[Rondec]

The A9 is a great specialized camera. For architecture or landscape photography there is no better option than the K-1. I photograph people and they are always moving. The eye AF really is a big deal. The silent shooting and black-out free EVF is really nice. I don't need 20fps, but I have see a lot of shots in the A9 groups when that came in very handy for getting the perfect shot. It has its place.

I'm sure you could make the switch to Canon or Nikon for less. If someone made a smart adapter for Pentax glass like they do for Canon/Nikon/Sigma I wouldn't need to sell any. I had a chance to use a Nikon 105mm F/1.4 on my A9 with and adapter and I was surprised that it was focusing faster than my friends Canon 5DIII with 85L. If I was a Canon or Nikon shooter the switch to Sony would be very smooth. Again.... There just aren't a enough K-mount users out there for anyone to invest in developing a smart adapter for K-mount. I thought about sending my Sigma 85mm back to Sigma and have them change the mount over to a Sigma mount and buy the Sigma to Sony adapter. But by the time I paid to have the mount changed and buy the adapter it wasn't worth it.

The Zeiss Batis 18mm F/2.8 can be bought for $1,200 - What is the Pentax option? Search: batis 18mm | Flickr
The Zeiss Batis 25mm F/2 can be bought for around $1,000 - What is the Pentax option? Search: batis 25mm | Flickr
The Zeiss Batis 135mm F/2.8 APO can be bought for $1,600 - What is the Pentax option? Search: batis 135mm | Flickr

How much will the D-FA* 50mm F/1.4 lens cost? I bought the Sony-Zeiss 50mm F/1.4 for $1,500 while it was on sale, but I expect that the new D-FA* lens will be priced very similarly. I expect the D-FA* lens to be a premium quality lens and prices according.

You notice that in my post I didn't mention Pentax. The closest things you could find as far as primes would be an Irix or Samyang for the wide angle, probably the FA 31, and then the F or FA 135 f2.8 on the used market. But clearly Pentax needs some new lenses and it will be awhile before they get here. My point was more that there are better deals on used Nikon and Canon lenses compared to Sony. That's all.

I do wonder about the pricing on the new lenses. I'm sure it will be over 1000, but how much over is the question. I was pleasantly surprised with the pricing on the DFA * 70-200 which isn't cheap at 1600, but is priced quite a bit cheaper than the Sony 70-200 f2.8, Nikon 70-200 f2.8 VR, and Canon 70-200 f2.8 IS.

[Wheatfield]

You just contradicted yourself, Wheatfield.

They're happy, and yet you're sad.

Just jump brand, champ, like Mee, Jogiba, Osv, et al ... it's your money.

People who've switched to Pentax like Gyroscope are fresh air. A joy to read their posts.

At least we are supporting the brand with more than lip service.

[BigMackCam]

At least we are supporting the brand with more than lip service.

Anyone who buys Pentax equipment new or old is supporting the brand. The guy who buys a five-year-old Pentax camera and a handful of second-hand lenses (because that's what he wants, or it's all he can afford) provides funds to the seller, who then gets to go out and buy his K-1 and shiny new glass. Even the K-1 buyer who doesn't want or can't afford the latest, expensive own-brand glass supported the brand by buying the K-1.

Why, even just helping others in these forums is supporting the brand, as it makes this an increasingly useful resource for existing and potential Pentax owners. One of the reasons I've stayed with Pentax (and bought more Pentax equipment) is because of the advice and support I've had from this community.

Support of the brand isn't measured by how many of the products you buy or how much you spend

[Winder]

Mm, you could get the Irix/Laowa lenses for your UWA primes, if you don't want the excellent 15-30 zoom. You could get Rokinon 24 1.4, very highly regarded, as well as Rokinon 135 f2 that has great reviews. All of those very affordable. Sure, you won't have a zeiss badge on those, but it's not like there are no options for pretty much any focal length out there for K mount.

I could, but my main reason for moving to the A9 as my main camera is AF so it really wouldn't make much sense to pick up manual focus lenses. If I did want manual focus, there are hundreds of options for the Sony FE mount with an adapter.

[awscreo]

I could, but my main reason for moving to the A9 as my main camera is AF so it really wouldn't make much sense to pick up manual focus lenses. If I did want manual focus, there are hundreds of options for the Sony FE mount with an adapter.

wait, aren't all lenses you've mentioned manual?

[Winder]

Just to put things in perspective, when I purchased the K1 it felt great , at least for the first three month I was stunned by images taken with it. Now, I feel like it's a normal camera; I got used to the quality and I don't have older cameras to compare. Everything is relative, and all the joy is a thing that happens in the mind rather than bank account. If A9 did not exist, the other camera would be the best, it wouldn't prevent joy to happen. So far as I'm concerned I understood what is the deal with digital cameras: for large sensors, the cost of acquisition is much more than film (different economics), what that all means for me is I should buy a camera system of the format I want and stick with the same system for a decade or more, I'll pass on electronic improvements, because those are very frequent, and it makes no sense to pay for the cost of a new system just because there is 10% difference inside the body. You have money, sure, you do what you want with it. Saying Sony is great, yes, it does it for the first 3 months, at month 4 you realize how much money you dropped and that your images are the same because the person behind the camera did not change, that's hard to admit but it's the truth. Always jumping to the next best camera, is, either something encourage by marketing and sales, or some return to childhood.

The K-1 still feels great and it feels like the better camera. It has better ergonomics, better build quality, and better menus and I have had it over a year. The A9 feels cheap in comparison. The push to buy the A9 actually comes from my wife who does about 50% of my wedding retouching and LR editing. Her constant complaining about slightly out-of focus images of moving people resulted in me telling her that unless she wanted me to spend about $4,000 switching systems we would just have to live with it.

You seem to think this is just about playing with the latest and greatest technology. I have been shooting with Pentax since the K-7 and I was shooting with a Contax 645 and a Canon 5D (original) for years. There have been plenty of opportunities to jump newer and better technology over the years. I do get a kick out of everyone playing psychologist and telling me what my motives are though.

I hope Ricoh come out with a camera with equivalent AF to the A9 in the near future. I would love to be shooting with it. The new D-FA* glass is going to be excellent and I will be looking forward to the reviews.

---------- Post added 01-18-18 at 08:03 AM ----------

wait, aren't all lenses you've mentioned manual?

all the Zeiss Batis lenses are AF and have optical image stabilization. It is the Zeiss Loxia lenses that are manual. The Batis lenses are made by Tamron for Zeiss.

[Wheatfield]

Anyone who buys Pentax equipment new or old is supporting the brand. The guy who buys a five-year-old Pentax camera and a handful of second-hand lenses (because that's what he wants, or it's all he can afford) provides funds to the seller, who then gets to go out and buy his K-1 and shiny new glass. Even the K-1 buyer who doesn't want or can't afford the latest, expensive own-brand glass supported the brand by buying the K-1.

Does this include the people who buy the used equipment from the guy who is tired of waiting for Pentax to wake up and smell the coffee and is switching brands to one that seems interested in supporting their customers with more than the occasional dog biscuit?

Why, even just helping others in these forums is supporting the brand, as it makes this an increasingly useful resource for existing and potential Pentax owners. One of the reasons I've stayed with Pentax (and bought more Pentax equipment) is because of the advice and support I've had from this community.

Support of the brand isn't measured by how many of the products you buy or how much you spend

At the end of the day, you will find that the number of new products sold is the bottom line metric determining if a product line gets continued or dropped.
Ricoh doesn't see forums or trade in abacus designed lenses as product support.
They might see the ho-hum I don't need your product because I have an abacus era one attitude as a lack of interest in the product line though.
Your brand of support might well be the end of the line.
When you talk to corporations, you are talking dollars.

[normhead]

My advice would be don't take advice from professionals who work in an area that will be different than your own. Whatever line of work it is, it will have demands that are different than yours.

Its odd that when Winder above discusses the K-1 and A9, he doesn't mention image quality. Pentax classified it as field camera. Winder purchased it as a wedding camera. That's all you need to know about why he had to switch. If you buy gear based on the advice of professionals, you will end up with gear inappropriate to your needs.

Most professionals I've met have a great deal of problem understanding that. They tend to be so locked into their own world, they aren't really capable of understanding the more relaxed, "just dong this for fun" attitude of advanced amateurs, or of other professionals working in different areas of endeavour, like wild life or landscape. They buy gear specialized to what they are doing, then assume that everyone else needs what they need.

For me this conversation has been going on for 50 years. Same conversation 5-10 different wedding photographers.

Wedding photographers are great at giving advice to other wedding photographers. After that, they are just guys who have way more expensive gear than the average photo enthusiast, and have a professional duty to make sure the clients and everyone else knows they have the best gear for the job.

[BigMackCam]

Does this include the people who buy the used equipment from the guy who is tired of waiting for Pentax to wake up and smell the coffee and is switching brands to one that seems interested in supporting their customers with more than the occasional dog biscuit?

What I'm saying, Bill - and I'm sure you knew this really (you're just being sarcastic, right?) - is that a guy who buys into Pentax equipment at any level - or even stays with his existing Pentax equipment - is supporting the brand just as much as someone waiting to buy the new DFA50/1.4 and other new glass. Perhaps not to the same level financially, but at a level appropriate to his means and interest in the hobby or profession.

At the end of the day, you will find that the number of new products sold is the bottom line metric determining if a product line gets continued or dropped.

Of course, no argument on that point

Ricoh doesn't see forums or trade in abacus designed lenses as product support.

We were talking about brand support, not product support (your quote was "At least we are supporting the brand with more than lip service").

With respect, you don't know what Ricoh sees as product or brand support, other than the obvious example of selling product units.

The more people that are shooting Pentax, the more free advertising it's getting. The more people that are talking about Pentax on forums in a positive way, the more good publicity Ricoh / Pentax is getting.

Naturally, Ricoh wants to sell cameras, lenses and accessories, but if you don't think forums and accessible, used-market products that help "stickiness" of the brand are important to the manufacturer - at zero cost to them - then frankly I'm amazed. We clearly (and unsurprisingly) have different views.

They might see the ho-hum I don't need your product because I have an abacus era one attitude as a lack of interest in the product line though.

I don't believe anyone is truly saying "ho-hum, I don't need your product because I have an older version" (I won't use your derogatory term "abacus designed"). Most are saying, "I can shoot just fine and get fantastic results with what I have access to already. But if something even better comes along, I decide I need it and can afford it, then I might buy it". At least, that's what I'm summarising from the various comments I've read.

Your brand of support might well be the end of the line.

That strikes me as hypocrisy, Bill, given that you're the one who keeps publicly criticising Ricoh for taking so long to deliver this and other lenses, and having nothing but "bloated zooms" (your term) to offer. What brand of support is that?

Rioch has had plenty of my hard-earned money in new product sales over the years, and a great deal of positive and helpful posting here on the forums. If my brand of support isn't enough, so be it - I can live with that.

If you'll excuse me, I'm bowing out of this discussion now...

[Rondec]

My advice would be don't take advice from professionals who work in an area that will be different than your own. Whatever line of work it is, it will have demands that are different than yours.

Its odd that when Winder above discusses the K-1 and A9, he doesn't mention image quality. Pentax classified it as field camera. Winder purchased it as a wedding camera. That's all you need to know about why he had to switch. If you buy gear based on the advice of professionals, you will end up with gear inappropriate to your needs.

Most professionals I've met have a great deal of problem understanding that. They tend to be so locked into their own world, they aren't really capable of understanding the more relaxed, "just dong this for fun" attitude of advanced amateurs, or of other professionals working in different areas of endeavour, like wild life or landscape. They buy gear specialized to what they are doing, then assume that everyone else needs what they need.

For me this conversation has been going on for 50 years. Same conversation 5-10 different wedding photographers.

Wedding photographers are great at giving advice to other wedding photographers. After that, they are just guys who have way more expensive gear than the average photo enthusiast, and have a professional duty to make sure the clients and everyone else knows they have the best gear for the job.

I suppose. My perception is that most full frame cameras out there are more than usable by wedding photographers. The K-1 is no exception. There are probably folks out there who are shooting weddings with Fuji cameras.

In the end, the big thing is that you are able to get results that match your competition and that please your clients and that make them feel like they are getting good results for the price they pay. The biggest area I would see that the K-1 falls down in wedding shooting isn't really auto focus capability, but rather video, which does seem to be a coming thing in wedding photography.

[BigMackCam]

There are probably folks out there who are shooting weddings with Fuji cameras

There's at least one in-demand wedding photography here in the UK who shoots APS-C Fuji mirrorless. I'm sure there are others too

[normhead]

I suppose. My perception is that most full frame cameras out there are more than usable by wedding photographers. The K-1 is no exception. There are probably folks out there who are shooting weddings with Fuji cameras.

In the end, the big thing is that you are able to get results that match your competition and that please your clients and that make them feel like they are getting good results for the price they pay. The biggest area I would see that the K-1 falls down in wedding shooting isn't really auto focus capability, but rather video, which does seem to be a coming thing in wedding photography.

My last wedding I had 3 different video cameras set up, 3 video guys and a stills guy. Since you want video and still taken at the same time, I don't see how you get around that.

My cousin, "the photographer" for rich and famous weddings in Seattle, used to have as part of most packages a 36x24 canvas wall mounted image in an expensive frame. I'm sure a 24 MP camera would not be the best for that.

But then most wedding photographers don't have that kind of clientele. It all depends on what kind of wedding photgrapher you are. When they camera out, Nikon D4s low light cameras were the craze for shooting receptions and the mingling before and after the weddings. These phases just come and go. The most used camera for weddings as far as i can tell, are canons and they just keep chugging along despite very few new bells and whistles. Just good solid all around performance in their professional models.

[Rondec]

My last wedding I had 3 different video cameras set up, 3 video guys and a stills guy. Since you want video and still taken at the same time, I don't see how you get around that.

My cousin, "the photographer" for rich and famous weddings in Seattle, used to have as part of most packages a 36x24 canvas wall mounted image in an expensive frame. I'm sure a 24 MP camera would not be the best for that.

But then most wedding photographers don't have that kind of clientele. It all depends on what kind of wedding photgrapher you are. When they camera out, Nikon D4s low light cameras were the craze for shooting receptions and the mingling before and after the weddings. These phases just come and go. The most used camera for weddings as far as i can tell, are canons and they just keep chugging along despite very few new bells and whistles. Just good solid all around performance in their professional models.

I think the big thing is that a lot of still photographers want to expand what they are offering -- offer both video and still photography for one high price. They also want at least a certain level of interchangeability with the bodies and lenses that they use. For a lot of video shots you don't need an ILC to shoot them, but for the shallow depth of field shots or things like that, it certainly seems to be the way to go these days.

[Kunzite]

The more people that are shooting Pentax, the more free advertising it's getting.

Unless we get someone shooting his decades old Pentax lens on a Sony

Everyone is free to decide how much to spend on which Pentax equipment; there's of course no "moral obligation" to spend a certain amount. But, everyone should also understand that high-end products are needed, if the brand is to survive on the long term. Pentax cannot be the only brand out there without such products.

[BigMackCam]

Unless we get someone shooting his decades old Pentax lens on a Sony

Yeah, you've got me there...<quickly moves all his Pentax K-mount glass away from the A7 MkII >

Everyone is free to decide how much to spend on which Pentax equipment; there's of course no "moral obligation" to spend a certain amount. But, everyone should also understand that high-end products are needed, if the brand is to survive on the long term. Pentax cannot be the only brand out there without such products.

Oh, I fully agree that new lenses are needed - and I've no doubt they'll wring every last drop of performance from the K-1's sensor, and that of its successor. I'm quite excited to see what the DFA50/1.4 and its future stablemates will be capable of in the right hands. But, until those lenses are released (which will take time), there's some really lovely glass already available to shoot with - even if some of it is getting a little long in the tooth