[luftfluss]

It's not you who is suffering, but the camera sales.
By the way, you can upgrade to a much better VF right now - go get your K-1, what are you waiting for?

You're right, I could upgrade to the K-1, but the price is a wee bit out of my comfort zone!

It's also probably not helpful to them that none of my camera gear was bought new.

[clackers]

When the total sales have declined over the last 3-4 years, some companies are targeting high cost high profit products. Sony and Fuji are leading that pack, and Nikon has been pumping FF cameras and somehow neglecting DX market. Canon on the other hand has been more stable, I guess. They still sell more than all other companies combined, and I think though they lost revenue they lost less then others (percentage-wise). I hope I'm looking at right numbers, by the way.
Pentax... I cannot understand Pentax's strategy. Maybe it's me.
That's how I see.
And I don't care who loses how much, I don't see the companies will recover if they don't change their strategy ASAP. Most buyers don't need faster cameras or more MP or faster AF or more AF points. I don't have the answer to recover the decline, but to me it's obvious that existing strategies will not cut it.

I think like everyone else, Canon are chasing the premium market too, with the 5DSR and 5D MkIV.

With high volume, low margins, the supermarket pricing wars of 2011-2015 seemed to be a race to the bottom that hurt all its players.

Pentax could never be a participant, luckily, and last year the 'Other' division of Ricoh it's in actually showed a profit.

With the K-1 and 645Z, it's selling to a small number of cashed up enthusiasts instead of to the soccer moms, who are now just using their phones for pictures, to the despair of Canon/Nikon/Sony.

Moving to a premium brand isn't great news for most Pentaxians because the new lenses and bodies have tended to be feature packed and costly, but as you say, companies have to do something about the nasty industry results.

[RonHendriks1966]

In another thread at august 5th I commented about this years first quarterly report from Ricoh. That is the quarter from april 1th to June 30th. The quarter the K-1 was introduced and had good numbers for Ricoh.

I think the Beancounters are happy to.

Other
Sales in the Other segment increased by 6.7% as compared to the previous corresponding period, to ¥28.4 billion due to the increase in income and profit in the Camera business and Leasing business. As a result, operating profit in the Other segment increased by 292.6% as compared to the previous corresponding period, to ¥1.5 billion.

Not easy to see how it works out for camera, since it is in a mix with others. My guess to this is a growth in camera sales of maybe up to 30 %. That is very good. Remember that the last month of the quarter had almost no sales of K-1 because of the quake.

The forcast for the coming year is a growth of 10 %. Well the current quarter is also infected with the quake. At some point sales of K-1 would go down a bit. They forsee increase in sales for this fiscal year.

It is far to early to make a judgement about that future. Pentax sold around 20.000 K-1's and had no trouble doing so. Those where the people waiting for it to come. Then there where June and july with not so much sales due to the quake. So with the current production capacity Ricoh could produce 50.000 K-1's in 2016, sinds it missed the months januari, februari, June, juli and part of March for production. That is maybe a big number for Pentax, but compared to 6D or D750 it isn't that much.


There is one thing more to this report. Figures are great. Profit is made. All excellent. But also they sold far less camera units then before. While Theta, K-1 and some new D-FA-lenses are making the sales, we do not know wich is wich. My analysis is that Ricoh sold the least amount of units K-mount camera's in the last quarter then they did in the past 5 years. So they have less unique customers then before. Part of that is the declining market, but part is also something we see in this forum and elsewhere. People who use Pentax, buy the K-1 and sell the camera they have. So enough K-5ii, K-3, K-5iis, K-3ii in the second hand market. They sell to get fund for the K-1 and new lenses. No problem there, the camera's are still in use with enthusiast Pentaxians. Downside to this is less sales for Ricoh in the Other models in shops. In the last quarter there where last stock K-3, K-S1 and K-50. But also K-3ii and K-S2 had a hard time to leave shops. With the much higher price for the K-1 the sales figures and profit where good, but it missed sales in lower tiers. Otherwise sales in yen would have been much higher. So less customers at Ricoh's doorstep. Let's see how that develops for the rest of the year.

When looking good there are things to read and analyse from Ricoh's report.

[Kunzite]

IIRC your "analysis" was hogwash. You don't know what is the Ricoh Imaging's sales volume, and you're speculating on that.

[lesmore49]

Frankly, prior to the great digital conversion last decade I don't think SLR sales were 'robust'. I think we're returning to the regular SLR turnover in the west and waiting for higher growth in ASEAN countries. Canon and Nikon overbuilt to supply American soccer moms and the sensor upgrade cycle. Those soccer babies are now $50,000 a year college students and the camera is on a shelf. The big sensor R&D is directed to machine vision (autonomous cars and robots).

Cameras are too good now. It won't matter what anyone introduces. I don't need a camera until my K-1 breaks.

But...but...I still have my working Pentax S1a SLR that I bought new in 1968, however because I became a camera enthusiast I continued buying additional camera bodies and lenses since then.

I do agree with you though.

As you have said, I also do believe that the market is returning to the regular SLR level as we saw back in the film days. I am also a vintage car enthusiast and hit a lot of outdoor hot rod shows in the summer. I've done this for years. Back in the film days, I was part of a very small group at these shows...those carrying 35mm/ medium format SLR/TLR, rangefinder 35 equipment....yes there were more who carried point and shoot 35s at the shows.

About 5-8 years ago , now in the digital days, I noted more than a few DSLR toting people at these shows....also some P&S digital cameras.

The past couple of years...it's no... and I mean ...no P& S digital cameras...but many use cell phones and many times I'm the only guy walking around with a DSLR....anymore.

Kind of like the old times....just the odd enthusiast with a SLR.

The novelty of a sophisticated DSLR has worn off for most who dipped their toe in this pricey water and now they use their excellent little Cell phone cameras....and as you say their novelty DSLR sits alone and unloved, on a shelf or in a closet.

Me...I've got a cell phone camera...never use it though. It's hard to break my almost 50 year habit of carrying and using sophisticated cameras....Pentax SLR's, Olympus, Leica Rangefinder, Mamiya medium format, etc...and now in the digital age....one of my Pentax DSLR bodies mit lens.

[monochrome]

I can't say I still have an S1a from 1968 but I still have a KX from 1977

[biz-engineer]

Cameras are too good now. It won't matter what anyone introduces. I don't need a camera until my K-1 breaks.

That what I was telling myself when I purchased the K3 :-)

[thibs]

I still see P&S here and there but those are mostly GR kind of P&S (if that's still an appropriate term), Sony's RX etc.

[jonlg]

I find Pentax position in the market frustrating. They have introduced some truly amazing cameras over the past 5-7 years - K5, K3, K1, K70, 645Z. Each could stake a claim to being the best overall option in its market segment - the K1 for example consummately outperforms the Canon EOS 5D Mk4 in every area except autofocus - it has more resolution, better weatherproofing, better image quality in low light, more features and yet is almost half the price of the Canon and yet I bet the EOS 5dMk4 will outsell the K1 across the world. This is probably because at that level people are already invested in a lens system and are reluctant to change. The biggest issue though I think is one of visibility. The Mum's who buy a DSLR to take pics of their kids buy a Canon or a Nikon because when they walk into the high street that is what is available to buy. You have to actually hunt for a Pentax in a very limited range of high street stores or you have to order online sight unseen as I did with the K1.

My Sister in law owns a DSLR, she uses it mainly to photograph the family - it's a Canon - why? well I guess she sees their magazine ads and when she walked into a high street store that's what the shop have in stock and are selling. Quite how Pentax can address this I don't know. While high street camera stores sales volumes are down v online they are very important in planting a seed of desire in a customer. I work at London Heathrow and it always depresses me to go into the very large Dixons electronics store there to see they sell Canon, Nikon, Sony, Leica, Olympus and Fuji but not one single Pentax. Getting into large airport stores with millions of people passing through every year would be a good start for Pentax I think...

Jonlg

[RonHendriks1966]

IIRC your "analysis" was hogwash. You don't know what is the Ricoh Imaging's sales volume, and you're speculating on that.

My analysis for the second quarter in the midds of the quake production fallout was that Ricoh-Imaging sold 25 % less then in the first quarter. I think you also qualified it as hogwash. Well you are very consistent in not understanding these financial reports.

[Kunzite]

"You don't understand", says the man who thought Ricoh Imaging should cancel the K-1

[afan137]

My analysis for the second quarter in the midds of the quake production fallout was that Ricoh-Imaging sold 25 % less then in the first quarter. I think you also qualified it as hogwash. Well you are very consistent in not understanding these financial reports.

Suddenly many financial experts appearing in pentaxforums.

[RonHendriks1966]

I find Pentax position in the market frustrating. They have introduced some truly amazing cameras over the past 5-7 years - K5, K3, K1, K70, 645Z. Each could stake a claim to being the best overall option in its market segment - the K1 for example consummately outperforms the Canon EOS 5D Mk4 in every area except autofocus - it has more resolution, better weatherproofing, better image quality in low light, more features and yet is almost half the price of the Canon and yet I bet the EOS 5dMk4 will outsell the K1 across the world. This is probably because at that level people are already invested in a lens system and are reluctant to change. The biggest issue though I think is one of visibility. The Mum's who buy a DSLR to take pics of their kids buy a Canon or a Nikon because when they walk into the high street that is what is available to buy. You have to actually hunt for a Pentax in a very limited range of high street stores or you have to order online sight unseen as I did with the K1.

My Sister in law owns a DSLR, she uses it mainly to photograph the family - it's a Canon - why? well I guess she sees their magazine ads and when she walked into a high street store that's what the shop have in stock and are selling. Quite how Pentax can address this I don't know. While high street camera stores sales volumes are down v online they are very important in planting a seed of desire in a customer. I work at London Heathrow and it always depresses me to go into the very large Dixons electronics store there to see they sell Canon, Nikon, Sony, Leica, Olympus and Fuji but not one single Pentax. Getting into large airport stores with millions of people passing through every year would be a good start for Pentax I think...

Jonlg

Last year I had some hours at Gatwick and there was also everything you would like to buy in camera gear, but not a single Pentax. The Ricoh Theta S was there! With no presence in such stores you can't expect people to buy Pentax.

[monochrome]

Last year I had some hours at Gatwick and there was also everything you would like to buy in camera gear, but not a single Pentax. The Ricoh Theta S was there! With no presence in such stores you can't expect people to buy Pentax.

Ron: There would be no profit to Ricoh on things they could sell there. They don't want to sell there (at least not now). Theta is a high volume, $300 consumer product. Maybe Theta will be the beachhead product that eventually gives Pentax a global distribution platform.

[RonHendriks1966]

Ron: There would be no profit to Ricoh on things they could sell there. They don't want to sell there (at least not now). Theta is a high volume, $300 consumer product. Maybe Theta will be the beachhead product that eventually gives Pentax a global distribution platform.

The problem here is that Theta is A Ricoh Brand and for people outside the bubble there is no connection to Pentax.

(I see you live in Missouri, maybe I'm going to visit Kansas City end of may)