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02-12-2018, 03:34 PM   #286
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
So you give up 70% of your good light resolution for better low light. Agreed, some people will go for that. Not me, but no doubt some people. For low light, the K-1 works great.

No demo, low light images? Maybe because they usually suck?
Who’s throwing out good light resolution? Most pictures I take I keep pretty much all of the frame, I’m not generally shooting tiny birds and cropping out the whole sensor. That may be your use case but you seem to think that because I can’t get the same reach on a FF sensor that I for some reason have to crop out most of my pictures? I don’t get it. Do you think that most people with a K-1 crop out 70% of their frame on a regular basis too?

Yeah the K-1 does pretty dang well in low light, it’s an impressive camera. No denying that at all. Pentax did a great job on that body with the sensor.

Maybe I’m misunderstanding you...

02-12-2018, 03:36 PM   #287
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IMO it does better than the D750.
02-12-2018, 03:46 PM   #288
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
They never told dealers about this fullframe compatibility. It's in shops as an aps-c lens. Same for 200mm and 300mm lenses.
Bzzzzz wrong.
What's up Ron, you used to be able to find something against Pentax resisting critics for a least half a second.
Try again.
02-12-2018, 04:25 PM - 1 Like   #289
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
That's the beauty in Ricoh Imaging's naming conventions: even dealers get lost, not to mention their clients.
Pentax should definitely do a renaming to get simpler. It would be better for everyone : buyers and sellers

02-12-2018, 04:27 PM   #290
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They might do that - by launching new D FA versions, with improved motors and - for the DA* 200mm at least - with improved optics. Other things seems more urgent though.
02-12-2018, 07:13 PM   #291
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
They never told dealers about this fullframe compatibility. It's in shops as an aps-c lens. Same for 200mm and 300mm lenses.
All they have to do then is change the name of the lenses! Print new boxes and new nameplates, and they're done.
02-12-2018, 07:28 PM   #292
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QuoteOriginally posted by nkull Quote
Who’s throwing out good light resolution? Most pictures I take I keep pretty much all of the frame, I’m not generally shooting tiny birds and cropping out the whole sensor. That may be your use case but you seem to think that because I can’t get the same reach on a FF sensor that I for some reason have to crop out most of my pictures? I don’t get it. Do you think that most people with a K-1 crop out 70% of their frame on a regular basis too?

Yeah the K-1 does pretty dang well in low light, it’s an impressive camera. No denying that at all. Pentax did a great job on that body with the sensor.

Maybe I’m misunderstanding you...
I use the K-3 for distance, and small birds, I use the K-1 for low light where I don't need 8 FPS, the D750 doesn't really do a good job of replacing either. The K-3 is better for distance, the K-1 is better for low light resolution? Where does the D750 fit in again? Even if I'm talking D4 and D850 it doesn't make any sense either .A D7500 coupled with a D810 would make sense for me. The D750 a compromise, not the best at anything, acceptably good at just about everything. But as soon as you think about 2 bodies, it's role is going to be very limited.

K-1 not cropped, more resolution than a D750.


K-3 cropped, also better than a D750.


Just when is it I need D750?

Last edited by normhead; 02-12-2018 at 07:40 PM.
02-13-2018, 03:39 AM - 1 Like   #293
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QuoteOriginally posted by nkull Quote
Whoís throwing out good light resolution? Most pictures I take I keep pretty much all of the frame, Iím not generally shooting tiny birds and cropping out the whole sensor. That may be your use case but you seem to think that because I canít get the same reach on a FF sensor that I for some reason have to crop out most of my pictures? I donít get it. Do you think that most people with a K-1 crop out 70% of their frame on a regular basis too?

Yeah the K-1 does pretty dang well in low light, itís an impressive camera. No denying that at all. Pentax did a great job on that body with the sensor.

Maybe Iím misunderstanding you...
The problem with most folks is that they compare the K-1 images at the pixel level with the D750 images at the pixel level. The K-1 images should be downsized to D750 size or the D750 images should be upsized to the same as K-1 for any sort of valid comparison. The assumption has to be that output size remains constant. Once you do that, you find that (as DXO Mark found) that SNR is exactly the same between these two cameras and that the dynamic range is a little better on the K-1 than the D750.

I can't really see Pentax releasing a 24 megapixel camera with the sensor in the D750. It is getting pretty long in tooth, doesn't have 4K video support and really is actually pretty slow for a 24 megapixel camera with regard to current frame rates. Rumors are that part of the reason that Pentax is releasing version II of the K-1 has to do with less availability of the current 36 megapixel sensor. The Nikon D600 was released in 2012 with this sensor. I just can't imagine releasing a camera into today's market with the sort of specifications and uncertainties with regard to long term sensor production you would get using such a sensor. The only reason to do it is to keep the camera cheap.

02-13-2018, 03:45 AM   #294
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The entry level D750 image quality is nothing to brag about today.
The K-1 trounces it fully and the K-P is pretty much on par (while being the better camera overall).
Pentax would be foolish to lower standards to D750 level.
02-13-2018, 04:02 AM   #295
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Just when is it I need D750?
It's easier to get range with aps-c. So I would recommend it for birding unless you want to break the bank on expensive long glass. By the way, has anybody ever told you you sharpen your pics to death?
02-13-2018, 04:18 AM   #296
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I guess I'm having a hard time following what people are arguing about in this thread. I thought this was a thread about a K3 II sequel. If that is the case, then discussions about the D750 and the K-1 are probably not particularly useful. The whole reason to release a full frame camera with a 24 megapixel sensor would be to have a little cheaper full frame camera and that would almost certainly mean no K3 II sequel. Pentax just doesn't have room for two full frame camera lines and three APS-C cameras.

My expectation is that there must be a new APS-C sensor coming out that Pentax is planning to use for the next gen camera. The whole point of advanced APS-C is faster frame rates than with full frame (it isn't really that hard to get faster than 6 fps which is what the D750 does, better reach for those who shoot wildlife or just like long lenses. These days APS-C has really good quality images and if you compare the D750 to the D7500 on DXO Mark, you actually find that the D7500 has similar performance with regard to dynamic range throughout its iso range, but is one stop behind with regard to noise. That is really impressive, as the thing that really limits high iso performance is not noise (which can be taken care of in post), but lack of dynamic range which often makes photos pretty unusable.
02-13-2018, 04:33 AM   #297
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I believe Ricoh has so far not used the IMX271 aps-c sensor, which has fast readout 19fps and 4K capable. Or maybe they did but the prime III/IV Prime M-II can't handle it. (because the K-70 is supposed to have on sensor pd-af in video mode).
02-13-2018, 05:40 AM   #298
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QuoteOriginally posted by D1N0 Quote
It's easier to get range with aps-c. So I would recommend it for birding unless you want to break the bank on expensive long glass. By the way, has anybody ever told you you sharpen your pics to death?
Most people don't.

Many, I don't sharpen at all depending on lighting conditions. We'd have to see, if I sharpen my images to death, or you are just so used to seeing flat unsharp images that mine look oversharpened to you. But, that's a different topic. You want me to run a poll and we'll see what everyone else thinks?

We could study preferences in sharpening.

I'd build in a part to see if folks can actually tell the difference between high contrast lighting, and sharpening in PP. Looking at a few on the 300 plus club, no, I don't think my sharpening is overdone compared to most.

.What's your frame of reference? Am I over sharpening or do you just prefer flat images? Do you really want to know?

Last edited by normhead; 02-13-2018 at 06:02 AM.
02-13-2018, 05:54 AM   #299
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
You want me to run a poll and we'll see what everyone else thinks?
Go ahead, but that won't change the way I perceive them
02-13-2018, 05:55 AM   #300
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
The whole point of advanced APS-C is faster frame rates than with full frame
Not. The "whole point" is APSC is much more affordable. And users have exactly the same range of requirements as for FF. Framerate in the past has been something that was waaayyyy low in the priority list of buyers. Just the same as long lenses. No relevant demand.
There are probably as many people wanting high framerates as there are people wanting more body colors.
It is one requirement out of very many of equal rights.

It is always the same in these threads: people claim their personal agenda is everyone's majority agenda. It is not.
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