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08-27-2008, 09:32 AM   #1
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Full frame and crop lenses

I read the Nikon D700 article in Popular Photo... and was appalled at one thing:

Apparently the camera recognizes a crop lens and switches down to 5.1 MP. They said it better in print than in their online copy:


QuoteQuote:
Of course, if all your lenses carry the DX moniker of Nikon's APS-sized format, you should stick with the D300. After all, it basically mirrors the image quality and performance of the D700, and your DX lenses will yield only 5.1MP images on the D700. In other words, those digital-only lenses will fit this full-frame camera, but at a cost of massive cropping -- a sacrifice that hardly seems worth making on a regular basis.
In print, they made the point that with full frame Canon you can't even use crop lenses?!!?

First of all, is this true? Seems idiotic to me: if I'm evolved enough to pay for one of these cameras, I want the option of using a crop lens full frame, for the effects at the least.

When Pentax puts out their full frame camera, I'd love to see this option available!

08-27-2008, 09:40 AM   #2
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* As for the Nikon situation: that's the price to pay because they chose a low Mpix sensor. If they had something like 20-25 FF sensor it wouldn't be a problem.
Note that D3X rumours would solve that (20-25Mpix FF sensor) but... at D3X price !

* As for Canon: it is true but because those lenses are APS-C. They are incompatible because the usually will get in the way of the mirror on an FF camera. This is somehow even more stupid (IMO) but this is Canon, they'd really prefer user to buy new lenses.
08-27-2008, 10:15 AM   #3
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So whats the big thing about FF over what we have now? Isn't it the same as the old 35mm view? You just get a better FOV?
08-27-2008, 10:54 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
* As for the Nikon situation: that's the price to pay because they chose a low Mpix sensor. If they had something like 20-25 FF sensor it wouldn't be a problem.
Note that D3X rumours would solve that (20-25Mpix FF sensor) but... at D3X price !
.

Yes...but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that there will be a D900 (or something) down the road....

08-27-2008, 10:56 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fl_Gulfer Quote
So whats the big thing about FF over what we have now? Isn't it the same as the old 35mm view? You just get a better FOV?

For the likes of the Nikon D3 and D700; mostly better high ISO performance - less noise.
Still, they sell remarkably well. Within six months we'll have "affordable" FF camera(s) with 20+mp...
08-27-2008, 10:59 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fl_Gulfer Quote
So whats the big thing about FF over what we have now? Isn't it the same as the old 35mm view? You just get a better FOV?
larger field of view for the same focal lengths

larger, and brighter, viewfinder (you really feel like you are "in" the shot)

shallower depth of field for the same aperture values compared to APC (assuming you move back to match FOV's)

these words really are meaningless until you pick up a Film camera and put it up to your eye

better yet find a medium format camera and put that up to your eye... good lord.


and the rest is technical, ie better dynamic range and less noise blah blah blah.


i used to not care about FF, well, i still dont... but every time i put my recently aquired film camera to my eye... you just want to have the same thing in your digital, hands down.
08-27-2008, 12:51 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
i used to not care about FF, well, i still dont... but every time i put my recently aquired film camera to my eye... you just want to have the same thing in your digital, hands down.
So, so, so well-put (if not well-spelled).

I really would love to have a digital with the same handling and viewfinder as my 25 year-old film SLR. I would even be happy with the same limited feature set! (Manual focus, aperture-priority exposure...well maybe we could keep the SR...)

Steve
08-27-2008, 01:17 PM   #8
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I really like this design and I hope that Pentax will follow suit. (Actually, at this point, I'm hoping that Pentax will stay afloat and come out with something competitive.)

I do not mind dropping to 5mp for certain lenses, since 5mp is plenty for a good size print. For those situations where you intend to print very large, you just need to make sure you have a FF lens of the appropriate length.

08-27-2008, 01:59 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
larger, and brighter, viewfinder (you really feel like you are "in" the shot)

.
Indeed. Those who never tried, find an MX or LX look through the viewfinder...
After that experience, I can tell you you will find your K20D viewinder to be small (and K100D viewfinder to be microscopic ^^).
08-27-2008, 02:09 PM   #10
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Yes, looking through my K100d Super after my Me Super almost makes me cry
08-27-2008, 02:29 PM   #11
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Original Poster
Provided ready cash, I would be eager to buy a Pentax full frame dSLR for the reasons above - AND I'd like to be able to use my 16-45, say, for a real wide angle extravaganza. Like I use it on a film body.

Seems Nikon won't let me, they crop me back to APS size without giving me a choice. And Canon wouldn't even let me mount the lens!
08-28-2008, 10:40 PM   #12
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300 F4 SDM appears to be full frame lens

Before purchasing the 300 F4 SDM, I mounted it on a used 35mm film body. Couldn't see any sign of vignetting. So I would say just because a lens is marked DA does not necessarily mean that it is only for the cropped sensors. Of course I can't tell what the edge to edge image quality would be.

Last edited by pureluck; 08-28-2008 at 10:48 PM. Reason: spelling
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