[npc]

It is unusual for such a compact camera to have the option of a battery grip at all

There are quite a few cameras that are more compact and have optional grips. But it is unusual for a non-flagship Pentax DSLR to have one

[mee]

There are quite a few cameras that are more compact and have optional grips. But it is unusual for a non-flagship Pentax DSLR to have one

Good point.. I hadn't realized that.. this is a mid-tier body that has an optional battery grip. That is unusual since those are indeed normally offered only on the high end bodies. Interesting.

Perhaps the traditional model of low, middle, high is over?

[btnapa]

Canon 5D Mk III and Nikon D750/810 users would dominate the wedding industry, but they're only capable of HD as well.

You own more than one lens, right, Btnapa, because they do different things?

And as a pro, you would own more than one body, too.

Best practice would say, buy a video camera. It's the tool for the job. You'd get a GH5 or Red to go with your stills shooting. That's a business case you construct for yourself.

Me, I'll just use my phone for 4k casual shooting. I'm like you. As posts in this forum have shown in the past, and as Ricoh seems to indicate in its marketing of stills quality, most Pentaxians don't care for video at all. We're not alone.

Now, video capability comes not from software, which is easy, but the underlying hardware. The older HD encoder chipsets are proven and cheap, so that's why the K-1 is as affordable as it is.

I did not want the K-1 to cost one more cent than it had to, or be delayed in release for one more day than it had to, to incorporate a feature for the benefit of a wedding videographer who doesn't want to buy and pack an extra camera.

Of course, the 4k video motherboards will naturally become cheaper and will make their way into all cameras (including Ricoh's) as 1080 ones did, so this will eventually become a moot point.

The Fujitsu Milbeaut chipset used by Nikon, Pentax, Leica and Sigma only recently released a 4k capable version, which is in the Nikon D5 and D500 launched last year. That chipset will come down in price.

You have lots of good point. I would say that categorically I agree with all your point. You know a lot more about the guts of the cameras than I so, I will differ to your knowledge in that area.

I know I can add a GH5 or Sony to do the 4K video duties. Red is out of my price range, nor do I need that high end of a system. My hope was to get it done with one system, my Pentax, as it is possible with Sony A7RII or Sony A99II. It does not look like Pentax is going to give us a camera in the capability of the Sony's I just mentioned. So the options are complete switch or a two system solution. I might opt for the two system solution as I love my K1. Perhaps let a pair of A6500s do the 4K lifting duties. Use my FA limiteds in manual mode for certain shots that do not need autofocus or tracking.

Personally, I do not care for video capability. However, since I am shooting for work, and the fact that I am increasingly getting requests for video, I cannot ignore it anymore. That is why I am even talking about the subject here. Otherwise, I could care less about video.

BTW, I would have faced the same dilemma if I had a Canon or Nikon for a system. I am a former long time Canon shooter. They (Canon) are just as lost as the rest of the bunch and trying to deal with the Sony juggernaut that is trying to eat everyone's lunch!

[NZ_Ross]

BTW, I would have faced the same dilemma if I had a Canon or Nikon for a system. I am a former long time Canon shooter. They (Canon) are just as lost as the rest of the bunch and trying to deal with the Sony juggernaut that is trying to eat everyone's lunch!

Sony also has deep expertise in dedicated professional video, so they have had a definite advantage there.

[Mistral75]

(...) Nikon is hemmoraghing money (...)

(...)

Nikon is hemorrhaging money (...)

Nikon are not haemorrhaging money. They make less money now than they did in the past but their figures are still black.

Net sales



Ordinary Income / Ordinary Income to Net Sales



Net Sales by Quarter



Ordinary Income by Quarter

[monochrome]

Just Imaging or including Nikon Precision?

[beholder3]

This is Nikon Imaging based on their own IR data:





Still making money (if you consider operating income "making money"), but at the current speed of collapsing they will hit the zero OI in three years. And products in the last three years have not been found good enough in the market to slow the decline.

[monochrome]

Perhaps I should have written 'losing market share' or 'suffering from strong decline in sales volume,' but the point was to question using outlet pricing* on the D810 as a fair comparison to list price on the K-1.

* it turns out the 'low price' examples were from disreputable sellers.

[Mistral75]

Just Imaging or including Nikon Precision?

The bar charts above are for Nikon as a whole (consolidated figures).

[lowlight]

As someone who has rarely posted on this forum but quite often uses it for the excellent lens reviews, I thought I would comment about this camera as it does look very interesting indeed. I'm a keen 35mm film photographer with old Pentax cameras and some vintage Pentax glass, and have a cheap compact digital camera for point and shoot convenience. I've been researching DSLRs both full frame and with smaller sensors (e.g APS-C and 1" as in Sony RX10 range) for years (and I mean about 8 years which is ridiculous) without actually pulling the trigger on anything. I do want a degree of weather resistance and stabilisation for run and gun video. I wasn't sure about spending the money, but also knew something would follow with more of the features I wanted, so I kept waiting for better cameras to come onto the market. It's fair to say technological advances especially in sensor design have been rapid over the last decade so actually I'm glad I've waited. I'm sure there are lots of people like me who fall into that category. My main aim was to get a reasonably priced mid-range camera that could also shoot genuinely decent and nicely stabilised video at a good bitrate, especially in low light. An example would include the Sony A7sii which, alas, is beyond my price range.

I've finally this morning bought a Sony RX10 which is a very good weatherised run and gun video camera as well as being a more than acceptable stills camera. And guess what, an hour or two later this Pentax KP shows up online. I did consider Pentax mid-range cameras such s the K-50 etc, which seem to be exceptional value. But movie mode in Pentax has always (so far anyway) fallen behind other manufacturers and is basically unsatisfactory if you are serious about it - I've checked loads of video examples, and the moment you move the camera the image quality just starts to fall to pieces. I appreciate some here may disagree with that view, but really I was hoping for something better from Pentax.

What has impressed me about this KP is its extraordinary high ISO capabilities (yet to be fully tested), probably very good stills IQ, a weatherproofed body and upgraded IS - and I can mount PK vintage lenses. Brilliant. Prices are likely to come down after launch too. So to a potential customer like me with no strong preference for a particular manufacturer, this camera appeals. I'm sure there are others looking for the same sort of features I am, so I just wanted to say I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of interest is shown towards this camera from non-Pentax users. I'm looking forward to comprehensive reviews to check out image quality and video and may end up buying one for shooting stills and video in poor lighting and bad weather conditions, while using the Sony RX10 for daylight. I wouldn't say the KP is cheap of course, but it really does seem to tick a lot of boxes.

[Tatouzou]

Don't try to derail discussion from shaming Ricoh for removal of top screen, really bad AF with non-working tracking, non-metal top plate (and overall bad quality), inclusion of stupid third control wheel system, interchangeable hand grips that will definitely get detached from the camera while in use and sensor that gives same or worse image quality as in K-5

Why are you so angry: if you dont like KP's specs and design, nobody ask you to buy it.
If you want flagship features, then wait for the K3 replacement which will probably be announced within a few weeks/months.
If you dont like Pentax offerings, then buy another brand.

[Foxbat]

Why are you so angry: if you dont like KP's specs and design, nobody ask you to buy it.
If you want flagship features, then wait for the K3 replacement which will probably be announced within a few weeks/months.
If you dont like Pentax offerings, then buy another brand.

There's a smiley face at the end of that message for a reason - you should work on your internet irony detection.

[bxf]

Why are you so angry: if you dont like KP's specs and design, nobody ask you to buy it.
If you want flagship features, then wait for the K3 replacement which will probably be announced within a few weeks/months.
If you dont like Pentax offerings, then buy another brand.

I believe Foxbat was being sarcastic.

Edit: Ha, beat me!

[Tatouzou]

As someone who has rarely posted on this forum but quite often uses it for the excellent lens reviews, I thought I would comment about this camera as it does look very interesting indeed. I'm a keen 35mm film photographer with old Pentax cameras and some vintage Pentax glass, and have a cheap compact digital camera for point and shoot convenience. I've been researching DSLRs both full frame and with smaller sensors (e.g APS-C and 1" as in Sony RX10 range) for years (and I mean about 8 years which is ridiculous) without actually pulling the trigger on anything. I do want a degree of weather resistance and stabilisation for run and gun video. I wasn't sure about spending the money, but also knew something would follow with more of the features I wanted, so I kept waiting for better cameras to come onto the market. It's fair to say technological advances especially in sensor design have been rapid over the last decade so actually I'm glad I've waited. I'm sure there are lots of people like me who fall into that category. My main aim was to get a reasonably priced mid-range camera that could also shoot genuinely decent and nicely stabilised video at a good bitrate, especially in low light. An example would include the Sony A7sii which, alas, is beyond my price range.

I've finally this morning bought a Sony RX10 which is a very good weatherised run and gun video camera as well as being a more than acceptable stills camera. And guess what, an hour or two later this Pentax KP shows up online. I did consider Pentax mid-range cameras such s the K-50 etc, which seem to be exceptional value. But movie mode in Pentax has always (so far anyway) fallen behind other manufacturers and is basically unsatisfactory if you are serious about it - I've checked loads of video examples, and the moment you move the camera the image quality just starts to fall to pieces. I appreciate some here may disagree with that view, but really I was hoping for something better from Pentax.

What has impressed me about this KP is its extraordinary high ISO capabilities (yet to be fully tested), probably very good stills IQ, a weatherproofed body and upgraded IS - and I can mount PK vintage lenses. Brilliant. Prices are likely to come down after launch too. So to a potential customer like me with no strong preference for a particular manufacturer, this camera appeals. I'm sure there are others looking for the same sort of features I am, so I just wanted to say I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of interest is shown towards this camera from non-Pentax users. I'm looking forward to comprehensive reviews to check out image quality and video and may end up buying one for shooting stills and video in poor lighting and bad weather conditions, while using the Sony RX10 for daylight. I wouldn't say the KP is cheap of course, but it really does seem to tick a lot of boxes.

If you want to try a Pentax DSLR, want a rugged pro-level building quality, and dont need a tilt screen, best bang for your money today are the outgoing K3 and K3-II. IMO, the KP is an interesting new design but it is not in the same league and the high price tag is just because it is the newest model. Compared to K3/K3-II, it is only worth it if you are interested in its specific features or smaller size and weight.

The claimed high ISO better performance is, IMO, as regards the new sensor, probably around 0,6 EV, which means the raw output of KP at ISO 5000 should be close to that of K3/K3-II at ISO 3200.
If you look at the high ISO samples on Ricoh-Pentax website, (Features1 | PENTAX KP | RICOH IMAGING) you vill see that, even at VGA screen size, pictures above ISO 12800 are very noisy and low definition.
The ISO 819200 setting is just marketing hype, the claimed high ISO improvements thanks to better processing apply only to JPEG output, which is not good in K3 at ISO 3200 and above, you get better IQ by proocessing the raw files in your computer (whereas up to ISO 1600, save in high contrast or badlit scenes, the out of camera JPEGs are nice).

[lowlight]

Thanks Tatouzou. I do need a tilt screen for waist/chest high shooting but as you say those cameras you mention are good and meet some of my criteria. I did look at them. The ISO 819200 setting will I've no doubt look like a blotchy mess if all they are doing is ramping up gain regardless, but importantly at lower ISOs between 51,200-102,400 half-decent image quality might be just about salvageable. Also I am hoping for better video quality than Pentax have so far provided and hoping the KP could provide it, but is this is the triumph of hope over experience? We'll just have to wait for full testing.