[timcatn]

Question to Kenspo.

Why do you think that the "normal" pros, semi-pros and the enthusiasts (I'm not counting the likes working for BBC nature, NGC and similiar here) put so much weight on what the "real" pros use?

Nowdays it is more or less impossible to find a modern camera system that is unable to deliver images at a very high level. So unless you actually need the pro-support it doesnt really matter does it? Personally i went with Pentax because of proper WR at an affordable price and i like the controls layout. IQ was actually not something i put too much emphasis on since more or less anything would do.


-Tim

[beachgardener]

Exciting times for Pentax, I'm sure if we are patient our wishes will be answered

[Sandy Hancock]

Why do you think that the "normal" pros, semi-pros and the enthusiasts (I'm not counting the likes working for BBC nature, NGC and similiar here) put so much weight on what the "real" pros use?

Disclaimer - I know NOTHING about marketing, and I'm probably completely wrong.

But....I think you have to break that up a bit.

The "real pros" go with what gets the job done for a good return on investment. Apart form a good photographic system, that means being able to hire a $10,000 plus lens for an assignment, or find a replacement body when you're in the boondocks. At the moment, that means only two brands.

I don't think the semi-pros and enthusiasts (by far their biggest potential market) are swayed by that much anymore. That is pre-internet thinking. These days they can can do all the research and decide what suits them best. This is where Pentax's bread and butter is, and why pitching their promotional efforts to review websites, bloggers and social media pages might be far more effective (and infinitely cheaper) than poaching the big pros.

[2351HD]

Hehe I love what I do and just want the brand to be taken even more serious in the pro world. Then this feels like a punch in the face! Finish a good foundation that attracts more pros to switch..THEN you can deal with the consumers/hobby photographers etc Dont know how many times I hear; Sorry, but I want Nikon/Canon..cause that is what the pros use..

Yeah but is the working pro market where its really at for Pentax? I think you are wrong here.

I think that the core Pentax market is for landscape, travel and hobbyist.

I assume when you say "pro" that you mean photo-journalist, sports shooter, editorial, fashion and studio. I just don't think that Pentax is up to the task for that core pro market. The AF speed and accuracy is not there, the pro support and rental market is not there, no specialty lenses like tilt shift, tethering is poor, so that counts out photo journalist, sports and studio right away.

So where I am going with this is that yes a lighter weight 70-200/4 lens is exactly what Pentax needs to release to bring across the landscape and hobbyist shooters who don't need f/2.8 or the weight.

I would buy a K1-II today if they had a 70-200/4, 24-105/4 and a 16-35/4 that all take 67 mm and 77mm screw in filters and so would many other people. I have not jumped back onto the K1 because the 15-30 needs a huge filter set and the 70-200mm is too big and heavy.

[ffking]

Yeah but is the working pro market where its really at for Pentax? I think you are wrong here.

I think that the core Pentax market is for landscape, travel and hobbyist.

That's true, but Nikon's rise was as a direct result of going after the pro market, which gave them visabolity and swathes of amateurs wanting to use what the pros use, as has been mentioned above - it's not necessarily an either /or - if you want to increase sales, you have to be seen as a brand that serious photographers use - or that's been the logic up to now

[Kunzite]

I don't think the semi-pros and enthusiasts (by far their biggest potential market) are swayed by that much anymore. That is pre-internet thinking.

I don't think Internet had changed this - it's still about pros, but now it's pros with Youtube channels

IMO Ricoh Imaging is really underestimating the power of Youtube (and social media in general).

[Ian Stuart Forsyth]

70-200/4 - I think it will be Tokina AT-X PRO SD 70-200mm F4.0 (IF)

I sure hope that Pentax does not use the Tokina 70-200
I have tried it for a short time and I was not impressed with the lens, the first thing that stuck out with the lens was how hard it was to zoom. For me a lens in this FL really is a work horse lens that one would use the lens and track subjects that require the user to use the zoom frequently when the camera is held to the eye. What was also frustrating was that the stiffness of the zoom I always found myself slamming the zoom at the end of the FL. Other lenses like this have feather light zooming.

Of the 70-200 ƒ/4 lenses its the heaviest that I have used
Price wise for 3rd party suppler I felt it was higher than it should have been, if Pentax uses this lens I am afraid that it will put the price of the lens well above other competitors lenses in this range.

The 70-200ƒ/4 should be a bread and butter lens for Pentax and I would hate to see any of the income this lens generates fall in the hands of another supplier.

[2351HD]

That's true, but Nikon's rise was as a direct result of going after the pro market, which gave them visabolity and swathes of amateurs wanting to use what the pros use, as has been mentioned above - it's not necessarily an either /or - if you want to increase sales, you have to be seen as a brand that serious photographers use - or that's been the logic up to now

There is some truth in that and I agree. But when your product is not up to scratch for the pro market, why spend all your time peddling it there.

Now the Pro Landscape shooter market, thats what they should be chasing. Landscape is a huge market and there are plenty of full time landscape photographers that would consider marketing the Pentax system for them if the deal was right.

[ffking]

IMO Ricoh Imaging is really underestimating the power of Youtube (and social media in general).

Well - most YouTubers start by using their own gear without sponsorship, so how about it?

Any volunteers?

---------- Post added 01-03-18 at 01:19 AM ----------

But when your product is not up to scratch for the pro market, why spend all your time peddling it there.

That's also true, yes - for cameras - and in the specific high visibility areas of photography - not lenses.

[timcatn]

Disclaimer - I know NOTHING about marketing, and I'm probably completely wrong.

1: The "real pros" go with what gets the job done for a good return on investment. Apart form a good photographic system, that means being able to hire a $10,000 plus lens for an assignment, or find a replacement body when you're in the boondocks. At the moment, that means only two brands.

2: I don't think the semi-pros and enthusiasts (by far their biggest potential market) are swayed by that much anymore. That is pre-internet thinking. These days they can can do all the research and decide what suits them best. This is where Pentax's bread and butter is, and why pitching their promotional efforts to review websites, bloggers and social media pages might be far more effective (and infinitely cheaper) than poaching the big pros.

1. I agree, that is why I left out the "real pros" from this. Hence my remark about BBC and NGC and similar. I think that lots of enthusiasts have such work as benchmarks.

2. This is more to my point. What is there to research? Nearly all semi-pro and enthusiast would get the job done regardless of internet tests and such. Most cameras today are so much more capabale than the average photographer (unless very specific needs) that my argument is that it doesnt really matter, photography wise. Bragging rights by ascociation, now that is different.

[sbh]

Definitely a good move - I've really wanted something like the DA* 50-135 for my K-1.

I've always thought that a DFA* 35-135 f/2.8 would be the perfect lens for the K-1. Why doesn't it already exist? Maybe because it would make other lenses obsolete as it covers all of the most used focal lengths at once.

If you're not stuck with Primes, the FA 20-35mm /F4 is great for landscapes (From /F8 it's super sharp edges included).

I'ts an excellent lens indeed. I've put mine up in the marketplace as I already have the 15-30 and don't mind the size and weight for those few times that I use it.

[ffking]

I've always thought that a DFA* 35-135 f/2.8 would be the perfect lens for the K-1. Why doesn't it already exist?

Does anyone make one? I'm not sure - but some optical designs are more difficult than others to make - or maybe it's never been regarded as a 'professional' enough range to make a fixed aperture.

[Ishpuini]

I've always thought that a DFA* 35-135 f/2.8 would be the perfect lens for the K-1. Why doesn't it already exist?

Pentax's own A 35-105 f/3.5 comes close to this. I used to have this in the 6MP days and used it quite a bit, but I sold it on when the DA* zooms were released. Relatively large and heavy, but a beautiful lens it was! Didn't they make it to accompany the LX? On FF it would indeed be able to shine again. Not sure whether the step from f/3.5 to f/2.8 and the extra mm at the long end wouldn't make it too big though...

Wim

[thibs]

Pentax's own A 35-105 f/3.5 comes close to this. I used to have this in the 6MP days and used it quite a bit, but I sold it on when the DA* zooms were released. Relatively large and heavy, but a beautiful lens it was! Didn't they make it to accompany the LX? On FF it would indeed be able to shine again. Not sure whether the step from f/3.5 to f/2.8 and the extra mm at the long end wouldn't make it too big though...

Wim

Absolutely. It wasn't called 'stack of primes' for nothing.

[Rondec]

Clearly camera companies sell more zooms than they sell primes. This is true even for relatively cheap primes like older 50 f1.4 and 85mm f1.8 designs, but comparing a 1000 dollar plus 85mm f1.4 to a 70-200 f4 lens in terms of sales would be no contest. The hard part is just that it feels like lens releases are just dripping out one or two per year and you'd like to see a few more come faster to fill things out.