[LXNights]

It's almost as if many people are piling on with this theme of Pentax is dying because they all want to be the first ones who said "I told you so." Which is assinine. I long for the days of the rival US publications of Modern Photography and Popular Photography, where they concentrated on what cameras had to offer instead of making morbid predictions of the demise of camera systems. If it happened, it happened, the mags reported on it, and moved on. Where the resentment of Pentax comes from is a mystery, but as long as we keep getting new designs, I'm just gonna roll with it.

[biz-engineer]

It's almost as if many people are piling on with this theme of Pentax is dying because they all want to be the first ones who said "I told you so." Which is assinine. I long for the days of the rival US publications of Modern Photography and Popular Photography, where they concentrated on what cameras had to offer instead of making morbid predictions of the demise of camera systems. If it happened, it happened, the mags reported on it, and moved on. Where the resentment of Pentax comes from is a mystery, but as long as we keep getting new designs, I'm just gonna roll with it.

I'd be curious about how much more marketing money is invested now compared to years ago. What happened is that the design of more and more features into digital cameras led camera companies to build up staff much more than in the film era. After that was a growing market phase for digital cameras, the fishes being able to grow when the size of the fish pond was also growing. Customers still expect advanced features in new camera models, which prevent camera companies to shrink their engineering staff. Now the fish pound started shrinking for a while and the big fish feel more and more tight with not enough water for them to swim. The big fish feel obliged to attack smaller fishes, that all what the Pentax attacks are about, some people get incentives to publish negative marketing about some brands, Pentax is an easy target. What I'm certain about is that current camera models are all good, and there is a huge amount of brain wash involved in selling newer models. I believe camera business is getting close to cosmetics business in terms of the ratio between marketing budgets and manufacturing costs, where 80% of the costs are make of branding and promotional costs and 20% goes to buying raw materials, manufacturing and logistics, and that's precisely why Pentax may still turn a profit while selling less volumes with no marketing.

Canon and Nikon will suffer a lot, that can't be avoided, they are way too big and have way too high fixed cost to continue turning profits with declining volumes. 2018, 2019 and 2020 will be the years of the struggle for big camera makers, mirrorless won't be enough for compensate for declining sales, we already see that this is the case and it will continue.

---------- Post added 29-12-18 at 12:23 ----------

In the meantime, given that Pentax is doomed, I will get myself a second copy of the Pentax K1 , because I don't care about marketing, and the Pentax K1 price is super good :-)

[Zygonyx]

I'm waiting for the K-1 m2 silver, with silver wheels included

---------- Post added 29-12-18 at 11:47 ----------

So, he's just saying what many have said here - Pentax isn't releasing new products very fast any more; I'm guessing he had no or little experience with the modern offerings, so he has no idea of the joy of using them at higher ISO values.
Iso 25600! - PentaxForums.com

2019 starts next week ..... we shall see what Ricoh has planned for Pentax's "100th".

These people just don't understand that "full speed consumerism" is a dead-end, and will get those who's business model can't quickly adapt, to failure.

[Proudmale]

Does anybody else remember the once popular brand Harley Davidson? At one time back in the 50's they represented the epidemy of motorcycling. Then while it's Japanese and German competition grew in the 60's the Harley line declined. It was bought by a conglomerate AMF in the late 60's and was tied to the leisure industry line ranging from Bowling Allies to camping gear, to nice Harleys. AMF declared war on Harley workers . . . or was it the other way around?

Anyway they started selling crap with outdated lines. Dealers reported having to park them over cardboard else they would leak all over the showroom floor. Great sight for potential buyers. After bleeding the company AMF decided to sell the shell of what had been. Odds were on how long it would take the Hardly Drivables to go into bankruptcy. Then things changed with a new management team. Today Harley is once again considered "cool" and few are predicting it will leave the scene anytime soon.

Substitute Pentax for Harley and you can get the picture. But Pentax needs to do more than introduce new color schemes and balsa grips. If that is there idea of the future perhaps they should join AMF. I hope they continue to build on their great designs with ever better user experiences.

[Mistral75]

Does anybody else remember the once popular brand Harley Davidson? At one time back in the 50's they represented the epidemy of motorcycling. (...)

Epitome?

[BigMackCam]

Does anybody else remember the once popular brand Harley Davidson? At one time back in the 50's they represented the epidemy of motorcycling

Epitome?

"Epidemy" is an epidemic disease. So, depending on whether you like Harleys or not, either word could work Personally, I've always loved them... Never owned one, but my Dad did...

[clackers]

Substitute Pentax for Harley and you can get the picture.

I got into photography in my forties, so I suppose, yes, they can both be midlife crisis purchases!

[i_trax]

I like their look but I hate the noise.
Fortunately they just announced an electric model.1 - 100km in 3 sec
electric harley - Google Search

[bxf]

...they would leak all over the showroom floor...Substitute Pentax for Harley...

Neither my K20D, nor my K-5 or K-3 ever leaked oil.

[ThorSanchez]

Does anybody else remember the once popular brand Harley Davidson? At one time back in the 50's they represented the epidemy of motorcycling. Then while it's Japanese and German competition grew in the 60's the Harley line declined. It was bought by a conglomerate AMF in the late 60's and was tied to the leisure industry line ranging from Bowling Allies to camping gear, to nice Harleys. AMF declared war on Harley workers . . . or was it the other way around?

Anyway they started selling crap with outdated lines. Dealers reported having to park them over cardboard else they would leak all over the showroom floor. Great sight for potential buyers. After bleeding the company AMF decided to sell the shell of what had been. Odds were on how long it would take the Hardly Drivables to go into bankruptcy. Then things changed with a new management team. Today Harley is once again considered "cool" and few are predicting it will leave the scene anytime soon.

Substitute Pentax for Harley and you can get the picture. But Pentax needs to do more than introduce new color schemes and balsa grips. If that is there idea of the future perhaps they should join AMF. I hope they continue to build on their great designs with ever better user experiences.

I thought Harley was in pretty dire straits once again. This one will be much harder to overcome because it's less a case of poor quality as its one of Harleys just aren't cool if you're not a 68-year-old. Millennials and even many Gen-Xers look at guys on Harleys as old dudes who're mostly dentists and middle managers pretending to be Hells Angels riding expensive and annoyingly loud bikes. Harley is a little like Cadillac; they make competitive stuff but it's vexingly hard to overcome the image of being grandpa's thing.

My 47-year-old boss sold his Harley and bought a Triumph in large part because he just wasn't a Harley guy. Triumph and Ural and other manufacturers are just more interesting.

Pentax has the same problem (as do all other camera manufacturers): big stand alone cameras are mainly, but not totally, Dad's or grandpa's thing.

[Rondec]

Everyone wants an easy answer. Just build 'x' type of camera (MILC, D500 knock off, digital K1000, whatever) and you'll really sell cameras. The reality is that the market is shrinking right now, not because people don't use or buy cameras any more, but because they are satisfied with what they have.

Everyone wants the next i pod or i phone, but even Steve Jobs wandered in the wilderness for a very long time before he came up with those products. What is much more common is for companies to release their own versions of existing products on the market.

Probably the solution is to build for the current market. For some reason people always try to draw analogies to the car market, but it feels like a very different market. Releasing solid products that sell at the rates that Pentax wants them to is a lot better plan for long term survival than sinking millions into a fifth! full frame MILC to hit the market.

[Mikesul]

Why do people keep reviving these ancient threads with their negative titles? It just reinforces the negativity some feel. Start a new thread with a positive or neutral title if you still want to kick thee dead horses.

[normhead]

Why do people keep reviving these ancient threads with their negative titles? It just reinforces the negativity some feel. Start a new thread with a positive or neutral title if you still want to kick thee dead horses.

I was just going ask the same thing. My K-1 - K-3 poll, as far as I know, never made it to the front page of "new posts" yet here's this old thread. In terms of running polls of actual interest to people, the way "new posts" is configured " is counter productive. What gets posted in new posts and what doesn't needs improvement. A one year old thread with a few new posts should never make it to the top ahead of a current post with some back and forth over the last few days.

[Proudmale]

My point with the Harley's was that they were the bike to go with, then they stood still, then they cut back and went to war with the workers. They leaked oil not due to their design, but due to the guys on the line getting back at Harley for a paycut by not torqueing the bolts down. 20% less pay, I will tighten down 20% fewer parts mindset.

I had friends with Harleys and hated riding them back then. It has long since been changed but they used to have the oil tank where it would roast the rear of your leg just above the knee. I very much preferred my 73 Suzuki 750 Water Buffalo so named as it was the first to market with a water cooled engine beating the Gold Wing by 2 yearsI have kept my Suzuki 1400 Intruder in the garage as I can't sell the beast even though I know I can never ride her again.


But back to our favorite camera company. They need to show they are still relevant and you do that through bettering the product or developing companion products. Their recent product news about an exciting new paint job just does not cut it, and we all know it. How many felt that was a leap forward for Pentax? To me it was more like "You called us together for that?" Enough of those and people stop paying attention.


Note: It does not need to be equipment. Paid firmware enhancements that expand the camera's abilities will also work, such as pairing the FLU Card with new coding allowing voice control of the camera could be one area to explore along with powered tripods etc. To somebody like me who is wheelchair bound except for very short distances that would be a great improvement.

[lesmore49]

I thought Harley was in pretty dire straits once again. This one will be much harder to overcome because it's less a case of poor quality as its one of Harleys just aren't cool if you're not a 68-year-old. Millennials and even many Gen-Xers look at guys on Harleys as old dudes who're mostly dentists and middle managers pretending to be Hells Angels riding expensive and annoyingly loud bikes. Harley is a little like Cadillac; they make competitive stuff but it's vexingly hard to overcome the image of being grandpa's thing.

My 47-year-old boss sold his Harley and bought a Triumph in large part because he just wasn't a Harley guy. Triumph and Ural and other manufacturers are just more interesting.

Pentax has the same problem (as do all other camera manufacturers): big stand alone cameras are mainly, but not totally, Dad's or grandpa's thing.

Urals !!

I'm older than 68 and been a motorcycle enthusiast since '65....and a Pentaxian since '68. I may not know 'cool'......but I still have two motorcycles, one a Japanese big single, the other an English vertical twin. Both vintage, one more vintage than the other. I've never had a HD and I've had a few motorcycles. I also have a fair selection of Pentax cameras from the late '60s to to the modern day.

Many motorcyclists...young, middle aged, older like the adventure motorcycles. The prime mover...sales. etc...currently... in this class ....are the BMW G/S series...both F and R models. My son has an F series G/S and I've taken it for a spin or two...very nice...quick, handles well, brakes well..but then after all, it is a Beemer.

A lot of riders who like the HD cruiser / dresser type bike have been shifting over to the Indian motorcycle, made by Polaris. Great looking bikes and some motorcyclists say that the modern Indian is out 'Harleying'....Harley Davidson. I wouldn't know, not having ridden any modern HD/Indian, but the new Indians look real good to my oldster eyes.

And I really love my Pentax K1...also my Ricoh GR....and I don't want to forget my Canon G12.

Just some observations from the Peanut Gallery *.

Les

* Peanut Gallery...from my favourite 1950's Children's TV show, Howdy Doody. Now, Howdy was 'cool'.