Good: New roadmap, new lens

**Rondec** · 02-27-2018, 03:29 AM

Originally posted by Adam

2 lenses about to be released, new 2 lenses added to the roadmap. Can't complain!

Interesting that there will be a D FA 70-200mm F4. I wonder what that will mean for the DA 60-250mm (perhaps nothing).

Pentax considers the DA 60-250 to be APS-C only. I doubt the 70-200 f4 would change its availability. My guess is the 70-200, beyond having better corners on full frame will have a lot faster auto focus motor.

Originally posted by DeadJohn

The 70-200 f4 is a surprise. I'll venture a guess that it's a rebadge of this recent Tamron release TAMRON | 70-210mm /F4 Di VC USD

Rebadges are okay because, due to [design and manufacturing constraints] Pentax cannot churn out many new lenses at the same time. Sigma and Tamron won't commit to k-mount, so the most expeditious way to get new lenses is for Pentax to pay Tamron, then we pay Pentax more. If Tamron made new lenses in k-mount, they would still need to charge a premium to cover small runs.

It's curious how we're getting the 50, 85, and now 70-200 all before the ultrawide prime. I wonder if Ricoh sees more future in portraiture than landscapes.

I don't think any of these are rebadges. If they were, what would be the point of waiting till 2019? I think Pentax wants to have their own lens stable that they have designed and produced, not lean on Tamron for help more than they have to.

D1N0 · 02-27-2018, 03:38 AM

Originally posted by DeadJohn

I'll venture a guess that it's a rebadge of this recent Tamron release TAMRON | 70-210mm /F4 Di VC USD

If it were a Tamron Rebadge it would be 70-210. Not 70-200. More likely this is another joint effort with Tokina. They already have a 70-200 F4.

**ffking** · 02-27-2018, 03:56 AM

Originally posted by D1N0

More likely this is another joint effort with Tokina. They already have a 70-200 F4.

At present it's not designated a * lens, which kind of suggests rebadge for a fixed aperture. Anyway, with the possible exception of the 150-450 and replacing my old (F) 100mm I'm only buying * lenses in future - I've got the other bases covered

- so, convenient as a 70-200 f/4 would be, it's probably not for me - not that any of that is of any interest to anybody else, just thought I'd mention

ogl · 02-27-2018, 04:13 AM

Originally posted by Andrea K

With my needs in mind there is already the 60-250 f/4 that with a little mod covers the FF, I own it and now it's glued to my k-1. Surely a dedicated design as the DFA 70-200 f/4 would be better but it may not be a win-win choice.

24-70/4 could be better and cheaper

HarisF1 · 02-27-2018, 04:21 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by ffking

At present it's not designated a * lens, which kind of suggests rebadge for a fixed aperture. Anyway, with the possible exception of the 150-450 and replacing my old (F) 100mm I'm only buying * lenses in future - I've got the other bases covered

- so, convenient as a 70-200 f/4 would be, it's probably not for me - not that any of that is of any interest to anybody else, just thought I'd mention

The D-FA 28-105 beats most 'other brand' kit lenses yet is a non * lens. I don't think it's a rebadge, which shows that Pentax are still capable of making mainstream lenses to extremely high standards.

timautin · 02-27-2018, 04:24 AM - **2 Likes**

I'm really surprised to see the 70-200 f4 popping out of nowhere, but seeing all the positive feedback here I guess that it's a good move.
Still, I would have thought the wide & ultra-wide angle would have been the biggest emergency since the K1 release. I was waiting the CP+ to see if we would have a date for them, but I'll go for the Laowa 12 mm instead.
I also wonder if they are working concurrently on the roadmapped lenses or in serial. If the latter, seeing the recent lens releases rate, we have a six years visibility. That's going to be long, we might have to actually use the gear we already have and take pictures! Meh!

HarisF1 · 02-27-2018, 04:35 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by timautin

I'm really surprised to see the 70-200 f4 popping out of nowhere, but seeing all the positive feedback here I guess that it's a good move.

Definitely a good move - I've really wanted something like the DA* 50-135 for my K-1.

timautin · 02-27-2018, 04:43 AM

Originally posted by HarisF1

Definitely a good move - I've really wanted something like the DA* 50-135 for my K-1.

A good move, yes, a better move than a D-FA* 15ish + 20ish, I don't think so. But luckily for you, I'm not deciding ^^

**pres589** · 02-27-2018, 04:47 AM

Yeah, the Tokina has been around for a few years, apparently. It wouldn't take Ricoh that long to put a new suit of clothes on a lens that's been on the market for a while. I don't know that it can be 100% ruled out that this isn't a rebadge but it seems very unlikely.

Something else; I doubt they make nearly as much money from a rebadge as an in-house developed and built product. Development of the k-mount 15-30 or 24-70 was probably pretty minor in comparison to building the 70-200 or 28-105 that is offered from Pentax today, but, Tamron is still going to make profit on the deal, and then Ricoh has to make something... It just doesn't seem like good business to rebadge any more than you have to if you're in a position like Ricoh is.

D1N0 · 02-27-2018, 04:54 AM

Originally posted by pres589

I don't know that it can be 100% ruled out that this isn't a rebadge but it seems very unlikely.

The advantage of working with Tokina is that you can change a bit more about the lens design. Pentax could really improve on the current Tokina lens or they could make an F4 version of the 70-200 F2.8 and share that with Tokina.

Na Horuk · 02-27-2018, 05:35 AM - **1 Like**

Its a bit odd if you ask me. Why would we need another 70-200mm before standard zooms, WR primes, DFA Limiteds? Where are the primes between 20mm and 35mm? DFA* 50mm and 85mm sound great, but the wide angle primes have been missing for a really long time now and "2019 or later" is really far away. There were already some 50mm available, and the FA 77mm for portraiture (as a 85mm alternative)

Originally posted by Rondec

Pentax considers the DA 60-250 to be APS-C only.

Yes, but just removing the baffle on the back makes it more FF. You can check threads about this modification. So Pentax would need minimal tweaks to turn this already popular lens into a fully FF lens (add AF/MF button, HD coatings, improve baffle, maybe do minimal tweaks to the optics and its done). Much less work than starting from nothing, and the 60-250mm has better range than 70-200 and it is really compact. It would make more sense than to make another 70-200mm, so that you at least get a tiny bit of extra range in comparison to the 70-200mm zooms

**THoog** · 02-27-2018, 05:57 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Na Horuk

Yes, but just removing the baffle on the back makes it more FF. You can check threads about this modification. So Pentax would need minimal tweaks to turn this already popular lens into a fully FF lens (add AF/MF button, HD coatings, improve baffle, maybe do minimal tweaks to the optics and its done). Much less work than starting from nothing, and the 60-250mm has better range than 70-200 and it is really compact. It would make more sense than to make another 70-200mm, so that you at least get a tiny bit of extra range in comparison to the 70-200mm zooms

What about focus speed? As much as I love my 60-250, it's relatively slow to focus. I even suspect that it may be more of a contributor to the "Pentax AF sux" mindset than the number of focus points. And then there's the focus breathing. I don't think either of these issues have easy fixes. A 70-200/4 with PLM-like focus speed could be an attractive option.

rangercarp · 02-27-2018, 06:11 AM

Originally posted by Andrea K

Big disappointment because I don't see a 24-90 f/4 or 24-105 f/4.

I agree -- though I would prefer 30-140 f/4 -- but I don't take this as a disappointing add, but rather a sign they are thinking about f/4 lenses.

Originally posted by beachgardener

I would not be surprised if one of those is in the planning but not on the road map yet, to compliment the 70-200f4

Let's hope!

DimC · 02-27-2018, 06:12 AM

Originally posted by pinholecam

70-200/4 could be the new Tamron 70-210/4, but lets see.

I don't really mind/care so long as there are more modern lens options.

Looks like WA and UWA primes are a while away for me, so I will have to look at the current options first and decide in 2019/2020 if I will swap to the Pentax options.
Not that I really need any more lenses actually...

If you're not stuck with Primes, the FA 20-35mm /F4 is great for landscapes (From /F8 it's super sharp edges included).

rangercarp · 02-27-2018, 06:14 AM

Originally posted by DeadJohn

The 70-200 f4 is a surprise. I'll venture a guess that it's a rebadge of this recent Tamron release TAMRON | 70-210mm /F4 Di VC USD

How on earth does that make sense? A rebadge of the Tamron 70-210 would not be a 70-200.

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02-27-2018, 03:29 AM	#46
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,662	Originally posted by Adam 2 lenses about to be released, new 2 lenses added to the roadmap. Can't complain! Interesting that there will be a D FA 70-200mm F4. I wonder what that will mean for the DA 60-250mm (perhaps nothing). Pentax considers the DA 60-250 to be APS-C only. I doubt the 70-200 f4 would change its availability. My guess is the 70-200, beyond having better corners on full frame will have a lot faster auto focus motor. Originally posted by DeadJohn The 70-200 f4 is a surprise. I'll venture a guess that it's a rebadge of this recent Tamron release TAMRON \| 70-210mm /F4 Di VC USD Rebadges are okay because, due to [design and manufacturing constraints] Pentax cannot churn out many new lenses at the same time. Sigma and Tamron won't commit to k-mount, so the most expeditious way to get new lenses is for Pentax to pay Tamron, then we pay Pentax more. If Tamron made new lenses in k-mount, they would still need to charge a premium to cover small runs. It's curious how we're getting the 50, 85, and now 70-200 all before the ultrawide prime. I wonder if Ricoh sees more future in portraiture than landscapes. I don't think any of these are rebadges. If they were, what would be the point of waiting till 2019? I think Pentax wants to have their own lens stable that they have designed and produced, not lean on Tamron for help more than they have to.

02-27-2018, 03:38 AM	#47
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	Originally posted by DeadJohn I'll venture a guess that it's a rebadge of this recent Tamron release TAMRON \| 70-210mm /F4 Di VC USD If it were a Tamron Rebadge it would be 70-210. Not 70-200. More likely this is another joint effort with Tokina. They already have a 70-200 F4.

02-27-2018, 03:56 AM	#48
ffking Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Old South Wales Posts: 6,039	Originally posted by D1N0 More likely this is another joint effort with Tokina. They already have a 70-200 F4. At present it's not designated a * lens, which kind of suggests rebadge for a fixed aperture. Anyway, with the possible exception of the 150-450 and replacing my old (F) 100mm I'm only buying * lenses in future - I've got the other bases covered - so, convenient as a 70-200 f/4 would be, it's probably not for me - not that any of that is of any interest to anybody else, just thought I'd mention

02-27-2018, 04:13 AM	#49
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by Andrea K With my needs in mind there is already the 60-250 f/4 that with a little mod covers the FF, I own it and now it's glued to my k-1. Surely a dedicated design as the DFA 70-200 f/4 would be better but it may not be a win-win choice. 24-70/4 could be better and cheaper

02-27-2018, 04:21 AM - 1 Like	#50
HarisF1 Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 543	Originally posted by ffking At present it's not designated a * lens, which kind of suggests rebadge for a fixed aperture. Anyway, with the possible exception of the 150-450 and replacing my old (F) 100mm I'm only buying * lenses in future - I've got the other bases covered - so, convenient as a 70-200 f/4 would be, it's probably not for me - not that any of that is of any interest to anybody else, just thought I'd mention The D-FA 28-105 beats most 'other brand' kit lenses yet is a non * lens. I don't think it's a rebadge, which shows that Pentax are still capable of making mainstream lenses to extremely high standards.

02-27-2018, 04:24 AM - 2 Likes	#51
timautin Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 346	I'm really surprised to see the 70-200 f4 popping out of nowhere, but seeing all the positive feedback here I guess that it's a good move. Still, I would have thought the wide & ultra-wide angle would have been the biggest emergency since the K1 release. I was waiting the CP+ to see if we would have a date for them, but I'll go for the Laowa 12 mm instead. I also wonder if they are working concurrently on the roadmapped lenses or in serial. If the latter, seeing the recent lens releases rate, we have a six years visibility. That's going to be long, we might have to actually use the gear we already have and take pictures! Meh!

02-27-2018, 04:35 AM - 1 Like	#52
HarisF1 Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Posts: 543	Originally posted by timautin I'm really surprised to see the 70-200 f4 popping out of nowhere, but seeing all the positive feedback here I guess that it's a good move. Definitely a good move - I've really wanted something like the DA* 50-135 for my K-1.

02-27-2018, 04:43 AM	#53
timautin Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Posts: 346	Originally posted by HarisF1 Definitely a good move - I've really wanted something like the DA* 50-135 for my K-1. A good move, yes, a better move than a D-FA* 15ish + 20ish, I don't think so. But luckily for you, I'm not deciding ^^

02-27-2018, 04:47 AM	#54
pres589 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Wichita, KS Photos: Albums Posts: 4,533	Yeah, the Tokina has been around for a few years, apparently. It wouldn't take Ricoh that long to put a new suit of clothes on a lens that's been on the market for a while. I don't know that it can be 100% ruled out that this isn't a rebadge but it seems very unlikely. Something else; I doubt they make nearly as much money from a rebadge as an in-house developed and built product. Development of the k-mount 15-30 or 24-70 was probably pretty minor in comparison to building the 70-200 or 28-105 that is offered from Pentax today, but, Tamron is still going to make profit on the deal, and then Ricoh has to make something... It just doesn't seem like good business to rebadge any more than you have to if you're in a position like Ricoh is.

02-27-2018, 04:54 AM	#55
D1N0 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2012 Location: --- Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,802	Originally posted by pres589 I don't know that it can be 100% ruled out that this isn't a rebadge but it seems very unlikely. The advantage of working with Tokina is that you can change a bit more about the lens design. Pentax could really improve on the current Tokina lens or they could make an F4 version of the 70-200 F2.8 and share that with Tokina.

02-27-2018, 05:35 AM - 1 Like	#56
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	Its a bit odd if you ask me. Why would we need another 70-200mm before standard zooms, WR primes, DFA Limiteds? Where are the primes between 20mm and 35mm? DFA* 50mm and 85mm sound great, but the wide angle primes have been missing for a really long time now and "2019 or later" is really far away. There were already some 50mm available, and the FA 77mm for portraiture (as a 85mm alternative) Originally posted by Rondec Pentax considers the DA 60-250 to be APS-C only. Yes, but just removing the baffle on the back makes it more FF. You can check threads about this modification. So Pentax would need minimal tweaks to turn this already popular lens into a fully FF lens (add AF/MF button, HD coatings, improve baffle, maybe do minimal tweaks to the optics and its done). Much less work than starting from nothing, and the 60-250mm has better range than 70-200 and it is really compact. It would make more sense than to make another 70-200mm, so that you at least get a tiny bit of extra range in comparison to the 70-200mm zooms

02-27-2018, 05:57 AM - 2 Likes	#57
THoog Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: North Carolina Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,685	Originally posted by Na Horuk Yes, but just removing the baffle on the back makes it more FF. You can check threads about this modification. So Pentax would need minimal tweaks to turn this already popular lens into a fully FF lens (add AF/MF button, HD coatings, improve baffle, maybe do minimal tweaks to the optics and its done). Much less work than starting from nothing, and the 60-250mm has better range than 70-200 and it is really compact. It would make more sense than to make another 70-200mm, so that you at least get a tiny bit of extra range in comparison to the 70-200mm zooms What about focus speed? As much as I love my 60-250, it's relatively slow to focus. I even suspect that it may be more of a contributor to the "Pentax AF sux" mindset than the number of focus points. And then there's the focus breathing. I don't think either of these issues have easy fixes. A 70-200/4 with PLM-like focus speed could be an attractive option.

02-27-2018, 06:11 AM	#58
rangercarp Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Southern Michigan Posts: 437	Originally posted by Andrea K Big disappointment because I don't see a 24-90 f/4 or 24-105 f/4. I agree -- though I would prefer 30-140 f/4 -- but I don't take this as a disappointing add, but rather a sign they are thinking about f/4 lenses. Originally posted by beachgardener I would not be surprised if one of those is in the planning but not on the road map yet, to compliment the 70-200f4 Let's hope!

02-27-2018, 06:12 AM	#59
DimC Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Paris Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 813	Originally posted by pinholecam 70-200/4 could be the new Tamron 70-210/4, but lets see. I don't really mind/care so long as there are more modern lens options. Looks like WA and UWA primes are a while away for me, so I will have to look at the current options first and decide in 2019/2020 if I will swap to the Pentax options. Not that I really need any more lenses actually... If you're not stuck with Primes, the FA 20-35mm /F4 is great for landscapes (From /F8 it's super sharp edges included).

02-27-2018, 06:14 AM	#60
rangercarp Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Southern Michigan Posts: 437	Originally posted by DeadJohn The 70-200 f4 is a surprise. I'll venture a guess that it's a rebadge of this recent Tamron release TAMRON \| 70-210mm /F4 Di VC USD How on earth does that make sense? A rebadge of the Tamron 70-210 would not be a 70-200.