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10-18-2018, 10:41 AM   #1801
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I think that there has been enough of complainig. Have to admit that they have responded to those, or should it be that they have fixed missing things, which should have been done before. Now there is big interest of video and video capabilities. I would be interested of seeing what video is like in GR III, because it could little poit out where it is going to be. If it has improved or is it just for fun there.

It could be that there is new wave of K-01 kind a camera coming down the pipe, so they might actually put better video to that. I was just thinking this today while driving. and They said that they have worked with mechanical video for K-1. and or other models, but faced unexcpected problems. Perhaps they will try to make it better...video.

10-18-2018, 01:01 PM - 1 Like   #1802
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QuoteOriginally posted by repaap Quote
It could be that there is new wave of K-01 kind a camera coming down the pipe, so they might actually put better video to that. I was just thinking this today while driving. and They said that they have worked with mechanical video for K-1. and or other models, but faced unexcpected problems. Perhaps they will try to make it better...video.
I hope not. Have 0 interest in mirrorless atm. and would rather like they focus on photography features rather than video. And even if they do mirrorless one day it should be with new mount.
10-18-2018, 04:23 PM   #1803
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QuoteOriginally posted by Trickortreat Quote
I hope not. Have 0 interest in mirrorless atm. and would rather like they focus on photography features rather than video. And even if they do mirrorless one day it should be with new mount.
I also dont like the completely mirrorless idea...(hybrid would be cool though)... And that they'll improve video is kinda sure already...
They already improved the bitrate on the KP...

and you should keep in mind, that a camera that is capable of loads of cool video stuff like 4k, will have to offer strong processing power,

from which every stills photographer will profit...
F.I.:faster bus speeds... also mean faster burst rates nearly for sure,

faster CPU, means way faster autofocus...

better said:

*)far more accurate/deceisive AF.A
*)far more accurate recognizing of subject even in AF.S when "AUTO[all points] - focusing mode" is chosen
*)far more accurate and way faster AF.C(cause in AF.C d'cam has to take loads of input output actions to AF, and calculate all the time like:
"WHERE NEXT? NO. WHERE NEXT? HERE. ESTIMATING. NEXT HERE. YES. WHERE NEXT? POINT TO THE LEFT. NO. POINT UPWARDS. YES. etc. etc."
and having fast lanes and a capable CPU(or CPU with Co-CPU)... contributes very much in such calculations for sure.
Thats the reason why the K-1II is a bit better in terms of AF then the first ... because of the co-processor that helps out with the calculations.
But the coprocessor is actually only kinda "booby prize" or "consolation" if you wish so.
... its not that i would bother about that in the K-1II since Mark II version always only brought the little steps forward in pentaxland... thats normal.


BUT with the NEXT cameras... they should really level up the PRIME engine not only 2 but 3 or 4 steps forward....

or exchange it for a completely new architecture... (my hopes are not tooo high, but somehow i feel they could have done that already and there is a lot of developement going on behind the curtain, and that may be the reason, why we did not see any REAL big leaps forward on the GRIII


really... we need a way more capable/faster circuitry (board) overall for sure, because people have been complaining about autofocus for a very long time, and lets be honest, its the strongest reason for people to hop off...



so far the fantasy... but nonetheless ... video still may stay kinda "stepchild" status...

as well as autofocus... and good connections for tethering...

(will it be USB3.1[USB-C connector] this time??? or will they go back to USB1.0???)


but hey, at least you will get a touchscreen. lets hope you can count that as one of your important "photography features" and it takes your photog game further...


Sorry for the sarcasm, boys... but Ricoh-Imaging really earned it...

The only thing i really hope for, is that they dont forget to implement "Focus Peaking" in Video mode.
But maybe also that already goes too far in the eyes of some manager... who knows...? Lets wait and see.
10-18-2018, 07:39 PM - 3 Likes   #1804
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QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
And with Pentax the message has been surprisingly clear: they do not see video as any priority
And of course, nor do Pentax owners as a whole, as their market research must show and the survey in this very forum actually does.

10-18-2018, 11:03 PM   #1805
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QuoteOriginally posted by clackers Quote
And of course, nor do Pentax owners as a whole, as their market research must show and the survey in this very forum actually does.
True. In most cases maybe video is not a priority, but let's face it, as a marketing tool, having good video features helps a lot to increment sales, the question is, they want to increase sales or they just want to keep "breathing"??
10-18-2018, 11:27 PM   #1806
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
True. In most cases maybe video is not a priority, but let's face it, as a marketing tool, having good video features helps a lot to increment sales, the question is, they want to increase sales or they just want to keep "breathing"??
They would increase sales by substantial amount if they matched stills features to competition and refresh lens lineup.
10-18-2018, 11:39 PM   #1807
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
True. In most cases maybe video is not a priority, but let's face it, as a marketing tool, having good video features helps a lot to increment sales, the question is, they want to increase sales or they just want to keep "breathing"??
The thing that many of folks here don't get is that: if Ricoh could manage to deliver very decent 1080p video (Canon-quality), there will be an increased demand for a old lenses like 50/2 M, Takumars and so on. Those babies are doing great during video on Sony's so why not is it on a proper camera, from the same brand as they had been made of?
10-19-2018, 12:15 AM   #1808
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The three knee-jerk sticks (if such a thing exists) that reviewers beat Pentax with are video, AF and lens availability, and it would be nice to think that if these were sorted out reviews would all glow. It would be nice, but experience and observation (not just of Pentax) suggest that other things would be looked for - the only difference is that there would be a grace period where there wasn't a lazy consensus about what the problems are.

10-19-2018, 06:35 AM   #1809
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I really dont feel like I want to repeat, what i wrote before and many others already mentioned before on the forums.
even though clackers may not agree....
One can read very often, that people are demanding video... even if short afterwards they get "stomped" on for it, with a few "2 sentences"-posts form hardcore-forum members...
But i really have a feeling that "the loudest" ... with the shortest and sharpest sentences, dont always represent "the most".
- And those surveys.... yes if those surveys should be meaningful...
(despite that i dont know, how much of the members took part)All pentax users (and I really mean all pentax users) would have to be memembers on pentaxforums... And then all of those pentaxians would have had to take part on such a survey. which for sure is not the case... there is a reason, why I did not join in for a long time.... and that is exactyl that.


So please consider:
Doing R&D for VIDEO purposes, would do so many good things for still photography...

Despite that its obvious that a much stronger 4k capable CPU(/board) would bring many things that also stills photographers would profit from, just:
Take a closer look how much cool technological inventions come from "video R&D" so you can understand what i mean.

I dont remember when, but not sooo long ago, there was a discussion about IF or NOT there would be a way to keep:
high dynamic range
good high ISO performance
but at the same time noticeably LOWER the BASE ISO.

When i think about a feature(or better: a technological advantage) of the "Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K and that one will also find in "pro-grade" panasonic video-gear.
(and i guess, they will utilize this technology for sure in their S1R body also since they want to kill off Sony A7/9 series as the jack of all trades")
I really feel this could be the solution....


DUAL NATIVE ISO


If you think about it, such a technology could eventually spare us any co-processor and free up ALL of the processing power of a new Prime on a faster board, to do other things much faster...
(AF.C)


But if Ricoh-Imaging keeps their head out of Video R&D... and thinks they know best without reaching out to others...
we will always be a step behind also in stills photography, because they just wont know, that there could be other ways then lousy co-processors that do classical software noise reduction thats hardware baked in, when they keep their heads in the stills-sands...

If you want to know, what DUAL NATIVE ISO means. you should take a close look... and CAREFULLY read the following:
Why Dual Native ISO Should Be the New Industry Standard
or watch:
High ISO, Sharpness & Autofocus - Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K - Q&A Part 1 - YouTube

keep in mind that for "DUAL NATIVE ISO"-systems it is not "cast in stone" that,

they have to have their first circuit’s native capacitor set at ISO 400 and their second at ISO 3200...
It could also just be like the first kickin in at 80 and the second kickin in as late as ISO 800 or 1600...

Just read about dual-native-iso and/or watch the vid, so you can imagine by yourself what that could mean for stills ISO range(or better said for a camera thats dedicated to stills like the K-1) if we keep base ISO 100 and kick in the second circuits native capacitor as late as ISO 6400...

I know, ...now many forum members will come up with the usual "What will it cost?"-angst... but I really do not care, since it seem to be no problem to set up a circuit board replacement service for MarkII upgraders,
add coprocessors to a PRIME engine which also needed a lot of re-engineering, adding touchscreens (to the GRIII for whatsoever reason). honestly people:
Do yourself a favor and stop worrying about R&D costs... you will under or over-estimate them anyway.
Just go straight and tell in here what you like to have for your cameras without caring about the loudest voice.
10-19-2018, 08:12 AM - 5 Likes   #1810
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QuoteOriginally posted by H.Abendsen Quote
Doing R&D for VIDEO purposes, would do so many good things for still photography...
The spill-over benefits from video to still photography are quite limited and better achieved by other means. The biggest obstacle to speed in a camera is NOT the processor, buffer, or class of UHS. It's the sensor. And in many ways, pushing the sensor for video performance means sacrificing still image performance because speed makes everything noisier.

Certainly all the R&D and added product costs to add high-performance video processing chips to implement better video codecs and higher bit-rates is entirely wasted for still images.

The best way to improve still image performance is to invest R&D and component budget in still image performance, not waste it on video.

As for "loudest voice," the length and vehemence of anyone's posts makes no difference to the R&D costs, manufacturing costs, sensor performance, or features of Pentax cameras. Physics and engineering don't care how loud anyone gets.

And the "loudest voice" whether arguing for or against video says nothing about the numbers of people who will buy Pentax cameras with a given level of video features.
10-19-2018, 01:20 PM   #1811
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QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
The spill-over benefits from video to still photography are quite limited and better achieved by other means. The biggest obstacle to speed in a camera is NOT the processor, buffer, or class of UHS. It's the sensor. And in many ways, pushing the sensor for video performance means sacrificing still image performance because speed makes everything noisier.
It doesn't really matter what sensor is used if the other systems can not keep up is an obstacle. That is the problem with the K-1 and K-1II. The UHS-I storage bus can not handle the 36mp sensor. It is the reason there is no 4k video. It is the reason they are not very responsive cameras.

I am not asking Ricoh/Pentax to put everything into video but at least make it simpler to switch between stills and video. As it is now it doesn't work just going from one to the other. Simplify it by setting the Frame rate you want to use with the corresponding shutter speed needed. If you are using 24fps then the shutter will automatically be 1/48s. 25fps will automatically have 1/50s, 60fps 1/120s etc. Instead we have a complete disconnect that forces the user to have to reset shutter speed switching from video to stills. This alone will elevate the video features. We are not getting 4k without UHS-II.
10-19-2018, 01:35 PM   #1812
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QuoteOriginally posted by x4rd Quote
The thing that many of folks here don't get is that: if Ricoh could manage to deliver very decent 1080p video (Canon-quality), there will be an increased demand for a old lenses like 50/2 M, Takumars and so on. Those babies are doing great during video on Sony's so why not is it on a proper camera, from the same brand as they had been made of?
Please explain to me how RIcoh benefits by stimulating demand for 40-year-old $25 eBay lenses.

.:
10-19-2018, 02:08 PM - 3 Likes   #1813
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rico Quote
It doesn't really matter what sensor is used if the other systems can not keep up is an obstacle. That is the problem with the K-1 and K-1II. The UHS-I storage bus can not handle the 36mp sensor. It is the reason there is no 4k video. It is the reason they are not very responsive cameras.
That's not the reason the K-1 can't do 4k video. NONE of the cameras that used the 36 MPix FF sensor found in the K-1 offer 4k video -- not Nikon's, not Sony's. That sensor's read-out rate is simply too slow for 4k video.
10-19-2018, 02:55 PM   #1814
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QuoteOriginally posted by H.Abendsen Quote
One can read very often, that people are demanding video... even if short afterwards they get "stomped" on for it, with a few "2 sentences"-posts form hardcore-forum members...
Stomped eh? Whatever.

10-19-2018, 03:21 PM   #1815
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QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
That's not the reason the K-1 can't do 4k video. NONE of the cameras that used the 36 MPix FF sensor found in the K-1 offer 4k video -- not Nikon's, not Sony's. That sensor's read-out rate is simply too slow for 4k video.
None of those cameras had sufficient subsystems to handle 4k either namely the write speed to media storage.
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