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02-05-2017, 11:54 AM   #166
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote
Some High ISO samples from Ricoh's facebook page:


Pretty impressive examples... Are they direct from the camera as JPEG files or RAW files that have been post processed?

02-05-2017, 11:56 AM   #167
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
A lot of the points emerging on this thread do beg the question of what exactly an APS-C flagship would have over the KP which would make it worth buying - or manufacturing. Not much all that much, it might appear. $1500 for a bigger battery and a slightly better buffer? That's quite expensive I'm sure another Pentax camera will appear before long but it may not be the camera people are expecting just as the KP isn't really what folks were expecting.
Large buffer and high FPS for sport.
A better AF module than the 3 years old already found in K3, for example covering most of the actual image than just the center.
Hardware meant to endure and stay operational for a long time rather than having K30/K50 actuator given for 50K shots and K30/K50 apperture control that tend to fail so often.
Finally a decent video mode (I doubt it and do not care, but some do).
Great thetering with all software in the market.
A 25 or 50 iso mode
SR that good enough for 1s or 2s shooting duration.
Keep subject sharp even on slow shutter speed thanks to advanced sofware processing. A bit like a huge improvement on the pixell shift technology on moving subjects. Our brain do it, TVs do it. Why not cameras?
02-05-2017, 11:59 AM   #168
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nicolas06 Quote
Large buffer and high FPS for sport.
A better AF module than the 3 years old already found in K3, for example covering most of the actual image than just the center.
Hardware meant to endure and stay operational for a long time rather than having K30/K50 actuator given for 50K shots and K30/K50 apperture control that tend to fail so often.
Finally a decent video mode (I doubt it and do not care, but some do).
Great thetering with all software in the market.
A 25 or 50 iso mode
SR that good enough for 1s or 2s shooting duration.
Keep subject sharp even on slow shutter speed thanks to advanced sofware processing. A bit like a huge improvement on the pixell shift technology on moving subjects. Our brain do it, TVs do it. Why not cameras?
Great ideas, Nicolas. Lets hope some or all of them will be in the K-3II replacement
02-05-2017, 12:05 PM   #169
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
As a minimum - bigger battery, bigger buffer, faster continuous shooting, dual SD card slots, IR remote ports, top panel LCD and HDMI output (that would bring it back in line with the K-3 / K-3II). Perhaps, additionally, the K-1 style articulating screen, SAFOX 12 AF (found in the K-1) and some other improvements and/or goodies...
I agree, these would all be items on the next flagship crop camera but at what cost? Again, I predict a nearly 1,500 price tag and for that you are dangerously close to K1 territory, again I sound like a broken record, it proves what a bargain the K3II is and the K1.

I have a feeling more than a few users want a 750 dollar D500 killer which is NOT going to happen. The also want a KP priced at 500 bucks. A full frame DSLR with reduced features from the K1 at 1,250 and the K1 to sell for 1,750.

Fact of the matter is Pentax will slot a new camera with a crop frame as a flagship and charge accordingly and some users on this site will say it is too pricey. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

02-05-2017, 12:18 PM   #170
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
A lot of the points emerging on this thread do beg the question of what exactly an APS-C flagship would have over the KP which would make it worth buying - or manufacturing.
A bigger buffer, a faster frame rate. The reasons why I still use my K-3 for wildlife and bird photography even though I own a K-1. Those two features when needed make a K-1 feel disappointing, and the KP would be the same. Fast AF systems are expensive. I would expect that if Pentax were able to build a fast AF system into one of their cameras it would end up being a D500 price. I'd be happy if they could just nudge the frame rate up to 10 fps and give me a 30 shot buffer. And continue to incrementally improve the AF. I'm happy with a 3 second burst when needed.
02-05-2017, 12:19 PM   #171
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QuoteOriginally posted by gm4life Quote
I agree, these would all be items on the next flagship crop camera but at what cost? Again, I predict a nearly 1,500 price tag and for that you are dangerously close to K1 territory, again I sound like a broken record, it proves what a bargain the K3II is and the K1.

I have a feeling more than a few users want a 750 dollar D500 killer which is NOT going to happen. The also want a KP priced at 500 bucks. A full frame DSLR with reduced features from the K1 at 1,250 and the K1 to sell for 1,750.

Fact of the matter is Pentax will slot a new camera with a crop frame as a flagship and charge accordingly and some users on this site will say it is too pricey. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
I pretty much agree with everything you've said.

An additional factor - something I've mentioned at least once before in another thread - is that the K-3 and K-3II are still excellent cameras. Some will always want newer and better, for sure, but for many of us, the capabilities of our K-3 / K-3II are more than "good enough". I'm in that very situation myself. Yes - I'd like better AF, improved high ISO performance and even more advanced five-axis SR... but I don't want or need them enough to shell out $1500, or even a more realistic $1200. I'm still very happy with my K-3 & K-3II... they do everything I need and they do it - for the most part - very well.
02-05-2017, 01:10 PM - 1 Like   #172
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
I pretty much agree with everything you've said.

An additional factor - something I've mentioned at least once before in another thread - is that the K-3 and K-3II are still excellent cameras. Some will always want newer and better, for sure, but for many of us, the capabilities of our K-3 / K-3II are more than "good enough". I'm in that very situation myself. Yes - I'd like better AF, improved high ISO performance and even more advanced five-axis SR... but I don't want or need them enough to shell out $1500, or even a more realistic $1200. I'm still very happy with my K-3 & K-3II... they do everything I need and they do it - for the most part - very well.
And that's the big issue. Tess is happy with her K-5. I'm happy with the K-3. I use the K-1 because it's there, but it really hasn't given me much yet. What would it take to get us to shell out $1500? Maybe there is such a thing, but I'm having trouble imagining what it might be.

Last edited by normhead; 02-05-2017 at 01:53 PM.
02-05-2017, 01:55 PM   #173
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
A lot of the points emerging on this thread do beg the question of what exactly an APS-C flagship would have over the KP which would make it worth buying - or manufacturing. Not much all that much, it might appear. $1500 for a bigger battery and a slightly better buffer? That's quite expensive I'm sure another Pentax camera will appear before long but it may not be the camera people are expecting just as the KP isn't really what folks were expecting.
QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
As a minimum - bigger battery, bigger buffer, faster continuous shooting, dual SD card slots, IR remote ports, top panel LCD and HDMI output (that would bring it back in line with the K-3 / K-3II). Perhaps, additionally, the K-1 style articulating screen, SAFOX 12 AF (found in the K-1) and some other improvements and/or goodies...
The sensor; direct button controls rather than 2-touch controls; 14-bit (?); full depth body (for all the mentioned ports); full grip, etc.

asahi man comment on APSc flagship. APSc line has 3 price-points / bodies. The flagship is coming later.


Last edited by monochrome; 02-05-2017 at 02:17 PM.
02-05-2017, 02:03 PM   #174
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
The sensor; direct button controls rather than 2-touch controls; 14-bit (?); full depth body (for all the mentioned ports); full grip, etc.
Absolutely
02-05-2017, 02:14 PM   #175
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
And that's the big issue. Tess is happy with her K-5. I'm happy with the K-3. I use the K-1 because it's there, but it really hasn't given me much yet. What would it take to get us to shell out $1500? Maybe there is such a thing, but I'm having trouble imagining what it might be.
Precisely. Heck, I still shoot with my old K-5 quite often - mainly when I'm using old adapted lenses - and I get the shots I want (any problem is with me, not the camera). I'd rather shoot with my K-3; for me, it's definitely a better camera. But, the K-5 is no slouch by any stretch of the imagination.

I could possibly see me shelling out $1500 when the K-3II's replacement is itself replaced with an even better model offering me at least a couple of stops more useable ISO range than the K-3, whizz-bang AF, automated AF calibration and a whole bunch of other stuff... assuming either my K-3 or K-3II has died by then and isn't economically repairable... and assuming I still want more than one body to shoot with.

Of course, by then I may finally have succumbed to a full-frame Pentax. It's not on my radar for the near-to-mid future, but never say never
02-05-2017, 02:54 PM   #176
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
I pretty much agree with everything you've said.

An additional factor - something I've mentioned at least once before in another thread - is that the K-3 and K-3II are still excellent cameras. Some will always want newer and better, for sure, but for many of us, the capabilities of our K-3 / K-3II are more than "good enough". I'm in that very situation myself. Yes - I'd like better AF, improved high ISO performance and even more advanced five-axis SR... but I don't want or need them enough to shell out $1500, or even a more realistic $1200. I'm still very happy with my K-3 & K-3II... they do everything I need and they do it - for the most part - very well.
Great minds think alike then. I agree with you, the K3 series are phenomenal cameras for the money. I do think, having looked at the other cameras in 800-900 range it is an absolute steal. Remember when I jumped into DSLR's a couple months ago, I hadn't committed to any brand but had experience with Pentax as that is what my dad shoots, and had great luck with two 1/1.7 cameras the QS1 and MX1.

I could have gone Nikon, Fuji, Sony (Canon held no interest) or Olympus even. I knew a crop sensor was all I really needed, could have got away 4/3's too but at the end of the day wanted the bright optical viewfinder. I had narrowed it down to Pentax and Nikon. Given the fact I had a fondness after learning to shoot on a Program Plus, my dad already having some excellent gear, the near giveaway K3II pricing and the awesome selection of APS-C glass for the Pentax system I went that direction. I can however say that the K1 was tempting too... That wasn't in the cards for me as I could afford it but was WAY overkill.
02-05-2017, 03:49 PM   #177
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
Precisely. Heck, I still shoot with my old K-5 quite often - mainly when I'm using old adapted lenses - and I get the shots I want (any problem is with me, not the camera). I'd rather shoot with my K-3; for me, it's definitely a better camera. But, the K-5 is no slouch by any stretch of the imagination.

I could possibly see me shelling out $1500 when the K-3II's replacement is itself replaced with an even better model offering me at least a couple of stops more useable ISO range than the K-3, whizz-bang AF, automated AF calibration and a whole bunch of other stuff... assuming either my K-3 or K-3II has died by then and isn't economically repairable... and assuming I still want more than one body to shoot with.

Of course, by then I may finally have succumbed to a full-frame Pentax. It's not on my radar for the near-to-mid future, but never say never
There you are you see, all saying you'd like there to be a new flagship but also saying that you might have no great need to buy it. A possible dilemma for Pentax.

But this is derailing the thread so I'll say no more. The new sensor looks pretty darn nice and an improvement so far as I can see. APS-C has got really very good these days, that is the message I get from the K70 and the KP.

My K5 eventually more or less fell apart due to heavy use and it was time to retire it. Still a very very hard sensor to beat, imho.
02-05-2017, 06:19 PM   #178
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
There you are you see, all saying you'd like there to be a new flagship but also saying that you might have no great need to buy it. A possible dilemma for Pentax.

But this is derailing the thread so I'll say no more. The new sensor looks pretty darn nice and an improvement so far as I can see. APS-C has got really very good these days, that is the message I get from the K70 and the KP.

My K5 eventually more or less fell apart due to heavy use and it was time to retire it. Still a very very hard sensor to beat, imho.
The issue is, at 1500 dollars, there is a bit more competition for the money at that level. The need to be very cautious with pricing is very large.

But, I wonder, what a K-1 with this 'accelerator' chip would do for high ISO noise?
02-05-2017, 06:43 PM   #179
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
The sensor; direct button controls rather than 2-touch controls; 14-bit (?); full depth body (for all the mentioned ports); full grip, etc.

asahi man comment on APSc flagship. APSc line has 3 price-points / bodies. The flagship is coming later.
Sure, it will come and people around this place will bitch about the nearly K1 pricing, because the K1 is slightly underpriced for what you get - again what an excellent value. Ditto for the K3II, I have to say as an entire brand Pentax bodies and lenses although not cheap are relatively reasonably priced. People want Cadillac features, at a Chevrolet price.

Furthermore this place is just as bad as the GM car forums... Everyone screams build it, GM does and no one buys it. I can come up with examples after example. Or at the very minimum buy it after bitching about how pricey it is and wait for a 20 percent off sticker rebate. I guess Pentax users are no different.
02-05-2017, 06:48 PM   #180
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@gm4life Get your SS now. No more coming onshore.

I have a K-1 so the KP is interesting to me but not necessary. I like the design but not the mid-range control layout. We'll have to wait for the actual camera to really know anything about images.

I sold my K-3 and kept the K-01's and all my DA lenses, for now, so KP would be an increment, a luxury.

If the APSc flagship has 8+ fps and the KP ISO improvements I might get one early for long lenses, or get a KP for compact travel kit then. I don't need 2 flagships, but eventually I'll want another APSc body and I'll have to decide whether less money compensates for different features and layout.

Right now I'm holding back to see what the lenses are anyway.

Last edited by monochrome; 02-05-2017 at 07:10 PM.
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