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03-04-2018, 11:08 AM   #76
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Actually the difference between 200 and 250 is quite significant; it is halfway to 300mm.

03-04-2018, 11:15 AM   #77
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QuoteOriginally posted by FantasticMrFox Quote
They announced a 70-200 f/4, which is pretty close in terms of focal length, and shouldn't be bigger or heavier either. I guess there's not need for a 60-250 f/4 then.
Hard to say at this time. The new 70-200 is marked DFA not DFA*. 60-250 is a very different range than 70-200. But on the other hand, the 60-250 at some distances is not much longer than 200 due to the focus breathing.
If I had a vote I say replace the DA*60-250 with a DFA*100-300 f/4. Where is the ballet box?
03-04-2018, 11:17 AM   #78
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QuoteOriginally posted by totsmuyco Quote
If I have some spare dinero, I'm considering that lens crackers. The problem would be if it's kAF4. I can't use it on my k-5II.
I find the 11-18 attractive, too — and I’ve already got a Sigma 8-16. That f/2.8 aperture would work so much better for me, although I’d hate to lose the 8-9mm range. I am eagerly awaiting the reviews, although it’s probably not next on my acquisition list (I think the Q 08 wide zoom will be next, while I can still find one new).
03-04-2018, 11:17 AM - 1 Like   #79
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QuoteOriginally posted by Cthulhugan Quote
The road-mapped 70-200/4 is listed as a D-FA lens, not D-FA* (although that is subject to change), which would not be a satisfying replacement. As a D-FA* lens I would expect it to be bigger, heavier and more expensive than the SMC DA* 60-250/4. An HD DA* 60-250/4 would likely not change size or weight (maybe a little if they changed focus motor and gear train), and only modestly increase in price. I could see a D-FA 70-200/4 co-existing with either an SDM or revised HD 60-250 if they positioned it as a consumer-grade lens, maybe as good or even better than the 60-250 in the FF corners, worse in the center, and priced below it (or well below it if it can’t match the 60-250 in the FF corners).

I’d also be a bit disappointed if they discontinued the 60-250, even though I’ve got one — it makes the Pentax line-up unique.
My D FA 150-450mm is a very good lens - equal or superior to the DA* 60-250 in all regards. IMO.
I'll repeat: a new DA* 60-250 makes no sense, now that Pentax has FF. It's completely unnecessary, and would only create confusion.
Using SDM micromotors doesn't make sense either, as they have the reliable DC.

Our wishes are pretty much all over the place; Pentax is acting in a more consistent, logical manner.

03-04-2018, 11:29 AM   #80
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
My D FA 150-450mm is a very good lens - equal or superior to the DA* 60-250 in all regards. IMO.
I'll repeat: a new DA* 60-250 makes no sense, now that Pentax has FF. It's completely unnecessary, and would only create confusion.
Using SDM micromotors doesn't make sense either, as they have the reliable DC.

Our wishes are pretty much all over the place; Pentax is acting in a more consistent, logical manner.
You could be right, it all depends on how they position the 70-200/4. The 150-450 is high-end, it’s a Star lens in all ways except aperture. There is room in the line-up for more affordable, less performant lenses (even in full-frame, like the D-FA 28-105). I hope the 70-200/4 is placed lower in the line-up.
03-04-2018, 11:42 AM - 1 Like   #81
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Compare it with the D FA* 70-200 f/2.8: it will have to be cheaper and lighter.
The DA* 60-250 is $1300 at B&H and weights over 1kg. Assuming they'd have to increase the price and weight/size a bit (designed for the future generations of cameras, right?) that would put it too close to the D FA*.
03-04-2018, 11:48 AM   #82
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What I would love to see, but we won't because it is probably not possible, would be an upgrade program like they have announced for the K-1. I'd love to have a quick focusing DA*300 focus without having to buy a new one.

03-04-2018, 11:52 AM   #83
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QuoteOriginally posted by ramseybuckeye Quote
What I would love to see, but we won't because it is probably not possible, would be an upgrade program like they have announced for the K-1. I'd love to have a quick focusing DA*300 focus without having to buy a new one.
It would be a miracle if the only changes to the DA*300 were a drop-in focus unit analogous to replacing ONLY the motherboard on the K-1.
03-04-2018, 11:54 AM   #84
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It would be nice, but I really don't think that's possible at all.
One problem is fitting the motor - is the DC the exact same size as the SDM micromotor? Let's say the controller, etc. could be squeezed in somehow.
But then there's the other problem: the AF motor is just one part of the equation; the other being the gearing, and the helicoids with the optical groups they're moving. Everything is designed for the SDM motor - can it work unchanged with a DC motor? I really doubt that.
03-04-2018, 12:30 PM   #85
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QuoteOriginally posted by ramseybuckeye Quote
would be an upgrade program like they have announced for the K-1. I'd love to have a quick focusing DA*300 focus without having to buy a new one.
They do! It's called Ebay

Price of sold listings for K-1 are running about $1,400 +/-. So add $1,400 and the $550 of the upgrade and you get $1,950. So I think selling my K-1 and buying a new K-1II is going to be almost the same cost as sending my K-1 in for the upgrade.

Lenses I think will be about the same. Any upgrade Ricoh offers would be offset by roughly the discounted value of selling the old lens and buying a new one.
03-04-2018, 12:34 PM   #86
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Compare it with the D FA* 70-200 f/2.8: it will have to be cheaper and lighter.
The DA* 60-250 is $1300 at B&H and weights over 1kg. Assuming they'd have to increase the price and weight/size a bit (designed for the future generations of cameras, right?) that would put it too close to the D FA*.
Presumably the D-FA* 70-200/2.8 is already carrying the price, weight and size of that “future proofing” — and if not it will soon be up for the Mark II treatment itself. That would tip things back in favour of the crop lens. The DA* 60-250 is, unfortunately for this purpose, close to a FF lens, so the margin would be thinner.

Of course, if they choose to completely redesign the entire DA* line from scratch, all at once, then all bets are off. I think they’ll do it one lens at a time, in which case a revised DA* 60-250 could make sense (not necessarily WILL make sense, but could).
03-04-2018, 12:35 PM - 2 Likes   #87
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
They do! It's called Ebay

Price of sold listings for K-1 are running about $1,400 +/-. So add $1,400 and the $550 of the upgrade and you get $1,950. So I think selling my K-1 and buying a new K-1II is going to be almost the same cost as sending my K-1 in for the upgrade.

Lenses I think will be about the same. Any upgrade Ricoh offers would be offset by roughly the discounted value of selling the old lens and buying a new one.
That’s why I’m keeping my K-1 and buying a K-1ll. If necessary I can sell the K-1 later.

Last edited by monochrome; 03-04-2018 at 12:46 PM.
03-04-2018, 02:35 PM - 1 Like   #88
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QuoteOriginally posted by jatrax Quote
The new 70-200 is marked DFA not DFA*.
But does it mean all that much? The '*' denotes build quality and optical quality. They put the best optical design they are capable of into a * lens, but designs get better over time. E.g. the Canon 70-200 f/4 L is considered a stellar lens. I doubt Pentax' new 70-200 f/4 will perform worse optically than the 60-250 will, especially as the latter was designed for APS-C cameras, and, while covering the FF image circle, was not found by Pentax to be good enough to be officially labelled as FF worthy.

What aspects does that leave? Build quality and weather sealing. Could be that the 70-200 will only be WR, not AW. That'd be a plus for the 60-250. Build quality wise, the non-D FA* 28-105 and 15-30 seem pretty solid.

QuoteQuote:
60-250 is a very different range than 70-200.
I disagree, I find the ranges very similar. 60 vs. 70 mm is a rather small difference, and so is 200 to 250 - at such high focal lengths, the actual difference in field-of-view becomes rather small (I actually just mounted my 55-300 to compare 200 vs. 250 mm).
03-04-2018, 02:52 PM   #89
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We don’t actually know if they are replacing the motor or overhauling the lens body to install ring sdm at this point. The 11-18 doesn’t need fast af, but the longer lenses benefit from it. KAF4 is not out of the question either.
03-04-2018, 02:56 PM   #90
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I'm not counting on ring-type SDM for the 16-50 and 50-135's replacements... with Pentax' volumes, it might be too expensive.
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