Short CP+ K-1 II Impressions

Snakeisthestuff · 03-03-2018, 04:54 PM

To be honest, I was a little disappointed with what I was seeing. I was expecting the K-1 II to be better in every aspect, which might not be true.
I think my post is reflecting this.

Concerning high ISO, in my opinion you were trading better contrast and color for a little bit of details.

I know its hard to judge by the sample I provided but I was not allowed to take pictures on my SD-Cards.

As I said I only got a little glimpse on the camera so lets wait for the reviews how it turns out

.

Last edited by Snakeisthestuff; 03-03-2018 at 05:04 PM.

**BigMackCam** · 03-03-2018, 05:11 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Snakeisthestuff

To be honest, I was a little disappointed with what I was seeing. I was expecting the K-1 II to be better in every aspect, which might not be true.
I think my post is reflecting this.

Concerning high ISO, in my opinion you were trading better contrast and color for a little bit of details.

I know its hard to judge by the sample I provided but I was not allowed to take pictures on my SD-Cards.

Just to clarify, though, we're talking JPEGs here rather than RAW, yes?

k1man · 03-03-2018, 05:19 PM

Originally posted by biz-engineer

It is shot at 12800 and higher ISO. NR doesn't help on color coding, better spend the money into fast lenses.

HAHAHA what fast lenses ? by the time they will have brought out an 85mm f1.4 the k1 will be 3,5 years old, Ian

**BigMackCam** · 03-03-2018, 05:22 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by k1man

HAHAHA what fast lenses ?

I guess that depends on your definition of fast, and whether you include anything other than latest-release glass...

Snakeisthestuff · 03-03-2018, 05:24 PM

Originally posted by BigMackCam

Just to clarify, though, we're talking JPEGs here rather than RAW, yes?

Unfortunately I did not ask specifically but I would expect they are not showcasing JPEG performance in their top of the line professional camera, but you never know.

At least the camera output on the original K-1 was looking like raw output which I am used to.

**BigMackCam** · 03-03-2018, 05:35 PM

Originally posted by Snakeisthestuff

Unfortunately I did not ask specifically but I would expect they are not showcasing JPEG performance in their top of the line professional camera, but you never know.

At least the camera output on the original K-1 was looking like raw output which I am used to.

Thanks. I'm guessing these are JPEGs, because I don't see any obvious colour noise in either the K-1 or K-1II images - and by ISO 12,800, I'd expect to see it quite noticeably. Unless they're RAW, and they've done some colour noise reduction on both before displaying them - but that seems pretty unlikely.

Anyway, looking forward to seeing more images once the camera is released

Snakeisthestuff · 03-03-2018, 05:36 PM

The point is the K-1 is already that good, because they put everything in which was available that time, so that its hard for them to improve it without an complete overhaul.

Which they obviously can not do in 2 years.

When talking to the staff I think she knews that, because she showed sympathie for me when she had to admit the limits of the new features (like mechanical shutter at dynamic pixel shift / no speed improvements for UI or video).

**clickclick** · 03-03-2018, 05:39 PM

Questions regarding improvement of AF tracking are yet to be answered. That's another tease that has appeal to a lot of us.

Bophoto · 03-03-2018, 05:53 PM

Has K1II come up in firmware 1.0 yet?

maw · 03-03-2018, 06:10 PM

It seems interesting but not exhaustive, a comparison on screen projected images is not very reliable, I have noticed (also you?), at the top there is a Japanese inscription that seems to say (noise ノイズ and what else?) OFF?

Rico · 03-03-2018, 06:37 PM

Originally posted by interested_observer

In terms of a comparison between the K1 and the K1mkII, I do wish that thew would provide a few comparisons at base and low ISOs. 100 through 1600 which would be of greatest interest for me.

How much improvement in the retention in detail?
How much improvement in noise reduction?
How much improvement in the reproduction of colors and rich gradations?
How much improvement in dynamic range?

Please knock my socks off.....

Ricoh has an ISO comparison here.

Snakeisthestuff · 03-03-2018, 07:24 PM

Someone started an interesting discussion over at dpreview about RAW noise reduction on Pentax cameras:

Interesting read on the KP review comment, hints to what I saw at the K-1 II.

Pentax noise reduction: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

**interested_observer** · 03-03-2018, 08:46 PM

Originally posted by Rico

Ricoh has an ISO comparison here.

I saw that several days ago, a bit after they made the mkII announcement. It's a good initial step, but they really need to do a bit more in this regard. Thanks!!

biz-engineer · 03-04-2018, 02:52 AM

Originally posted by interested_observer

I saw that several days ago, a bit after they made the mkII announcement. It's a good initial step, but they really need to do a bit more in this regard. Thanks!!

Less noise is easy to sell by showing the effect on 100% crops side by side. But the real question is whether noise reduction effectively improves image quality as perceived by the human eye, for example when viewing a large print.

Snakeisthestuff · 03-06-2018, 05:35 PM

Originally posted by Snakeisthestuff

Unfortunately I did not ask specifically but I would expect they are not showcasing JPEG performance in their top of the line professional camera, but you never know.

At least the camera output on the original K-1 was looking like raw output which I am used to.

Judging from the answers of the pentax interview it was confirmed that all the changes of the image data are made before the regulat picture pipeline on the very raw data.

Hope Adam has the opportunity to do some Astrotracer tests for example at ISO 1600 and compare the raw files if there are some stars eaten or not.

03-03-2018, 05:24 PM	#35
Snakeisthestuff Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Photos: Gallery Posts: 136 Original Poster	Originally posted by BigMackCam Just to clarify, though, we're talking JPEGs here rather than RAW, yes? Unfortunately I did not ask specifically but I would expect they are not showcasing JPEG performance in their top of the line professional camera, but you never know. At least the camera output on the original K-1 was looking like raw output which I am used to. Last edited by Snakeisthestuff; 03-03-2018 at 05:36 PM.

03-03-2018, 06:37 PM	#41
Rico Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,205	Originally posted by interested_observer In terms of a comparison between the K1 and the K1mkII, I do wish that thew would provide a few comparisons at base and low ISOs. 100 through 1600 which would be of greatest interest for me. How much improvement in the retention in detail? How much improvement in noise reduction? How much improvement in the reproduction of colors and rich gradations? How much improvement in dynamic range? Please knock my socks off..... Ricoh has an ISO comparison here.

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03-03-2018, 04:54 PM	#31
Snakeisthestuff Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Photos: Gallery Posts: 136 Original Poster	To be honest, I was a little disappointed with what I was seeing. I was expecting the K-1 II to be better in every aspect, which might not be true. I think my post is reflecting this. Concerning high ISO, in my opinion you were trading better contrast and color for a little bit of details. I know its hard to judge by the sample I provided but I was not allowed to take pictures on my SD-Cards. As I said I only got a little glimpse on the camera so lets wait for the reviews how it turns out . Last edited by Snakeisthestuff; 03-03-2018 at 05:04 PM.

03-03-2018, 05:11 PM - 1 Like	#32
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Originally posted by Snakeisthestuff To be honest, I was a little disappointed with what I was seeing. I was expecting the K-1 II to be better in every aspect, which might not be true. I think my post is reflecting this. Concerning high ISO, in my opinion you were trading better contrast and color for a little bit of details. I know its hard to judge by the sample I provided but I was not allowed to take pictures on my SD-Cards. Just to clarify, though, we're talking JPEGs here rather than RAW, yes?

03-03-2018, 05:19 PM	#33
k1man Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Si Chiang Mai. Nong Khai Province Photos: Albums Posts: 358	Originally posted by biz-engineer It is shot at 12800 and higher ISO. NR doesn't help on color coding, better spend the money into fast lenses. HAHAHA what fast lenses ? by the time they will have brought out an 85mm f1.4 the k1 will be 3,5 years old, Ian

03-03-2018, 05:22 PM - 1 Like	#34
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Originally posted by k1man HAHAHA what fast lenses ? I guess that depends on your definition of fast, and whether you include anything other than latest-release glass...

03-03-2018, 05:35 PM	#36
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Originally posted by Snakeisthestuff Unfortunately I did not ask specifically but I would expect they are not showcasing JPEG performance in their top of the line professional camera, but you never know. At least the camera output on the original K-1 was looking like raw output which I am used to. Thanks. I'm guessing these are JPEGs, because I don't see any obvious colour noise in either the K-1 or K-1II images - and by ISO 12,800, I'd expect to see it quite noticeably. Unless they're RAW, and they've done some colour noise reduction on both before displaying them - but that seems pretty unlikely. Anyway, looking forward to seeing more images once the camera is released

03-03-2018, 05:36 PM	#37
Snakeisthestuff Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Photos: Gallery Posts: 136 Original Poster	The point is the K-1 is already that good, because they put everything in which was available that time, so that its hard for them to improve it without an complete overhaul. Which they obviously can not do in 2 years. When talking to the staff I think she knews that, because she showed sympathie for me when she had to admit the limits of the new features (like mechanical shutter at dynamic pixel shift / no speed improvements for UI or video).

03-03-2018, 05:39 PM	#38
clickclick Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: May 2016 Location: East Coast Posts: 2,903	Questions regarding improvement of AF tracking are yet to be answered. That's another tease that has appeal to a lot of us.

03-03-2018, 05:53 PM	#39
Bophoto Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 429	Has K1II come up in firmware 1.0 yet?

03-03-2018, 06:10 PM	#40
maw Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: Sassari (Italy) Posts: 1,118	It seems interesting but not exhaustive, a comparison on screen projected images is not very reliable, I have noticed (also you?), at the top there is a Japanese inscription that seems to say (noise ノイズ and what else?) OFF?

03-03-2018, 07:24 PM	#42
Snakeisthestuff Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Photos: Gallery Posts: 136 Original Poster	Someone started an interesting discussion over at dpreview about RAW noise reduction on Pentax cameras: Interesting read on the KP review comment, hints to what I saw at the K-1 II. Pentax noise reduction: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

03-03-2018, 08:46 PM	#43
interested_observer Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tumbleweed, Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,707	Originally posted by Rico Ricoh has an ISO comparison here. I saw that several days ago, a bit after they made the mkII announcement. It's a good initial step, but they really need to do a bit more in this regard. Thanks!!

03-04-2018, 02:52 AM	#44
biz-engineer Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 12,232	Originally posted by interested_observer I saw that several days ago, a bit after they made the mkII announcement. It's a good initial step, but they really need to do a bit more in this regard. Thanks!! Less noise is easy to sell by showing the effect on 100% crops side by side. But the real question is whether noise reduction effectively improves image quality as perceived by the human eye, for example when viewing a large print.

03-06-2018, 05:35 PM	#45
Snakeisthestuff Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Photos: Gallery Posts: 136 Original Poster	Originally posted by Snakeisthestuff Unfortunately I did not ask specifically but I would expect they are not showcasing JPEG performance in their top of the line professional camera, but you never know. At least the camera output on the original K-1 was looking like raw output which I am used to. Judging from the answers of the pentax interview it was confirmed that all the changes of the image data are made before the regulat picture pipeline on the very raw data. Hope Adam has the opportunity to do some Astrotracer tests for example at ISO 1600 and compare the raw files if there are some stars eaten or not.