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09-18-2018, 08:44 PM   #1381
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QuoteOriginally posted by alcstudios Quote
I myself would love a nice new shiny body as my K3 is getting a little long in the tooth, but if they announced a 16-50 and 50-135 with updated motors I would pre order both of them on the spot. I have both of the originals that are currently paperweights after several SDM replacements.

I love them both optically but have spent too much on repairs so I gave up on them.
I read here at Pentaxforums for ~ one year ago that DA* has new SDM motors.
The indication is that the cartons are in silver instead of black.
I bought DA200 and DA300 at spring 17, DA200 has black carton and DA300 silver.

09-18-2018, 08:47 PM   #1382
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
We have 3 derivatives of that IN Oz(well on the big island).

NZ has one and they come to OZ to play the another one!
It must be said that, this week, I'm a Springbok supporter.
(But I suspect I'll be an All Black supporter again before long.)
09-18-2018, 10:41 PM   #1383
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I feel sad about all this frustration

QuoteOriginally posted by Bophoto Quote
I read here at Pentaxforums for ~ one year ago that DA* has new SDM motors.
The indication is that the cartons are in silver instead of black.
I bought DA200 and DA300 at spring 17, DA200 has black carton and DA300 silver.
Although the overall quality curve is flattening out, that is any newer digital camera can produce outstanding images, but we all want the option of new gear.
Photography marketing gets you hooked on brand because of the investment in lenses and accessories. This makes it hard to change platforms .

After all the company that gave us Takumar lenses , Instant return mirror , the Spotmatic and pioneered IBIS was a hard act to follow...…..but they no longer lead, In fact I am not sure they are still in the game.
Bophoto was right , they don't seem to be interested in staying competitive.

As I mentioned in earlier post, the weight of the gear was the main reason I replaced most of my Pentax gear with a mirrorless system . But I would have been tempted to remain had they come out with the K3 replacement.

A year into my mirrorless system, with its 24mpx sensor, I find it to be a far superior camera to the K3 in many ways . And the lenses and motors focus fast and actually worked.

I use to work on Ricoh copiers, which are very competitive in that industry. However, Ricoh's involvement in photography has never been competitive, so what makes you think they they intend to change?


Just saying.
09-18-2018, 11:26 PM - 5 Likes   #1384
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QuoteOriginally posted by photobobhunt Quote
the weight of the gear was the main reason I replaced most of my Pentax gear with a mirrorless system
No, the main reason for you to get a mirrorless camera is that your need was created by marketing folks. Before knowing that mirrorless exists, you were content with what you had. It's not real, being content is a state of mind that has no substance, it all happened in your mind. That's how marketing make a living off their jobs: making customers constructively discontent of their old product in order to create the motive to buy something new even if the older product just works fine.

09-18-2018, 11:45 PM - 2 Likes   #1385
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QuoteOriginally posted by photobobhunt Quote
After all the company that gave us Takumar lenses , Instant return mirror , the Spotmatic and pioneered IBIS was a hard act to follow...…..but they no longer lead, In fact I am not sure they are still in the game.
Bophoto was right , they don't seem to be interested in staying competitive.
They're certainly in the game, or we wouldn't see new products coming to market - and there has been a slow but steady series of releases... KP, K-1, K-1II, DFA*50/1.4 etc.

As to whether they're interested in staying competitive, I think their game is different than it used to be. I don't believe they have any intention of trying to compete directly with Nikon, Canon, Sony etc., nor carrying the business risks associated with that in the current ILC market. I believe they're content to serve the existing user base with quality products, and attract more customers than they lose, whilst keeping investment and risk relatively low compared to the bigger manufacturers.

I've used the analogy of the "Morgan Motor Company" in the past. It doesn't try to compete with Ford, General Motors, Nissan, Toyota etc. and it would be a mistake to compare it with those big manufacturers. Instead, it does its own thing, and does it well. It has a strong, loyal and slowly-growing owner base. Still, some people will sell their Morgan cars and never buy another. That's OK.
09-19-2018, 12:02 AM   #1386
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I would think if Pentax released updated 16-50 f2.8, 50-135 f2.8, plus the DA *11-18 f2.8 that would be enough to take APS-C users through till the spring when the K3 II sequel will likely be announced. It still might be too much to expect a reboot of the 16-50 and 50-135, but newer drive motors would make a nice improvement on them both.
Updated DA* would definitly be welcome and I agree, that would keep APS-C users happy for a long time, at the condition new version comes with improved edge performance and less CA. An updated 300mm would be very welcome too as slow motor is very frustrating on that lens.
09-19-2018, 12:23 AM   #1387
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I would think if Pentax released updated 16-50 f2.8, 50-135 f2.8, plus the DA *11-18 f2.8 that would be enough to take APS-C users through till the spring when the K3 II sequel will likely be announced. It still might be too much to expect a reboot of the 16-50 and 50-135, but newer drive motors would make a nice improvement on them both.
From my point of view announcement (or beater releasing) of this new DA* zoom lenses is more anticipated than a new body. I think it would also show more commitment to APS-C system than this new body, as lenses still last longer than camera bodies

09-19-2018, 01:44 AM   #1388
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I've seen both Ricoh's SilverBox and Black/green Hoya box, star lenses to fail with SDM. The SDM piece itself looks little different than it was in first production runs, thing that changed the most is the circuit board within the lens, in newer revisions SDM "rotor" is a bit more "bulk",plastic gears seems to be built of diffrent material, but still IMO it is forced for too big torque than materials used can withstand for long. When not used, it seems to "stick" and when forced to move after long pause in use, whole mechanism is prone to ware out rapidly.

Only solution for that case is to develop a new transition system, drop the screw drive completely, and put there a motor that have enough torque potential to withstand the forces needed to drive focusing lens group. And that means redesign whole of the lens assembly and chassis, aperture mechanism control, probably also the lens formula itself.
09-19-2018, 02:24 AM   #1389
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My assumption with updated DA * lenses is that they would be optically revised as well as losing the dual drive system. The issue with SDM is not just that it is prone to failure in these lenses, but also that it is really slow. The DA *50-135 is about my slowest lens to focus -- probably only second to the DA *55.
09-19-2018, 02:50 AM   #1390
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I would think if Pentax released updated 16-50 f2.8, 50-135 f2.8, plus the DA *11-18 f2.8 that would be enough to take APS-C users through till the spring when the K3 II sequel will likely be announced. It still might be too much to expect a reboot of the 16-50 and 50-135, but newer drive motors would make a nice improvement on them both.
I think that the 16-50 need improvement. Although the lens is OK (mostly), it is not up to the standards expected for a "star" lens these days....
09-19-2018, 03:06 AM   #1391
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
My assumption with updated DA * lenses is that they would be optically revised as well as losing the dual drive system. The issue with SDM is not just that it is prone to failure in these lenses, but also that it is really slow. The DA *50-135 is about my slowest lens to focus -- probably only second to the DA *55.
Indeed, but that is not because the SDM(piezoelectric micromotor) tech itself, but because its coupled with fancy gear mechanism assembly that need to be very precisely tuned etc and have to run quite heavy lens groups in rather large distance. IMO this kind of drive is suitable for lightweight super zooms like Tamron 16-300, not for beasts like 60-250/4 or even DA*55. With such lenses it is running on top of its possible power. Using it for constant aperture, internal focusing zooms and high grade primes was kinda shoot in the foot.
09-19-2018, 03:08 AM   #1392
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QuoteOriginally posted by Reed Quote
Indeed, but that is not because the SDM(piezoelectric micromotor) tech itself, but because its coupled with fancy gear mechanism assembly that need to be very precisely tuned etc and have to run quite heavy lens groups in rather large distance. IMO this kind of drive is suitable for lightweight super zooms like Tamron 16-300, not for beasts like 60-250/4 or even DA*55. With such lenses it is running on top of its possible power. Using it for constant aperture, internal focusing zooms and high grade primes was kinda shoot in the foot.
I suppose. The DA *55 is actually quite small and a lot of the issue with that lens is how long the focus throw is. But there is no doubt that the amount of time it takes to rack from one end to the other is measured in seconds, not miliseconds.
09-19-2018, 03:08 AM   #1393
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pål Jensen Quote
I think that the 16-50 need improvement. Although the lens is OK (mostly), it is not up to the standards expected for a "star" lens these days....
Indeed. 11-18/16-50/50-135 all 2.8 and built to the same (renewed) DA* standard could keep Pentax APS-C the best choice in this segment.
09-19-2018, 04:20 AM   #1394
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QuoteOriginally posted by taktoon Quote
From my point of view announcement (or beater releasing) of this new DA* zoom lenses is more anticipated than a new body. I think it would also show more commitment to APS-C system than this new body, as lenses still last longer than camera bodies
Lenses may last longer than body .... but these days Pentax seems to be concentrating on a level of perfection that makes them cost as much also, resulting in a really slow development cycle and putting them out of reach of my budget.
09-19-2018, 04:51 AM   #1395
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
.... but these days Pentax seems to be concentrating on a level of perfection that makes them cost as much also, resulting in a really slow development cycle and putting them out of reach of my budget.
I wonder if that's part of the (official?) strategy of moving Pentax to a more premium positioning...
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