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08-30-2017, 01:06 AM   #1651
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Fair enough
I like (and use) Sony's smartphones but their cameras, hmm... they work, sure, but they're more electronic gadgets than photographic tools. Minolta's legacy, sadly, is gone.
Fat chance I'd give up on Pentax for that.
QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
A lot of pro-shooters use A7 versions world-wide. A9 is the new level of FF mirrorless camera. Unachievable for Nikon, Canon or Ricoh.
It's really cool working tools. Try Sony and the world will be opened for you from new point of view.
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Are you speaking from personal experience?
I can definitely speak from personal experience, though not with the A9...

As I've said many times before here on the forums, I shoot both Pentax (K-3 / K-3II and several others) and Sony (Hasselblad HV / A99 and A7 MkII). They have different strengths and weaknesses, but all of them are most definitely photographic tools first, electronic gadgets second. As for the Minolta legacy, I use a bunch of great Minolta AF glass on both my HV / A99 and A7 MkII.

The A7 MkII hasn't "opened the world for me", or given me a new point of view. There's a very limited range of glass that can leverage the full AF capabilities of the A7 range and A9. Continuous shooting rate isn't something that particularly interests me for what I shoot, so an A9 would be overkill. But, Sony's mirrorless cameras are great for manual focusing and adapted lenses. That's where their real strength lies for me personally.

As I said, my other cameras have different strengths and weaknesses, depending on the use case. All of them are hugely capable tools with more facilities, performance and image quality than the vast majority of members actually need - including, I'd suggest, most of us posting in this very thread

EDIT: Shall we return to the subject of the DFA 50 f/1.4?


Last edited by BigMackCam; 08-30-2017 at 01:55 AM.
08-30-2017, 02:43 AM   #1652
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Thank you, sharing your personal experience is always appreciated.
And I know I'm a bit too harsh when I say "they're more electronic gadgets" - but I'm not wrong They give me this "electronic gadget" feeling, especially when they compromise on build quality (wobbly mounts, light leaks), and when an official announcement has no less than 17 footnotes. I could put it in a more positive light if I wish so... but with the mirrorless propaganda all over the DSLR forums, I don't.

Minolta seemed to me closer to Pentax' design philosophy than other camera makers; Sony, now, it's worlds apart. This is what I'm talking about when I say "Minolta's legacy is gone".

I'm afraid we won't find out anything new about the D FA* 50mm f/1.4 (or the other lenses on the roadmap) until CP+.
08-30-2017, 02:55 AM - 1 Like   #1653
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
(...)

I'm afraid we won't find out anything new about the D FA* 50mm f/1.4 (or the other lenses on the roadmap) until CP+.
Don't be so pessimistic!
08-30-2017, 03:01 AM   #1654
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I'm not pessimistic; I try to be realistic.
If something happens earlier than that, it would be a pleasant surprise. If nothing happens until CP+, I won't be disappointed.

08-30-2017, 04:42 AM   #1655
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Thank you, sharing your personal experience is always appreciated.
You're welcome

QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
And I know I'm a bit too harsh when I say "they're more electronic gadgets" - but I'm not wrong They give me this "electronic gadget" feeling, especially when they compromise on build quality (wobbly mounts, light leaks)
Actually, I don't think you're being too harsh... I do know what you mean. But, having used the HV / A99 and A7 MkII for some time now, I feel they're excellent photographic tools first and foremost. I prefer the control hardware (buttons, dials etc.) and user-interface ergonomics of Pentax cameras, but it's really just a case of familiarisation with each system. I swap between Pentax and Sony now without even thinking. Both do the job very well

As for build quality, I'd certainly rate Sony higher than you do. But, while the A7 MkII is quite well built, it doesn't feel as robust as my K-3 - it's more comparable to something like the K-70, though still not as weather-resistant. I don't have any problems with wobbly mounts or light leaks, but the mounts on both my HV and A7 MkII do permit a very small amount of rotational movement with some lenses. It's a little disconcerting at first, but doesn't affect usage at all. The mounts are easily strong enough to take the weight of heavier lenses like the Zeiss 24-70 f/2.8 and Tamron 70-200 f/2.8 USD, given proper handling...
08-30-2017, 05:12 AM   #1656
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Yes, they do the job. The only thing I really don't like is the EVF; I could get used with the body and interface.
The issues I've mentioned were from the first generation of the A7 line, a consequence of their ultra-compact design (having 3rd-party making reinforced mounts for your camera is not a good track record!). I believe the second generation is an improvement, but since I have only limited direct experience - and you own those cameras - I won't try to tell you how they feel
08-30-2017, 05:38 AM   #1657
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
The only thing I really don't like is the EVF; I could get used with the body and interface.
I've got used to the EVF and really like it, mainly because it suits my primary use case of accurate manual focusing with adapted lenses. I have to use Live View with my Pentax DSLRs for that kind of accuracy, and I just don't find it as pleasurable (although an LCD loupe improves the situation somewhat). For those who simply don't like EVFs, any of the mirrorless cameras - including the A7-series - won't be much fun to use.
08-30-2017, 06:40 AM   #1658
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Are you speaking from personal experience?
Yes. My friends left C and N and went to A7RII. They are professional photographers.
They use manual focus lenses (K-mount too) and some Sony lenses. One of them has K-1 and A7RII. He uses A7RII with K-mount Limited and Voigtlander lenses in manual mode and K-1 with old FA* with AF.
Sony is really good tool for art photography and manual lenses. Of course, no ideal system for everyone. But Sony is strong and has some advantages. And the price....Some of Sony FF cameras are not expensive now. Cheaper than K-1. And much cheaper.

08-30-2017, 06:53 AM   #1659
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But that's your friends' personal experience, not yours... your choice, IIRC, is to go back to manual cameras.
08-30-2017, 07:06 AM - 3 Likes   #1660
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
Yes. My friends left C and N and went to A7RII. They are professional photographers.
They use manual focus lenses (K-mount too) and some Sony lenses. One of them has K-1 and A7RII. He uses A7RII with K-mount Limited and Voigtlander lenses in manual mode and K-1 with old FA* with AF.
Sony is really good tool for art photography and manual lenses. Of course, no ideal system for everyone. But Sony is strong and has some advantages. And the price....Some of Sony FF cameras are not expensive now. Cheaper than K-1. And much cheaper.
These are all tools. You can get good results with an A7 series camera, but you can also with a K-1 or a D810, or a bunch of other cameras out there. The thing is to find something that works well for you from and ergonomic standpoint and learn your gear.

The problem for most people isn't their camera body or even the glass, but their own skill level that gets in the way of making the most of their gear.

I don't happen to like EVFs very much at all and so I would be bothered shooting with a Sony long term, but certainly I could get decent results for their cameras -- at least equivalent to what I get from Pentax cameras.
08-30-2017, 07:21 AM   #1661
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QuoteQuote:
They use manual focus lenses (K-mount too) and some Sony lenses. One of them has K-1 and A7RII. He uses A7RII with K-mount Limited and Voigtlander lenses in manual mode and K-1 with old FA* with AF.
Maybe you can point us to their web pages. I have no idea what kind of pro, where time is money, would be messing around with adapters on the job. I even think it's weird when not on the job, but there's no explaining some people's hobbies. I'd be interested in seeing the work of someone who can make that work.
08-30-2017, 09:02 AM   #1662
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Maybe you can point us to their web pages. I have no idea what kind of pro, where time is money, would be messing around with adapters on the job. I even think it's weird when not on the job, but there's no explaining some people's hobbies. I'd be interested in seeing the work of someone who can make that work.
One of them posted photos at PF, but was banned for erotic photos several times and lost any interest to this forum.
I even didn't find his nickname in Member's list. VB007.
His Pentax gear


Do you remember the photo of 3 naked girls in rainy day at the parapet of columns? It was very popular at PF.

He stopped to post photos in any galleries in web this year. I will ask him and answer you.

Last edited by ogl; 08-30-2017 at 09:07 AM.
08-30-2017, 09:05 AM   #1663
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
But that's your friends' personal experience, not yours... your choice, IIRC, is to go back to manual cameras.
I trust good photographers. My experience is nothing for any serious conclusion, because I'm not photographer.
08-30-2017, 09:11 AM   #1664
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You know and trust them, and that's fine.
But you're asking me to trust you in the first place, and then to trust those unknown to me friends of yours; in the end somehow being convinced, with no further arguments, that by trying Sony "the world will be opened for me from new point of view". You don't even say what you mean by that, yet you're asking me to forego my personal experience with Sony for empty words. That, I cannot do.
09-03-2017, 03:38 AM - 4 Likes   #1665
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Pentax please obey the orders!
My daughter is about to slice my K1 body in half, she WANTS to be shot by one of your new PRIME
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