Good: New roadmap, new lens

**clackers** · 02-27-2018, 11:35 PM

Originally posted by thibs

Not if they want to label it with a *

My guess is that the project doesn't use a more junior designer, it's their top dog Saori, who will do both, and he has to see the 50mm through first.

It will be a template for the 85, 35 and any others in the series, not just in design, but in the manufacturing processes (which according to one theory will involve re-establishing communications with Tokina).

The guy who posted he'd tried the 50 in Vegas was impressed, FWIW.

**ffking** · 02-28-2018, 12:56 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by ogl

70-200/4 - I think it will be Tokina AT-X PRO SD 70-200mm F4.0 (IF)

Very good lens, by the way - with the sharpness and IQ of prime.
Tokina 70-200mm Review

There is no sharper telephoto zoom made. You can pay more, but no telephoto zoom is sharper. This Tokina is as sharp as the state-of-the-art Nikon 70-200mm f/4 VR and Nikon 70-200/2.8 VR II, and sharper than Nikon's older teles.

There would be a certain logic to this - if they have licenced the new 50 f/1.4 to Tokina, as is speculated, this could be some sort of quid pro quo deal.

As I think about it, I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are, even if we lose exclusivity in the process - but reputation enhancement is probably more important right now

robjmitchell · 02-28-2018, 01:39 AM

Originally posted by ffking

There would be a certain logic to this - if they have licenced the new 50 f/1.4 to Tokina, as is speculated, this could be some sort of quid pro quo deal.

As I think about it, I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are, even if we lose exclusivity in the process - but reputation enhancement is probably more important right now

Yes for all we know pentax may be making the opera 50/1.4 lens for Tokina to sell to Nikon and canon users, while Tokina make the new 50-200/4 for us. It would make a lot of sense from the tooling side of things, that’s for sure.

ogl · 02-28-2018, 01:57 AM

Originally posted by ffking

There would be a certain logic to this - if they have licenced the new 50 f/1.4 to Tokina, as is speculated, this could be some sort of quid pro quo deal.

As I think about it, I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are, even if we lose exclusivity in the process - but reputation enhancement is probably more important right now

I've checked reviews of Tokina 70-200/4 and verdict is very positive.
(in Russian too - see photos from this Tokina - ????? Tokina AT-X PRO FX SD 70-200 f/4 VCM-S | ???????? but Nikon colours)

DimC · 02-28-2018, 02:45 AM

Originally posted by ogl

I've checked reviews of Tokina 70-200/4 and verdict is very positive.
(in Russian too - see photos from this Tokina - ????? Tokina AT-X PRO FX SD 70-200 f/4 VCM-S | ???????? but Nikon colours)

Seems like a nice lens

Sharpness and bokeh looks good.
but the colors...

**clackers** · 02-28-2018, 02:55 AM

Originally posted by ffking

I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are

Asahi Man seems to have suggested this.

ogl · 02-28-2018, 03:13 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by DimC

Seems like a nice lens

Sharpness and bokeh looks good.
but the colors...

It's NIKON

DagT · 02-28-2018, 03:15 AM

Originally posted by kenspo

Be sure that I will make them stuff the 70-200 a place where the sun doesn't shine!

No need for that. Just give it to me and I can keep it in my cellar (when not in use).

DimC · 02-28-2018, 03:21 AM

Originally posted by ogl

It's NIKON

...and that's why I never wanna go there!

Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

ogl · 02-28-2018, 03:27 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by DimC

...and that's why I never wanna go there!

Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

There is good word to explain such thing -

Eyesore

**Rondec** · 02-28-2018, 04:06 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Sandy Hancock

I think those waiting for the FA limiteds to get a refresh need to move on. Their reputation is firmly established, by both their qualities and imperfections. They are finished products from an otherwise extinct line. I think we should all be thankful that they still available new.

The DFA series is all about uncompromising image quality in an era obsessed with sharpness wide open and minimal distortion or aberration. There is enough legacy glass floating around for those of us who like pixie dust.

The roadmap looks fine, although (like all of us) I'd like to see it fulfilled a little quicker.

I like the FA limiteds and would like to see them given a refresh at some point -- add sealing, quick shift and HD coatings. I think that sort of a project should be reserved for when Pentax has a more complete full frame lens line up done. It really wouldn't change the quality a whole lot and it would tie up resources that hopefully are being used right now to create new (very high quality) lenses.

Every brand needs f1.8 primes as well as f1.4 primes and those can be the FA limiteds from Pentax's standpoint.

I still don't see why everyone keeps saying things about rebranding Tokina or Tamron lenses. I wouldn't have a big problem with it, but if Pentax was planning with doing that, why would they wait till 2019 to release the lenses? Just tell Tamron or Tokina what you want and how much and go. It is pretty clear they are creating their own lens designs. They may license them to Tokina, but not the reverse.

Kunzite · 02-28-2018, 04:11 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Rondec

I still don't see why everyone keeps saying things about rebranding Tokina or Tamron lenses.

Because they want to diminish Pentax' achievements.

dafbp · 02-28-2018, 04:15 AM

About the 70-200: does f4 vs f2.8 means mandatory (as in laws of physics) worse IQ, or is that just a design decision (as in f2.8 is for pros, so f4 doesn't need to be good just cheap)?
Can't a "slow" lens have "pro" IQ, while being smaller, and (hopefully) cheaper?

**RobA_Oz** · 02-28-2018, 04:17 AM

Originally posted by ogl

There is good word to explain such thing -

Eyesore

Or, in Nikon advertising style: I AM, I SAW.

Kunzite · 02-28-2018, 04:21 AM

Originally posted by dafbp

About the 70-200: does f4 vs f2.8 means mandatory (as in laws of physics) worse IQ, or is that just a design decision (as in f2.8 is for pros, so f4 doesn't need to be good just cheap)?
Can't a "slow" lens have "pro" IQ, while being smaller, and (hopefully) cheaper?

Of course an f/4 lens can be very good optically and in every other regard (just like there's no guarantee an f/2.8 zoom would be excellent). The limiting factor is usually the price, those lenses are expected at a lower price target.

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02-27-2018, 11:35 PM	#136
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by thibs Not if they want to label it with a * My guess is that the project doesn't use a more junior designer, it's their top dog Saori, who will do both, and he has to see the 50mm through first. It will be a template for the 85, 35 and any others in the series, not just in design, but in the manufacturing processes (which according to one theory will involve re-establishing communications with Tokina). The guy who posted he'd tried the 50 in Vegas was impressed, FWIW.

02-28-2018, 12:56 AM - 2 Likes	#137
ffking Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Old South Wales Posts: 6,038	Originally posted by ogl 70-200/4 - I think it will be Tokina AT-X PRO SD 70-200mm F4.0 (IF) Very good lens, by the way - with the sharpness and IQ of prime. Tokina 70-200mm Review There is no sharper telephoto zoom made. You can pay more, but no telephoto zoom is sharper. This Tokina is as sharp as the state-of-the-art Nikon 70-200mm f/4 VR and Nikon 70-200/2.8 VR II, and sharper than Nikon's older teles. There would be a certain logic to this - if they have licenced the new 50 f/1.4 to Tokina, as is speculated, this could be some sort of quid pro quo deal. As I think about it, I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are, even if we lose exclusivity in the process - but reputation enhancement is probably more important right now

02-28-2018, 01:39 AM	#138
robjmitchell Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Melbourne Aus Posts: 1,776	Originally posted by ffking There would be a certain logic to this - if they have licenced the new 50 f/1.4 to Tokina, as is speculated, this could be some sort of quid pro quo deal. As I think about it, I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are, even if we lose exclusivity in the process - but reputation enhancement is probably more important right now Yes for all we know pentax may be making the opera 50/1.4 lens for Tokina to sell to Nikon and canon users, while Tokina make the new 50-200/4 for us. It would make a lot of sense from the tooling side of things, that’s for sure.

02-28-2018, 01:57 AM	#139
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by ffking There would be a certain logic to this - if they have licenced the new 50 f/1.4 to Tokina, as is speculated, this could be some sort of quid pro quo deal. As I think about it, I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are, even if we lose exclusivity in the process - but reputation enhancement is probably more important right now I've checked reviews of Tokina 70-200/4 and verdict is very positive. (in Russian too - see photos from this Tokina - ????? Tokina AT-X PRO FX SD 70-200 f/4 VCM-S \| ???????? but Nikon colours)

02-28-2018, 02:45 AM	#140
DimC Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Paris Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 813	Originally posted by ogl I've checked reviews of Tokina 70-200/4 and verdict is very positive. (in Russian too - see photos from this Tokina - ????? Tokina AT-X PRO FX SD 70-200 f/4 VCM-S \| ???????? but Nikon colours) Seems like a nice lens Sharpness and bokeh looks good. but the colors...

02-28-2018, 02:55 AM	#141
clackers Otis Memorial Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Melbourne Photos: Albums Posts: 16,397	Originally posted by ffking I sort of hope that the new Tokina 50 Opera is effectively a rebadged Pentax - it would let Canikon users see just how good Pentax optics are Asahi Man seems to have suggested this.

02-28-2018, 03:13 AM - 1 Like	#142
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by DimC Seems like a nice lens Sharpness and bokeh looks good. but the colors... It's NIKON

02-28-2018, 03:15 AM	#143
DagT Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Oslo Posts: 110	Originally posted by kenspo Be sure that I will make them stuff the 70-200 a place where the sun doesn't shine! No need for that. Just give it to me and I can keep it in my cellar (when not in use).

02-28-2018, 03:21 AM	#144
DimC Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Paris Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 813	Originally posted by ogl It's NIKON ...and that's why I never wanna go there! Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk

02-28-2018, 03:27 AM - 1 Like	#145
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by DimC ...and that's why I never wanna go there! Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk There is good word to explain such thing - Eyesore

02-28-2018, 04:06 AM - 1 Like	#146
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Originally posted by Sandy Hancock I think those waiting for the FA limiteds to get a refresh need to move on. Their reputation is firmly established, by both their qualities and imperfections. They are finished products from an otherwise extinct line. I think we should all be thankful that they still available new. The DFA series is all about uncompromising image quality in an era obsessed with sharpness wide open and minimal distortion or aberration. There is enough legacy glass floating around for those of us who like pixie dust. The roadmap looks fine, although (like all of us) I'd like to see it fulfilled a little quicker. I like the FA limiteds and would like to see them given a refresh at some point -- add sealing, quick shift and HD coatings. I think that sort of a project should be reserved for when Pentax has a more complete full frame lens line up done. It really wouldn't change the quality a whole lot and it would tie up resources that hopefully are being used right now to create new (very high quality) lenses. Every brand needs f1.8 primes as well as f1.4 primes and those can be the FA limiteds from Pentax's standpoint. I still don't see why everyone keeps saying things about rebranding Tokina or Tamron lenses. I wouldn't have a big problem with it, but if Pentax was planning with doing that, why would they wait till 2019 to release the lenses? Just tell Tamron or Tokina what you want and how much and go. It is pretty clear they are creating their own lens designs. They may license them to Tokina, but not the reverse.

02-28-2018, 04:11 AM - 1 Like	#147
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Originally posted by Rondec I still don't see why everyone keeps saying things about rebranding Tokina or Tamron lenses. Because they want to diminish Pentax' achievements.

02-28-2018, 04:15 AM	#148
dafbp Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 233	About the 70-200: does f4 vs f2.8 means mandatory (as in laws of physics) worse IQ, or is that just a design decision (as in f2.8 is for pros, so f4 doesn't need to be good just cheap)? Can't a "slow" lens have "pro" IQ, while being smaller, and (hopefully) cheaper?

02-28-2018, 04:17 AM	#149
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,197	Originally posted by ogl There is good word to explain such thing - Eyesore Or, in Nikon advertising style: I AM, I SAW.

02-28-2018, 04:21 AM	#150
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	Originally posted by dafbp About the 70-200: does f4 vs f2.8 means mandatory (as in laws of physics) worse IQ, or is that just a design decision (as in f2.8 is for pros, so f4 doesn't need to be good just cheap)? Can't a "slow" lens have "pro" IQ, while being smaller, and (hopefully) cheaper? Of course an f/4 lens can be very good optically and in every other regard (just like there's no guarantee an f/2.8 zoom would be excellent). The limiting factor is usually the price, those lenses are expected at a lower price target.