Good: New roadmap, new lens

Dan Rentea · 03-02-2018, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

It is also the most versatile single focal length lens for the 35mm format.

What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens.

FantasticMrFox · 03-02-2018, 03:48 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by skierd

I also think its safe to assume that the Sigma 50 1.4, Zeiss Milvus, Tokina Opera, and the DFA 50 1.4 will be in the price ballpark with each other but unless Pentax whiff's it the DFA should be at least equal if not the best of the bunch.

While I don't doubt that the D FA* 50 f/1.4 will be excellent, why are you so sure it will 'at least' equal, if not best the Sigma 50 f/1.4 'Art' or Zeiss Milvus? I don't know much about the Zeiss, but the Sigma is regarded as maybe the best 50 mm DSLR lens, full stop.

Based on the reviews I have come across, e.g. the Pentax 70-200 f/2.8, while certainly very good, does not exactly seem to have bested the Nikon or Canon equivalents, so I'm not sure where the confidence comes from that new Pentax lenses would trump everything else optically.

angerdan · 03-02-2018, 03:49 PM

Originally posted by Dan Rentea

What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens.

Originally posted by angerdan

Its THE normal focal length, so bringing a modern, first class optical construction design with faster AF is a key role for the lens lineup.

Normal lens - Wikipedia

Wheatfield · 03-02-2018, 03:50 PM

Originally posted by Dan Rentea

What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens.

Try doing a close portrait with a 35mm sometime. The 35 is right up there for versatility, but the 50 will work better in more situations. Granted it isn’t wide enough a lot of the time, but then neither is the 35. Granted it isn’t long enough a lot of the time, but it will do better than the 35. I worked as a photo finisher through the 1980s when the single focal length compact with 35mm lens was king. Most of what I saw would have been improved by longer glass.

---------- Post added 03-02-18 at 04:52 PM ----------

Originally posted by angerdan

Normal lens - Wikipedia

Irrelevant.

Fenwoodian · 03-02-2018, 04:40 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by FantasticMrFox

While I don't doubt that the D FA* 50 f/1.4 will be excellent, why are you so sure it will 'at least' equal, if not best the Sigma 50 f/1.4 'Art' or Zeiss Milvus? I don't know much about the Zeiss, but the Sigma is regarded as maybe the best 50 mm DSLR lens, full stop.

I don't know anything about the Sigma 50 Art lens, but I just finished up a side-by-side comparison of the Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 and Leica R 50/2 Summicron on my Pentax K1. The Leica is highly regarded, but the Zeiss was better in every way, but bokeh (I'd call that a tie). So, if the new Pentax 50/1.4 turns out to compare favorably with the Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 that's saying a lot.

Being that the Sigma Art 50 and the new Tokina 50mm premium lenses are not available in K mount (nor are they adaptable), I doubt that we'll ever see a direct comparison between those two lenses and the new Pentax DFA 50/1.4 lens. However, I own a Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 in K mount and a K1 camera - so if one of you early adapters of the new 50 DFA wants to send it to me for side-by-side testing, I'd be pleased to do it.

angerdan · 03-02-2018, 04:48 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Fenwoodian

Being that the Sigma Art 50 and the new Tokina 50mm premium lenses are not available in K mount (nor are they adaptable), I doubt that we'll ever see a direct comparison between those two lenses and the new Pentax DFA 50/1.4 lens.

DFA*50 1.4 coming - Page 200 - PentaxForums.com

**clackers** · 03-02-2018, 05:09 PM

Originally posted by Dan Rentea

... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens.

35mm is a wide angle.

I think it's versatile on APS-C.

Fenwoodian · 03-02-2018, 05:14 PM

Originally posted by angerdan

DFA*50 1.4 coming - Page 200 - PentaxForums.com

Thanks for posting the above photo. Very interesting size comparison. Although in my post I was referring to a comparison of the actual images. I guess that I should have been clearer.

I noticed that the Tokina lens' front element's surface appears to be fairly "flat". While I own two Zeiss Milvus lenses with front elements that are extremely concave, I don't know of any other modern lenses that have flat front lens elements. I guess that's just modern computered aided design for you.

Also noticed that the two lenses focus in opposite directions.

**jatrax** · 03-02-2018, 05:45 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Fenwoodian

Also noticed that the two lenses focus in opposite directions.

Tokina noted in their presentation that the lens would be able to focus in either direction depending on which mount it was for, Canon or Nikon. I also saw a post (but think it was only speculation) that the lens would be fly-by-wire not on a helicoid. Personally I doubt that but I've no evidence either way.

HarisF1 · 03-02-2018, 06:08 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Fenwoodian

Thanks for posting the above photo. Very interesting size comparison. Although in my post I was referring to a comparison of the actual images. I guess that I should have been clearer.

I noticed that the Tokina lens' front element's surface appears to be fairly "flat". While I own two Zeiss Milvus lenses with front elements that are extremely concave, I don't know of any other modern lenses that have flat front lens elements. I guess that's just modern computered aided design for you.

Also noticed that the two lenses focus in opposite directions.

Off the top of my head I can recall that the 18-135 has a flat front element. There will be a few but it doesn't seem like there's any pattern between them.

Paul the Sunman · 03-02-2018, 06:27 PM

Originally posted by Fenwoodian

I noticed that the Tokina lens' front element's surface appears to be fairly "flat". ... I don't know of any other modern lenses that have flat front lens elements. I guess that's just modern computered aided design for you.

OTTOMH

DA 16-85
DA 18-135
DFA 28-105
DFA* 70-200
DFA 150-450 (almost)

biz-engineer · 03-02-2018, 10:43 PM

Originally posted by Dan Rentea

What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens.

IMO, things have gotten wider over time. We now see ultra wide angles lenses optically good and affordable that were unthinkable 20 to 50 years ago. In the 70s, 35mm was considered wide because there weren't many good lenses below this focal length, and 50mm was considered the normal lens. I'm in my 40s, you are probably in your 30s or 40s, but if you were in your 70s you'd be considering 50mm as the right normal FL.

There is an advantage of the 50mm, if you want wider you can still pan and still later.

FantasticMrFox · 03-03-2018, 01:42 AM

Originally posted by angerdan

DFA*50 1.4 coming - Page 200 - PentaxForums.com

I thought asahiman already confirmed that the lens is co-designed by Ricoh and Tokina?

normhead · 03-03-2018, 06:54 AM - **8 Likes**

This whole conversation is insane.
All we need to be concerned about is the Pentax name on the lens. That means, custom Pentax electronic reporting and lens identification in the exif, and operates like every Pentax lens. It won't be like my Rokinon that just says "A lens" and I have to dial in the focal length. It won't e like my Sigma 70 that gives me there right FL but the wrong lens name.

All I care about is that the lens gives me the same convenience as a Pentax lens. I seriously don't understand why anyone gives a rat's tail about this. Lenses are judged on their optical characteristics first, and then on how they function on your camera. If every Pentax ever made was designed by some guy living in his mom's basement, I personally wouldn't care. It's about the product, not the name on it.

When ever someone says "this lens is a rebadge" I think "what a useless waste of brain cells that information is."

**Mikesul** · 03-03-2018, 07:05 AM

Originally posted by normhead

This whole conversation is insane.
All we need to be concerned about is the Pentax name on the lens. That means, custom Pentax electronic reporting and lens identification in the exif, and operates like every Pentax lens. It won't be like my Rokinon that just says "A lens" and I have to dial in the focal length. It won't e like my Sigma 70 that gives me there right FL but the wrong lens name.

All I care about tis that the lens gies me the same convenience as a Pentax lens. I seriously don't understand why any give a rats tail about this. Lenses are judged on their optical characteristics first, and then on how they function on your camera. If every Pentax ever made was designed bt some guy living in his mom's basement, I personally wouldn't care. It's about the product, not the name on it.

When ever someone says "this lens is a rebadge" I think "what a useless waste of brain cells that information is."

Precisely! Nice rant

03-02-2018, 04:48 PM - 1 Like	#366
angerdan Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,639	*Pentax D FA 50mm vs Tokina opera 50mm** Originally posted by Fenwoodian Being that the Sigma Art 50 and the new Tokina 50mm premium lenses are not available in K mount (nor are they adaptable), I doubt that we'll ever see a direct comparison between those two lenses and the new Pentax DFA 50/1.4 lens. DFA*50 1.4 coming - Page 200 - PentaxForums.com

03-02-2018, 05:14 PM	#368
Fenwoodian Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,874	Originally posted by angerdan DFA50 1.4 coming - Page 200 - PentaxForums.com Thanks for posting the above photo. Very interesting size comparison. Although in my post I was referring to a comparison of the actual images. I guess that I should have been clearer. I noticed that the Tokina lens' front element's surface appears to be fairly "flat". While I own two Zeiss Milvus lenses with front elements that are extremely concave, I don't know of any other modern lenses that have flat front lens elements. I guess that's just modern computered aided design for you. Also noticed that the two lenses focus in opposite directions. Last edited by Fenwoodian; 03-02-2018 at 05:28 PM.*

03-03-2018, 06:54 AM - 8 Likes	#374
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	This whole conversation is insane. All we need to be concerned about is the Pentax name on the lens. That means, custom Pentax electronic reporting and lens identification in the exif, and operates like every Pentax lens. It won't be like my Rokinon that just says "A lens" and I have to dial in the focal length. It won't e like my Sigma 70 that gives me there right FL but the wrong lens name. All I care about is that the lens gives me the same convenience as a Pentax lens. I seriously don't understand why anyone gives a rat's tail about this. Lenses are judged on their optical characteristics first, and then on how they function on your camera. If every Pentax ever made was designed by some guy living in his mom's basement, I personally wouldn't care. It's about the product, not the name on it. When ever someone says "this lens is a rebadge" I think "what a useless waste of brain cells that information is." Last edited by normhead; 03-03-2018 at 10:00 AM.

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03-02-2018, 03:17 PM	#361
Dan Rentea Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Bucharest Posts: 1,716	Originally posted by Wheatfield It is also the most versatile single focal length lens for the 35mm format. What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens.

03-02-2018, 03:48 PM - 1 Like	#362
FantasticMrFox Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Munich Posts: 2,339	Originally posted by skierd I also think its safe to assume that the Sigma 50 1.4, Zeiss Milvus, Tokina Opera, and the DFA 50 1.4 will be in the price ballpark with each other but unless Pentax whiff's it the DFA should be at least equal if not the best of the bunch. While I don't doubt that the D FA* 50 f/1.4 will be excellent, why are you so sure it will 'at least' equal, if not best the Sigma 50 f/1.4 'Art' or Zeiss Milvus? I don't know much about the Zeiss, but the Sigma is regarded as maybe the best 50 mm DSLR lens, full stop. Based on the reviews I have come across, e.g. the Pentax 70-200 f/2.8, while certainly very good, does not exactly seem to have bested the Nikon or Canon equivalents, so I'm not sure where the confidence comes from that new Pentax lenses would trump everything else optically.

03-02-2018, 03:49 PM	#363
angerdan Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,639	Originally posted by Dan Rentea What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens. Originally posted by angerdan Its THE normal focal length, so bringing a modern, first class optical construction design with faster AF is a key role for the lens lineup. Normal lens - Wikipedia

03-02-2018, 03:50 PM	#364
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by Dan Rentea What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens. Try doing a close portrait with a 35mm sometime. The 35 is right up there for versatility, but the 50 will work better in more situations. Granted it isn’t wide enough a lot of the time, but then neither is the 35. Granted it isn’t long enough a lot of the time, but it will do better than the 35. I worked as a photo finisher through the 1980s when the single focal length compact with 35mm lens was king. Most of what I saw would have been improved by longer glass. ---------- Post added 03-02-18 at 04:52 PM ---------- Originally posted by angerdan Normal lens - Wikipedia Irrelevant.

03-02-2018, 04:40 PM - 1 Like	#365
Fenwoodian Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,874	Originally posted by FantasticMrFox While I don't doubt that the D FA* 50 f/1.4 will be excellent, why are you so sure it will 'at least' equal, if not best the Sigma 50 f/1.4 'Art' or Zeiss Milvus? I don't know much about the Zeiss, but the Sigma is regarded as maybe the best 50 mm DSLR lens, full stop. I don't know anything about the Sigma 50 Art lens, but I just finished up a side-by-side comparison of the Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 and Leica R 50/2 Summicron on my Pentax K1. The Leica is highly regarded, but the Zeiss was better in every way, but bokeh (I'd call that a tie). So, if the new Pentax 50/1.4 turns out to compare favorably with the Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 that's saying a lot. Being that the Sigma Art 50 and the new Tokina 50mm premium lenses are not available in K mount (nor are they adaptable), I doubt that we'll ever see a direct comparison between those two lenses and the new Pentax DFA 50/1.4 lens. However, I own a Zeiss Milvus 50/1.4 in K mount and a K1 camera - so if one of you early adapters of the new 50 DFA wants to send it to me for side-by-side testing, I'd be pleased to do it.

03-02-2018, 05:09 PM	#367
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by Dan Rentea ... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens. 35mm is a wide angle. I think it's versatile on APS-C.

03-02-2018, 05:45 PM - 1 Like	#369
jatrax Site Supporter Join Date: May 2010 Location: Washington Cascades Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,991	Originally posted by Fenwoodian Also noticed that the two lenses focus in opposite directions. Tokina noted in their presentation that the lens would be able to focus in either direction depending on which mount it was for, Canon or Nikon. I also saw a post (but think it was only speculation) that the lens would be fly-by-wire not on a helicoid. Personally I doubt that but I've no evidence either way.

03-02-2018, 06:08 PM - 1 Like	#370
HarisF1 Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 543	Originally posted by Fenwoodian Thanks for posting the above photo. Very interesting size comparison. Although in my post I was referring to a comparison of the actual images. I guess that I should have been clearer. I noticed that the Tokina lens' front element's surface appears to be fairly "flat". While I own two Zeiss Milvus lenses with front elements that are extremely concave, I don't know of any other modern lenses that have flat front lens elements. I guess that's just modern computered aided design for you. Also noticed that the two lenses focus in opposite directions. Off the top of my head I can recall that the 18-135 has a flat front element. There will be a few but it doesn't seem like there's any pattern between them.

03-02-2018, 06:27 PM	#371
Paul the Sunman Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Melbourne Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,843	Originally posted by Fenwoodian I noticed that the Tokina lens' front element's surface appears to be fairly "flat". ... I don't know of any other modern lenses that have flat front lens elements. I guess that's just modern computered aided design for you. OTTOMH DA 16-85 DA 18-135 DFA 28-105 DFA* 70-200 DFA 150-450 (almost)

03-02-2018, 10:43 PM	#372
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by Dan Rentea What? You're talking about the 50mm focal lenght as the most versatile prime for full frame? I don't agree at all, but we all have different opinions... For me, 35mm is by far the most versatile prime lens. IMO, things have gotten wider over time. We now see ultra wide angles lenses optically good and affordable that were unthinkable 20 to 50 years ago. In the 70s, 35mm was considered wide because there weren't many good lenses below this focal length, and 50mm was considered the normal lens. I'm in my 40s, you are probably in your 30s or 40s, but if you were in your 70s you'd be considering 50mm as the right normal FL. There is an advantage of the 50mm, if you want wider you can still pan and still later.

03-03-2018, 01:42 AM	#373
FantasticMrFox Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Munich Posts: 2,339	Originally posted by angerdan DFA*50 1.4 coming - Page 200 - PentaxForums.com I thought asahiman already confirmed that the lens is co-designed by Ricoh and Tokina?

03-03-2018, 07:05 AM	#375
Mikesul Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,594	Originally posted by normhead This whole conversation is insane. All we need to be concerned about is the Pentax name on the lens. That means, custom Pentax electronic reporting and lens identification in the exif, and operates like every Pentax lens. It won't be like my Rokinon that just says "A lens" and I have to dial in the focal length. It won't e like my Sigma 70 that gives me there right FL but the wrong lens name. All I care about tis that the lens gies me the same convenience as a Pentax lens. I seriously don't understand why any give a rats tail about this. Lenses are judged on their optical characteristics first, and then on how they function on your camera. If every Pentax ever made was designed bt some guy living in his mom's basement, I personally wouldn't care. It's about the product, not the name on it. When ever someone says "this lens is a rebadge" I think "what a useless waste of brain cells that information is." Precisely! Nice rant