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01-18-2017, 03:09 PM - 1 Like   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Topsy Quote
Very interesting actually. I never really researched them but I always thought that picture quality wise Nikon was better than Canon?
You'd hope that that's what people would look out for..
My friend, a Canon 7D (not the mark II, the original) shooter, has 4 beautiful 20" x 30" metallic prints hanging on her wall which she took. I doubt that if I took it with my K-1 the prints would be that much better, if at all. Perhaps i could get away with less aggressive noise reduction, but even then I don't think it would make hardly any difference.

My point is that yes Nikon and Pentax do have sensors which have higher signal to noise ratios and also have higher dynamic range. But in real life prints, with post processing software as advanced as it is today, it rarely comes into play.

A more important factor is that any newbie can walk into any Best Buy, Target, Walmart Etc and buy a Canon.
And even if that newbie didn't buy it there at a brick and mortar store, he would go home and buy it on Amazon because he knew what a Canon looked like because he saw one at a store...or his other friends had one...or one of the salesman tried to sell him one etc.

And for the small percentage of newbies that progress and buy more than the kit lens, it will be from then on Canon gear.

01-18-2017, 03:43 PM   #17
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Hmmm .... for 2012, Canon, Nikon and Pentax add up to 93% of the market. For 2017, Canon, Nikon and Ricoh add up to 99.7% market share. If I understand it correctly, Sigma is the only other company still manufacturing a DSLR, so they must have 0.3%. Everyone else (Sony, Fujifilm, Panasonic etc) has gone to interchangeable lens with EVF. So while the figures are of some interest, they show only a portion of the battlefield.
01-18-2017, 03:51 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Imp Quote
Aaand... back down to 4.8% from 6.7%. Interesting. Obviously it fluctuates, but when the market share is so small, then it seems to fluctuate a lot! Curious

Me too. I also find it curious. My question personally is what will it mean in 5-10 years ? Is the writing on the wall. Nobody can know right now of course, just speculate.

Puts me in mind of a line in the poem ...Desiderata.

"And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should. "
01-18-2017, 03:57 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by PJ1 Quote
Hmmm .... for 2012, Canon, Nikon and Pentax add up to 93% of the market. For 2017, Canon, Nikon and Ricoh add up to 99.7% market share. If I understand it correctly, Sigma is the only other company still manufacturing a DSLR, so they must have 0.3%. Everyone else (Sony, Fujifilm, Panasonic etc) has gone to interchangeable lens with EVF. So while the figures are of some interest, they show only a portion of the battlefield.
Sony released a SLT last year, so A mount isn't completely dead...

The Sigma SD1 is nearly 6 years old and they just released a mirrorless...

01-18-2017, 04:04 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by boriscleto Quote
Retail stores are on the way out in the US but what about the rest of the world?
I'm not sure-

I ignorantly assumed the Amazon effect was global, or at least not limited to the U.S. Maybe they are more protective of their brick & mortar stores in other countries.
01-18-2017, 04:10 PM   #21
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Interesting to see Ricoh has more share than Sony in Japan.
It is just my feeling, but I think, I see electronic stores in Tokyo / Kanto area offers more space for Sony camera than Ricoh + Pentax. Pentax booth in both Biccamera and Yodobashi near where i live got about haft the size of what Sony currently have. And every time I visit one of those store regardless of new or use, there are always people (mostly young people) trying something in Sony booth and I am almost always the only one in Pentax booth. It could be, they are run out of K-3II and no Q, so they only show lenses, K-1 and K-whatever still in production which is not many.
01-18-2017, 04:47 PM   #22
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DSLR sales only and only in Japan .

Nothing to do with mirrorless

---------- Post added 18th Jan 2017 at 18:52 ----------

Seem the biggest seller in Japan is Canon EOS Kiss X7 in a 2 lenses kit who sell for 48000 yen introduced in 2013 !!


Last edited by bobmaxja; 01-18-2017 at 04:54 PM.
01-18-2017, 05:32 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by lightbox Quote
I'm not sure-

I ignorantly assumed the Amazon effect was global, or at least not limited to the U.S. Maybe they are more protective of their brick & mortar stores in other countries.
Yet Amazon is prepping retail stores..
01-18-2017, 07:19 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
Yet Amazon is prepping retail stores..
I read something about that. It'll be interesting to see what they do with them, but my feeling is that they will just be a means of introducing more people to the Amazon brand. Maybe they'll carry a few things, but more importantly let the customer order items through kiosks. And serve as a convenient place to drop off returns (hopefully).
01-18-2017, 08:24 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by lightbox Quote
I read something about that. It'll be interesting to see what they do with them, but my feeling is that they will just be a means of introducing more people to the Amazon brand. Maybe they'll carry a few things, but more importantly let the customer order items through kiosks. And serve as a convenient place to drop off returns (hopefully).
Yes, for now the model seems to be small to medium sized shops featuring more of the popular Amazon sold items..

Not sure where that is headed, but it looks to be partly grocery from what I read. In any case, the fact that a warehouse/online oriented business is looking to branch out into brick and mortar shops tells me physical storefronts aren't a thing of the past.

It is just like when tablets were huge a couple of years ago.. the bulk of the internet, including the tech pages, were saying the day of the desktop were over. But they failed to realize not everyone wants to do business, create media, or play games on a tablet form-factor. Desktops live.. much smaller userbase but seems not to be shrinking into oblivion.

Similarly.. there will always be brick and mortar shops.. even for electronics.. the human itch to touch and have it now is irresistible to many. Plus some just don't like to do business online, would rather deal with a person than a chat window or phone call.
01-18-2017, 09:13 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by dcshooter Quote
The vast majority of SLRs sold are entry level bodies purchased by people who never take the kit lens off the camera, and for whom picture quality between entry level bodies is indistinguishable.
QuoteOriginally posted by bobmaxja Quote
Seem the biggest seller in Japan is Canon EOS Kiss X7 in a 2 lenses kit who sell for 48000 yen introduced in 2013 !!
Since I (re)started paying attention to the Japanese market, one thing I was very much impressed by Canon and was not impressed by Nikon and PENTAX is the marketing of entry level bodies. Each of Canon's promotion videos tends to be made to sell one idea effectively. That one idea tends to be that Canon is the brand for quick moving subjects like kids even for entry level bodies (though they rarely forget to produce more videos to focus on other things).

Look at these two videos for example, they were for the Japanese market and for entry level EOS bodies (in Japan marketed as EOS Kiss series):

The message is clear: "Hey young parents, if you want to freeze your kids' fast action in time, EOS Kiss is the king, with our fast focusing and reliable tracking and things, we're second to none, think about all of these wonderful moments you could capture using EOS Kiss!".
Whether or not that message is true, Canon knows very well that their reputation for producing high end fast sport and wild life shooting bodies is an invaluable asset, and they try very hard to capitalize on it, and they are getting some success out of it.

Compare that with Nikon's entry level offerings:

I'd say "meh" at best.

Last edited by kwb; 01-18-2017 at 09:19 PM.
01-18-2017, 09:14 PM   #27
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Are there Pentax TV commercials in Japan?
01-18-2017, 09:22 PM - 1 Like   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by mee Quote
Are there Pentax TV commercials in Japan?
Up until K50, yes, as far as I remember, but I might be wrong. Let me find them for you.

OK, found some.

These are also meh.

Last edited by kwb; 01-18-2017 at 09:30 PM.
01-18-2017, 11:54 PM - 1 Like   #29
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Main Nikon problem here, that got a lot of people mad and frustrated , was policy of persuading client its their fault for all that factory failures in cameras, then it falls from client onto shop sellers,product menagers etc- it gets them into promoting one brand over another even in entry level line-just stay out from the line of fire. Most common problem in Nikon system is camera body rubber to peel off. And its not releated to DSLR level- if it has any rubber, there is a good chance it will just fall off.
01-19-2017, 12:36 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobmaxja Quote
DSLR sales only and only in Japan .

Nothing to do with mirrorless
I see, thanks for point that out. Sony is for sure one of the leader in that market.
According to the given link,

Mirror-less market:
  1. Olympus 26.8
  2. Canon 18.5%
  3. Sony 17.9%

Last edited by pakinjapan; 01-19-2017 at 12:42 AM.
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