a D7300 or successor, so same gap. Ricoh have had five years already and one has to conclude that Nikon-class AF is not on their agenda or they would have done it by now and supplied some more new modern lenses for APS-C (as distinct from FF) without which top quality AF is neutered anyway. I suspect that the cost of developing adequate new lenses for improved AF plays at least as much a part of Ricoh's decision as anything else. Bear in mind that iterating new camera bodies is also a way of selling off a stockpile of already manufactured lenses. Without a supply of new bodies, the lenses are worthless paperweights since no one will buy them. One has either to accept Pentax for what it is - there is plenty to like, after all - or move on.
I know they will not catch up to Nikon, so I am not asking for a Nikon-level AF relative to what Nikons are doing at the same time. I am asking, in absolute terms, for an AF system that is capable of basic, reliable AF.C and tracking roughly on the level of the D7100 (a 4 year old model). If Pentax delivers that within the next two or three years (the time after which I will want to update my gear), I am a happy Pentaxian.
01-24-2017, 12:58 PM   #1031
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QuoteOriginally posted by NZ_Ross Quote
I have also read the whole thread and all the commentary here since the leaked pictures were available.

I think a lot of you are missing the point with this camera.

The market has for the past few years been saying (or shouting) small, light, portable, capable. That is what most of the various mirrorless cameras have been about. This is for hiking, travel photography, biking - those sorts of activities.
Very interesting play by Pentax.
If that's the point of the camera than there still is a K-3ii replacement to come.
Is the KP is meant to replace the K-3 lineage, then I am definitely missing the point with this camera...
01-24-2017, 01:01 PM   #1032
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QuoteOriginally posted by NZ_Ross Quote
The last Pentax digital camera that met the light weight (grams) definition was the K-01 at 560 grams
FWIW, K-x is 580g with 4 AA batteries. It could have been even lighter if they used the conventional D LI90 battery.
01-24-2017, 01:04 PM - 1 Like   #1033
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobbotron Quote
This is seriously a good plan for modding it to your needs.

I do wood working, if I bought this camera, I'd definitely consider making my own bolt on grip if the mating surface isn't too weird of a shape.
Hmmmm,
Brazilian Rosewood, Kingwood, or Gabon Ebony sounds pretty good right now.
01-24-2017, 01:04 PM   #1034
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QuoteOriginally posted by tvdtvdtvd Quote
Does any camera manufacturer have a logical naming convention? One that doesn't have inherent bottle necks and
potential dead ends? Pentax will once again face this problem with a successor to the K-1, (K-1+ ?, K-1II ?, K-1&More ?).
Pentax has been all over the map in terms of naming conventions - *ist/xx
  • Small - Q, Q7, Q10, Q-s1
  • entry level - K100D K100D Super, K200D, KM, KX, K2000, k-500, K-s1
  • ???? level - K-01, K-30, K-50, K-70, K-s2
  • advanced - K10, K20, K5, K5II/K5IIs, K3/K3II
  • full frame - K1
  • medium format - 645D, 645Z
So, where does KP fit into this jumbled mess?

Numbers, Letters, Hieroglyphics? Who knows any more. Perhaps just give me a roadmap.... I have no idea as to where Pentax is going/headed. ...and they are coming from all over the place - and heading to wherever (do they even know)?

01-24-2017, 01:05 PM   #1035
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QuoteOriginally posted by NZ_Ross Quote
I have also read the whole thread and all the commentary here since the leaked pictures were available.

I think a lot of you are missing the point with this camera.

The market has for the past few years been saying (or shouting) small, light, portable, capable. That is what most of the various mirrorless cameras have been about. This is for hiking, travel photography, biking - those sorts of activities.

If you look at the leaked images of the KP then it is definitely small, and some of the leaked 'spec's' said it would be light due to more efficient electronics use.

The last Pentax digital camera that met the light weight (grams) definition was the K-01 at 560 grams. By comparison the K-S2 is 678 grams, the K-3 800 grams and the Fuji XT2 507 grams. As another reference point the ME Super (one of the smaller Pentax film cameras) is 445 grams

If the KP is about the same weight as the K-01, and still WR then it would make an ideal small light travel camera, and mid-level enthusiast DSLR. Especially when coupled with the Limited lenses. The fact the images show it with the DA 20-40mm Limited should be a clue about that - light weight (grams), good image quality, WR lens.

The fact when travelling there is always a weight verses capability trade-off.

I personally travel a lot. I would be very interested in a small, light, capable, ASP-C, WR, K-mount camera.

It seems the KP may very well fit this description, the specs when they are released will tell the story. Very interesting play by Pentax.
good analysis of its target. I have the XT1 and it is a great travel camera, I wish it had the 20-40 as part of that kit it is an ideal short zoom (or that they made the 18-55 in wr because the 16-50 is too cumbersome as good as it is)
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