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03-01-2018, 02:28 PM   #346
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Chris, if it "had been the plan all along" are your words actually.
I'm not trying to convince you of anything, after so many posts I know it's futile. It's you that is trying to convince us of Ricoh Imaging's plans (or lack of) regarding a new APS-C flagship. And... "that are able to see unicorns"? Scorning me only shows your unwillingness to listen to any argument. I dare say, not even Ricoh Imaging's.

Please don't say I'm hating the KP, that's a lie. I would have that camera now, if I didn't go FF - and no, that doesn't change anything.

03-01-2018, 02:44 PM   #347
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Pentax have a ready for manufacture high end aps lens. This tells us alle we need to know about their long term strategy.
03-01-2018, 02:47 PM   #348
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Chris, if it "had been the plan all along" are your words actually.
I'm not trying to convince you of anything, after so many posts I know it's futile. It's you that is trying to convince us of Ricoh Imaging's plans (or lack of) regarding a new APS-C flagship. And... "that are able to see unicorns"? Scorning me only shows your unwillingness to listen to any argument. I dare say, not even Ricoh Imaging's.

Please don't say I'm hating the KP, that's a lie. I would have that camera now, if I didn't go FF - and no, that doesn't change anything.
Well, not convince. I remeber merely suggesting, months ago already, or just saying that it has started to look progressively so, that the KP was meant as one of the high end APS-C refreshes, which had the main inclination, that the next high end APS-C release will have to wait a year or so longer than I had hoped, and also many others had hoped. At what point do you throw in the towel and accept what is undeniable?
The K1mkII rumor? The total lack of any APS-C body rumors? Asahiman stating on the other forum in very clear words: n APS-C body release in 2019? The DA11-18mm f2.8 mounted on the KP at CP+?
When, tell me when...
My talk of unicorns refers to myself, if anyone.

It will come, the next APS-C high end body will come.
I think that is something we are all willing to agree on

Chris
03-01-2018, 02:49 PM   #349
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
It will come, the next APS-C high end body will come. I think that is something we are all willing to agree on
Yep. It will.

03-01-2018, 03:44 PM - 2 Likes   #350
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
Just relax, all those that hate the KP and crave the K3III. A new APS-C high end body will come, and the KP will be discontinued. You have the patience, I did not.
So in the end, in 1, 1,5 or so years time, yo will have your craved new high end APS-C K... body, costing 1500,- or so, and I will probably upgrade too.
And I will have enjoyed the very real KP, that I can hold in my hand, and enjoy the latest Pentax technology with, for a year or more, and you will have enjoyed anticipating the not yet so very real K... assuming it was just around the corner all the time..

And who will have been right? Won't matter a bit then.
Chris
Enjoying my KP right now.

I have been planning for a Galapagos (and other places) trip, and originally was going to take the K-1 with DA*60-250 (FF modded), DA28-105, and FA20-35, with a K-3 as backup/2nd active body. A bit awkward with the difference in sensor size, and certainly heavier than I wanted (with the various restrictions imposed by this trip format). I really, REALLY wanted the K-3 replacement for this trip, to be paired with my old K-3 and a different lens lineup (to include the DA*60-250, DA16-85, and DA12-24), but it was obviously not going to be available in time.

Finally, my brain exploded, and I went for the KP and DA55-300 PLM, to be supplemented by the DA16-85 and DA12-24, with the K-3 still as backup/2nd active body. Matching sensor sizes and less weight. Simple lens lineup. A few extra batteries needed for the KP, of course. The KP is hardly a full replacement for the K-3 line (missing this, weak that, etc.), but has many advancements, also found in the K-1, over the K-3 line. An important feature, for me, of the KP is the articulated LCD display, missing in the K-5 and K-3 lines. Also it has the 3rd wheel that the K-1 has. Love it.

Pounding on the KP and DA55-300 PLM during the recent January Single In Challenge showed that both were highly suited to my version of my upcoming trip. I don't feel that my images will be harmed much by the lack of the K-1. I have a new, balanced travel kit.

Now that I have that situation squared away, I'm definitely going to be getting the K-3 replacement in the future. To me, it's been obvious all along that there will be one, just as it was obvious to me that Pentax was going to have a FF camera at some point. I quietly amassed a nice line of old FF FA lenses in preparation for the Pentax FF. Got my K-1 when it became available, after letting the early adopters verify that it was a great camera. I have no inside knowledge of what Ricoh is up to, nor am I an all-seeing genius, but the Ricoh path has been reasonable IMHO. They keep me happy, but a biiiiiiiiiiiiiit slowly . And I'm jumping all over the upcoming (whenever) D-FA 70-200/f4.

I guess I'm old enough (retired) to have the patience to deal with the Ricoh way.

Y'all can now return to your hand-wringing. I got my KP.
03-01-2018, 09:05 PM   #351
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QuoteOriginally posted by Chris Mak Quote
And in the meantime, a KP was launched, with all bells and whistles, including a dedicated battery grip, and it is even used to showcase a DA*11-18mm f2.8 at CP+, which in your view and that of others, is a downright mismatch, searching for yet another stick to beat the KP of the stage.

Chris
K200D was with battery grip too.... I think KP will be at the market after K-3's replacement. It's just 1 year old.
K-3III will be fully packed machine and KP will become middle level camera.

I think K-70 and K-S2 will be discontinued this year, not KP.
03-02-2018, 12:05 AM   #352
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then the K-90 ?
03-02-2018, 02:02 AM   #353
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
K200D was with battery grip too.... I think KP will be at the market after K-3's replacement. It's just 1 year old.
K-3III will be fully packed machine and KP will become middle level camera.

I think K-70 and K-S2 will be discontinued this year, not KP.
The K200D batterygrip was little more than a cheapskate container for four penlight batteries. The KP batterygrip is a fully featured 250,- euro batterygrip, Pentax' most expensive APS-C batterygrip to date. Saying that the KP was designed as a middle level camera, is the same as saying that the K1 was designed as a middle level camera. Which you might argue is the case: there certainly is room above the K1 for a true high end FF camera, with eg. higher frame rate, larger buffer, faster AF. So I suppose such a camera is being developed in tandem with the desired APS-C top level camera?
Perhaps they will be released together, and KP and K1 can descend together to middle level cameras?

03-02-2018, 02:33 AM - 2 Likes   #354
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The KP was a hugely missed opportunity.
If it had a proper buffer, many people would consider it, even with a smaller battery (the grip would fix that), and slightly lower specs in performance points, which were still acceptable to many.
I mean, even for the guy taking pictures with his family, in something like a falconry show, that buffer depth is ridiculous.
It's amazing how some people get paid to make decisions like that.
It could have been so much more, with only a little more.
03-02-2018, 03:20 AM   #355
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QuoteOriginally posted by dafbp Quote
The KP was a hugely missed opportunity.
If it had a proper buffer, many people would consider it, even with a smaller battery (the grip would fix that), and slightly lower specs in performance points, which were still acceptable to many.
I mean, even for the guy taking pictures with his family, in something like a falconry show, that buffer depth is ridiculous.
It's amazing how some people get paid to make decisions like that.
It could have been so much more, with only a little more.
Yes, buffer depth is seriously limited for a high end camera, 10 shot burst per IR review. You cn take additional shots though while the buffer is clearing. Point is, the K1 does not do all that much better with 17 frames and a 45 sec. buffer clearing time. Also not exactly high end. The cameras must have been designed along a similar philosophy, not sensitive to action shooters' needs. Otherwise, there is no explanation for neglecting burst and buffer.
03-02-2018, 03:50 AM - 1 Like   #356
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If people want a D500 equivalent then they should probably just get a D500. I've said before, but I would think Pentax would release a K3 II sequel that has two card slots, some improvement in auto focus, buffer of 35 to 40 RAW files, frame rate of somewhere between 8 and 9 fps and probably some bump in video specs. I hesitate to guess on video because while the market seems to expect 4K video at this price point, Pentax has not been very aggressive at adding top end video to their cameras.

Of course, it will have an accelerator chip and IBIS and astro tracer and improved pixel shift.

The goal is to have a camera that stands out versus others in the market -- not one that mimics an existing camera already out there.
03-02-2018, 04:10 AM   #357
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I didn't know the K3 was a D500 equivalent.
From the comments here I thought it was way below it.
Which is why I was comparing the KP to the K3, because it could've replaced it, apart from a few highly demanding scenarios, if some things were kept on par, with the buffer being the main limiting factor (fps, battery, speed are only slightly below K3).
Pentax could've made a sporty camera, not top notch like the D500, but plenty enough for a large segment of users, with better than the competition IQ. Instead, it was shunned by those wanting a K3 replacement, which means it doesn't get the visibility it deserves.
IQ doesn't show in fact sheets...
03-02-2018, 07:28 AM   #358
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QuoteOriginally posted by TedH42 Quote
Enjoying my KP right now.
Reminds me at something...

walter shoback | Tumblr
03-02-2018, 08:21 AM   #359
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QuoteOriginally posted by dafbp Quote
The KP was a hugely missed opportunity.
No, people here have been so busy knocking the KP for what it isn't, that they haven't noticed what it is. It doesn't have improved AF - without that, I'm not sure there is much point to a larger buffer. It is much better at low light than any Nikon camera is; it was the proving ground for high ISO capabilities that are now in the K-1ii, but people were so busy looking for the K-3iii they didn't notice. Perhaps Pentax is having trouble working around the Nikon AF patents, so they decided to go another route.


So, if you want a D500, go ahead and spend 50% more - just be aware that both DxOMark tests and user experience say it isn't very good at higher ISO settings, so you should also plan to purchase expensive f/2 lenses.
03-02-2018, 09:07 AM - 1 Like   #360
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
If people want a D500 equivalent then they should probably just get a D500.
It'd be more than enough if we finally got an AF equivalent to that of the D7100 - I don't think anyone is realistically expecting D500 level AF performance from Pentax in the next 10 years or so.
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