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09-16-2017, 12:51 PM   #736
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Henry's lists 50 lenses available from Pentax.... Sigma Pentax 14 and Tamron Pentax 6.... that's 70 k-mount lenses. A few of those are Silver Edition repeats of other lenses, but I have to wonder, what are these mysterious lenses missing form the line up?

My guess is any first time user looking through the line up and looking for APS-c gear will find what they want, more so than other companies. On the other hand, K-1 users are probably a lot more experienced and have more specific needs, but with the "trinity" covered, there isn't much you can't get done, maybe not at the aperture you want or the weight you want, but if you're serious, you can get it done.

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
enerally speaking, what would I like to see with the FA limiteds? Improved edge sharpness, get rid of fringing, improve the coatings, add an in lens motor for silent operation and weather seal them.
The can be said of any lens ever made.

---------- Post added 09-16-17 at 03:52 PM ----------

Henry's lists 50 lenses available from Pentax.... Sigma Pentax 14 and Tamron Pentax 6.... that's 70 k-mount lenses. A few of those are Silver Edition repeats of other lenses, but I have to wonder, what are these mysterious lenses missing form the line up?

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
enerally speaking, what would I like to see with the FA limiteds? Improved edge sharpness, get rid of fringing, improve the coatings,.
The can be said of any lens ever made. So it's really not directed at Pentax.

The only question most companies want answered, is can they make money providing that for you and 9999 other people.

This is really simple. If can get what you want, go with it. If you can't go to some other company. If no other company does it either, maybe it's not doable.


Last edited by normhead; 09-16-2017 at 01:00 PM.
09-16-2017, 01:27 PM - 1 Like   #737
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Henry's lists 50 lenses available from Pentax.... Sigma Pentax 14 and Tamron Pentax 6.... that's 70 k-mount lenses. A few of those are Silver Edition repeats of other lenses, but I have to wonder, what are these mysterious lenses missing form the line up?

My guess is any first time user looking through the line up and looking for APS-c gear will find what they want, more so than other companies. On the other hand, K-1 users are probably a lot more experienced and have more specific needs, but with the "trinity" covered, there isn't much you can't get done, maybe not at the aperture you want or the weight you want, but if you're serious, you can get it done.



The can be said of any lens ever made.

---------- Post added 09-16-17 at 03:52 PM ----------

Henry's lists 50 lenses available from Pentax.... Sigma Pentax 14 and Tamron Pentax 6.... that's 70 k-mount lenses. A few of those are Silver Edition repeats of other lenses, but I have to wonder, what are these mysterious lenses missing form the line up?



The can be said of any lens ever made. So it's really not directed at Pentax.

The only question most companies want answered, is can they make money providing that for you and 9999 other people.

This is really simple. If can get what you want, go with it. If you can't go to some other company. If no other company does it either, maybe it's not doable.
Pentax is releasing new 50, 85 and 30-ish mm primes eventually. They are on the roadmap and unless they throw over the k mount, those lenses are coming. The question is how they will measure versus existent lenses and why would folks buy them over, say, old style FA limiteds. I listed a number of different things some of which are probably easier to do than others. What isn't hard for me to imagine is them making the lenses "better" than those in the past, even if they are not "perfect."

So I'm not sure what we are arguing about. Are you saying Pentax shouldn't release a DFA *30mm lens or are you saying it won't be any better than the FA 31 or what exactly?
09-16-2017, 02:12 PM - 1 Like   #738
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Even if old lenses are good enough, one has to play used market roulette to get them. This becomes a problem for attracting new users who look at what's available on some retailer's website.
at least someone understand this !! thank god
09-16-2017, 02:29 PM   #739
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There is a lot missing. Other companies are innovating. Canon may be late to the game with their new 85 1.4 but it's coming. How about tilt/shift lenses -- 3 new ones and with macro capability no less. Sony has released quite a few lenses for their e-line. More importantly Voigtlander, Zeiss, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina and others have stepped in to fill gaps with modern lenses. You would be hard pressed to find a single month in the last couple of years where an important lens hasn't been issued for the E mount. In addition Fuji and Olympus have released quite a few lenses for their respective systems.


When I made the move from Canon to Pentax it was after a lot of research and thought. As a long time Pentax 67 owner I knew what Pentax was capable of. I saw a company that had recently released an updated 50 and 100 macros, the 150-450 and then made the move in to full frame with the stellar K-1 which I love. At the same time came the 28-105, 15-30, and 70-200. There was a roadmap. Someone mentioned in one of these threads that no one looks at roadmaps -- well I did, and it was part of my decision making process. I'm not interested in the heavy fast primes today, but I might be someday. I also realized others are and I figured once these were out of the way other lenses that I am interested in would be forthcoming. There was no reason to think that over a year later not a single new lens would appear.


Just as importantly some of the little things that should have been no-brainers for Pentax to release are not available. How about a modern, AF, Aperture-relaying full frame teleconverter to match the 70-200 and 150-450. Ditto for extension tubes. How about supporting the brand with a learning center, supporting a few pros who release instructional videos. Rocky Nook has already released a book on the D850 but not they or any publisher (other than the e-book series here) has released one for the K-1. Why not support such an endeavor?


When one says there are a lot of available lenses this is in fact correct -- but here's the deal -- I don't want to spend endless hours pouring through old lens reports to figure out what will work with the camera, what's good, what iteration of the lens I should look for, then spend more endless hours searching ebay and other venues and hoping I manage to find what I'm looking for and hope the lens is useable when it comes. Not everyone is well versed in the extensive back line up of Pentax lenses. Some lenses also carry a "pentax" premium because the lenses are rare and their is no competition. I anticipated growing with the Pentax line-up as it grows, but if it never comes I, and probably quite a few others made a mistake moving here. Moving between systems is a really big deal and involves a lot of time in research, learning and of course, financially. It's not a simple thing to realize you'd like to use a lens that doesn't currently exist and just buy into a second system. If Pentax does not move forward in a timely fashion there will probably come a time when it will lose it's customer base and the ability to do so.


So what's missing? A star level line of modern, light F4 zooms: 16-35/17-40; 75/100-300. A couple of tilt/shifts. Teleconverters/extension tubes. Updating of the 135/1.8 the 200 macro. That's my wish list -- others will point out lenses they'd like.


Oh well that is just my 2 cents ...

09-16-2017, 02:29 PM   #740
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
So I'm not sure what we are arguing about. Are you saying Pentax shouldn't release a DFA *30mm lens or are you saying it won't be any better than the FA 31 or what exactly?
I thought I made it pretty clear.

Good small lenses are different than big lenses. There is less flexibility in what you can accomplish since adding more glass defeats the purpose.
What I'm saying is there are not going to be better small lenses for us compact shooters. The FA limiteds already have that covered.

What I see coming is big lenses. The FA limiteds will continue to be the best at what they are.
I'm sure the new lenses will measure better. The question will be , will anyone want them. Existing pentax users, apart from yourself and a few others like the size of the FAs. What Pentax is building is a different class of lens.

So really simply.The FA 31 will continue to be the best at what it is.
The new 30 will be whatever it is, because big fast primes are common and Pentax is late to the game.
NO one is even trying to compete in the premium small lens market these days.

Or to make it even clearer, there is some big heavy glass out there for Pentax right now. Many are not interested in it because they don't want to carry it. The Sigma 30 1.4 comes to mind. 435 grams (about a pound.)
Pentax 31 346 grams, (12 ounces)

There is no guarantee a Sigma 30 type lens ever replaces the 31 because of size and weight, even if Pentax makes a similar lens. Bigger heavier and nowhere near as good. That's just not a go. So how heavy would but have to be to be better.

There in lies the strength of the 31, 43 and 77. They do more with less, and some people will always treasure them for that. Even if you prefer better , bigger and heavier, sm will always prefer nearly as good smaller occupying less space.

QuoteQuote:
There is a lot missing. Other companies are innovating. Canon may be late to the game with their new 85 1.4 but it's coming. How about tilt/shift lenses -- 3 new ones and with macro capability no less. Sony has released quite a few lenses for their e-line. More importantly Voigtlander, Zeiss, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina and others have stepped in to fill gaps with modern lenses. You would be hard pressed to find a single month in the last couple of years where an important lens hasn't been issued for the E mount. In addition Fuji and Olympus have released quite a few lenses for their respective systems.
Seriously, instead of just tossing out your impressions how about some actual numbers? How many e-mount lenses released this year?

I look under Sony DSLR lenses (at henries) and I see 31 lenses. I look under Pentax I see 50. Maybe once they catch up they'll slow down their releases. But in any case how is that relevant? The problem with your accounting methods, is people are whining about having to look for older designs and second hand, when Pentax is still well out in the lead in their current catalogue. You can't have it both ways. Either you admit there's more choice with Pentax than Sony, or you go with some other argument.

Does anyone but me look at actual numbers? This whole argument that Sony or Canon or whoever is releasing better glass falls apart when you look at all the metrics. In some areas they aren't even competing.

Last edited by normhead; 09-16-2017 at 02:45 PM.
09-16-2017, 03:16 PM   #741
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Tick Tock, 3.5 months and the calender "year of the Prime(s)" ends....
09-16-2017, 03:21 PM   #742
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
(...)

Seriously, instead of just tossing out your impressions how about some actual numbers? How many e-mount lenses released this year?
I have identified 34 E-mount lenses released this year:

- four by Sony
- one by Zeiss
- two by Voigtländer
- four by Samyang
- two by Fujifilm
- three by 7Artisans
- one by HandeVision
- one by Kamlan
- one by Kenko Tokina
- one by Lensbaby
- one by Meike
- three by Meyer Optik Görlitz
- five by Schneider Kreuznach
- two by SLR Magic
- one by Venus Optics
- two by Zhong Yi.

I might have forgotten some in my list.
09-16-2017, 04:01 PM   #743
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Are you sure you didn't made that list longer than it should be? At least, remove the lenses which comes with a "100% Gullible Owner" certificate, the junk, and double check the numbers

09-16-2017, 04:15 PM   #744
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QuoteOriginally posted by travelswsage Quote
So what's missing? A star level line of modern, light F4 zooms: 16-35/17-40; 75/100-300. A couple of tilt/shifts. Teleconverters/extension tubes. Updating of the 135/1.8 the 200 macro. That's my wish list -- others will point out lenses they'd like.


Oh well that is just my 2 cents ...
YESSSS!!! These are the lenses we are looking for. But they require front filter threads on the wide zooms.

(We might be the only two though )

Sadly, I don't ever expect to see any of them outside of the 70ish-300mm they have on the roadmap. Might be time to look elsewhere..
09-16-2017, 06:37 PM   #745
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
I have identified 34 E-mount lenses released this year:

- four by Sony
- one by Zeiss
- two by Voigtländer
- four by Samyang
- two by Fujifilm
- three by 7Artisans
- one by HandeVision
- one by Kamlan
- one by Kenko Tokina
- one by Lensbaby
- one by Meike
- three by Meyer Optik Görlitz
- five by Schneider Kreuznach
- two by SLR Magic
- one by Venus Optics
- two by Zhong Yi.

I might have forgotten some in my list.
And how many do you own?
09-16-2017, 06:45 PM   #746
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Btw, we had quite a few in K-mount.
Manual lenses in 2017, who'd dare to imagine ?
09-16-2017, 09:05 PM   #747
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I would really like to acknowledge the effort both Sigma and Tamron made, staying with Pentax so long. They never raised pentax prices. They never said "We don't make as much money on Pentax so each lens made for Pentax should cost more." When I checked prices the Pentax price was pretty much the same as the Nikon of Canon price. They turned down a lot of profit trying to keep the mount alive. I own a Tamron AF SP 3002.8 in K-mount that internet rumour has it that only 100 were ever made. Tamron took a loss on that.
No, they broke even on Canon and Nikon mounts and anything sold in k mount was profit even when priced the same. Anyway, at the time of screw drive, the difference between Nikon Canon Pentax was a few pieces of metal that cost nothing, it is even possible to change the lens mount to mount the same lens onto another camera.
09-17-2017, 01:18 AM - 1 Like   #748
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Are you sure you didn't made that list longer than it should be? At least, remove the lenses which comes with a "100% Gullible Owner" certificate, the junk, and double check the numbers
Here a more detailed list for you to double check the numbers:

- four by Sony
1. 12-24mm f/4G
2. 16-35mm f/2.8 GM
3. 100mm f/2.8 STF GM OSS
4. 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 GM OSS

- one by Zeiss
1. Batis Apo Sonnar T* 135mm f/2.8

- two by Voigtländer
1. Nokton 40mm f/1.2 1sph.
2. Macro Apo-Lanthar 65mm f/2

- four by Samyang
1. AF 35mm f/1.4 FE
2. AF 35mm f/2.8 FE
3. VDSLR 16mm T/2.6
4. Xeen 20mm T/1.9

- two by Fujifilm
1. Fujinon MK 18-55mm T/2.9
2. Fujinon MK 50-135mm T/2.9

- three by 7Artisans
1. 7.5mm f/2.8 fish-eye
2. 25mm f/1.8
3. 35mm f/2

- one by HandeVision
1. Iberit 90mm f/2.4

- one by Kamlan
1. 50mm f/1.1

- one by Kenko Tokina
1. 400mm f/8 N II

- one by Lensbaby
1. Velvet 85mm f/1.8 Macro 1:2

- one by Meike
1. 85mm f/2.8 Macro

- three by Meyer Optik Görlitz
1. Trioplan 35+ f/2.8
2. Trioplan 50mm f/2.9
3. Trioplan 100mm f/2.8

- five by Schneider Kreuznach
1. Xenon FF Prime Tilt-Shift 25mm T/2.1
2. Xenon FF Prime Tilt-Shift 35mm T/2.1
3. Xenon FF Prime Tilt-Shift 50mm T/2.1
4. Xenon FF Prime Tilt-Shift 75mm T/2.1
5. Xenon FF Prime Tilt-Shift 100mm T/2.1

- two by SLR Magic
1. Cine 18mm f/2.8
2. Cine 25mm f/1.4

- one by Venus Optics
1. Laowa 15mm f/2 FE Zero-D

- two by Zhong Yi
1. Mitakon 35mm f/2
2. Mitakon 85mm f/2

---------- Post added 09-17-2017 at 10:22 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
And how many do you own?
I don't exactly see the point since I was just answering your request:
QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
(...) How many e-mount lenses released this year?
but I'll answer anyway: none. The reason is, I don't possess any E-mount camera.

Last edited by Mistral75; 09-17-2017 at 01:23 AM.
09-17-2017, 01:24 AM   #749
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FD mount is 30 years ago. EF mount was always electronic with no mechanical couplings. Pentax now has one lens like that...
09-17-2017, 02:26 AM   #750
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I thought I made it pretty clear.

Good small lenses are different than big lenses. There is less flexibility in what you can accomplish since adding more glass defeats the purpose.
What I'm saying is there are not going to be better small lenses for us compact shooters. The FA limiteds already have that covered.

What I see coming is big lenses. The FA limiteds will continue to be the best at what they are.
I'm sure the new lenses will measure better. The question will be , will anyone want them. Existing pentax users, apart from yourself and a few others like the size of the FAs. What Pentax is building is a different class of lens.

So really simply.The FA 31 will continue to be the best at what it is.
The new 30 will be whatever it is, because big fast primes are common and Pentax is late to the game.
NO one is even trying to compete in the premium small lens market these days.

Or to make it even clearer, there is some big heavy glass out there for Pentax right now. Many are not interested in it because they don't want to carry it. The Sigma 30 1.4 comes to mind. 435 grams (about a pound.)
Pentax 31 346 grams, (12 ounces)

There is no guarantee a Sigma 30 type lens ever replaces the 31 because of size and weight, even if Pentax makes a similar lens. Bigger heavier and nowhere near as good. That's just not a go. So how heavy would but have to be to be better.

There in lies the strength of the 31, 43 and 77. They do more with less, and some people will always treasure them for that. Even if you prefer better , bigger and heavier, sm will always prefer nearly as good smaller occupying less space.



Seriously, instead of just tossing out your impressions how about some actual numbers? How many e-mount lenses released this year?

I look under Sony DSLR lenses (at henries) and I see 31 lenses. I look under Pentax I see 50. Maybe once they catch up they'll slow down their releases. But in any case how is that relevant? The problem with your accounting methods, is people are whining about having to look for older designs and second hand, when Pentax is still well out in the lead in their current catalogue. You can't have it both ways. Either you admit there's more choice with Pentax than Sony, or you go with some other argument.

Does anyone but me look at actual numbers? This whole argument that Sony or Canon or whoever is releasing better glass falls apart when you look at all the metrics. In some areas they aren't even competing.
The FA limiteds aren't going anywhere. Maybe eventually Pentax will update them a bit -- something like what they did with the DFA 100 macro. But their presence does not negate the fact that Pentax is working on newer full frame lenses. And that makes sense. I don't think that many people are buying Pentax cameras any more specifically for the FA limiteds and most Pentaxians who want them own them. They probably don't sell a whole lot every year.

New lenses tend to get some advertising when they are reviewed by on line sites and if they test well, they can attract new photographers to the brand.

Anyway, they are coming and we have an idea of what they are going to be like when they eventually get here. Will I buy them over the FA limiteds I own? I don't know at this point. It depends on their price as well as the images we see from them and what my wife thinks she wants to shoot weddings.
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