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06-26-2018, 06:24 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ronald Oakes Quote
What difference does this comparison translate to if shooting raw in the first place ? I don't really get it ?
I agree. It has always seemed to me that these posts about "canon colors" etc are only talking about stock out of camera jpgs. Maybe I am missing something.

06-26-2018, 06:28 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
I agree. It has always seemed to me that these posts about "canon colors" etc are only talking about stock out of camera jpgs. Maybe I am missing something.
Link was a good push for Canon anyway in spite of the results. Wow ! Did I get spammed with Canon advertisements when I looked.....lol.
06-29-2018, 12:06 AM - 1 Like   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ronald Oakes Quote
What difference does this comparison translate to if shooting raw in the first place ? I don't really get it ?
They are using SOOC JPEGs and they do not give two shits of a damn about what kind of processing camera uses be it LUT profile or tone curves or anything else and they do not even mention camera settings.
Either that or they are using Lightroom without stating it and Lightroom has LUT profiles too and again, no settings mentioned.
You might study DXO colour measurements, those are useful indeed because they find optimal matrix conversion and study true camera metamerism and they even depict the magnitude of colour noise.

QuoteOriginally posted by solitudebound Quote
Not all cameras encode raw or jpeg the same way either. Same goes for the editing software that is loading them.

I wish manufacturers would listen and offer "PNG" format. (It's not a typo).
Encoding does not mean anything if you can get the original information i.e. it's lossless. DNG format is as close to being universal and raw as possible and still not universally adopted. Nikon scales channels and messes up with black level, Pentax has built permanent noise reduction into K-1 Mk2, Fuji X manipulate "raw" output to hide moire (it's the only reason X-Trans does not expose moire) and denoise image (it's the only reason why X-Trans looks so much better than sensors from same generation). All of it is loss of information
and
they won't magically stop doing any of this if you somehow manage to force them to use file format totally unsuitable for the task.

Last edited by Casion; 06-29-2018 at 06:16 AM.
06-29-2018, 06:32 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
I agree. It has always seemed to me that these posts about "canon colors" etc are only talking about stock out of camera jpgs. Maybe I am missing something.
Camera processing is only the part of colour reproduction. If camera sensor has bad metamerism (especially as bad as Canon cameras typically have) it will be visible on photos in one way or another.


Last edited by Casion; 06-29-2018 at 06:39 AM.
06-29-2018, 02:44 PM   #20
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wow free give aways, i have never won anything in my life. well except the life and air i breath i guess that would be a win love this forum
07-28-2018, 08:25 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigDave Quote
Hey All:

This from PDN, a review of the cameras that gave the best color reproductions, Pentax K1- Mk2 was #6 overall, and of the FF camera, about 4th! Winners were Sony (3 top awards) Fuji (ever see one in the wild?) Leica P&S and one Panasonic (another rare sighting in the wild), one Nikon and one Canon!


Here is the link!
The Best Cameras for Color Reproduction, Ranked

PS- To do a side-by-side comparison, I copied each gamut image and pasted it next to the K1 gamut image, so I had a quick reference.

Regards,
Interesting read, thanks for sharing!
07-30-2018, 07:57 AM   #22
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Interesting - good to see Pentax represented.
07-30-2018, 03:35 PM   #23
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thanks for sharing! I liked my K-1 from the first testing shots on, though at first colors felt bit different than on my K-3...

07-30-2018, 04:06 PM - 1 Like   #24
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Its just a comparison to a defined color space (CIE-LAB).

I have used Panasonic for a while some time ago and they were always reviewed to have accurate colors to adobe RGB, but the cameras always got beaten down for colors being not as good as Olympus (their 4/3 competitor), which had poorer color accuracy.
So accurate colors to a color space is one thing, pleasing colors in another.
07-31-2018, 12:26 AM   #25
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Total mess this test. First, JPEG - nono. Then that static target allows using pixel shift which instantly kills the competition. But PS was not used.
07-31-2018, 05:27 AM   #26
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Using SOOC jpeg, with no camera options changed, gives a level playing field.
Most people buying expensive cameras have no idea about how to maximise their potential, or even that they have to. That's the equivalent of tuning (and I'm not talking about Fast and Furious type tuning) your own car!!!
It's the manufacturer's responsibility to provide a camera that's performing at its best when you buy it. If, for example, they cut down in [default] detail to show small file sizes, they can't complain if people choose a brand that does the opposite.
And then, playing with color profiles and even which image viewer is used?! What next, pick 10 ambassadors from each brand and have them take the pictures with their cameras?
That would actually be fairer than they (website) playing around with camera settings.


From what I saw, 6th seems a bit low, but, as in car magazines, money talks...
07-31-2018, 06:22 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by dafbp Quote
Using SOOC jpeg, with no camera options changed, gives a level playing field.
Most people buying expensive cameras have no idea about how to maximise their potential, or even that they have to.
I'm not sure about that.
First, SOOC jpeg with no camera options changed means different things from model to model. Is the default "Bright" (or some equivalent)? Is it "Natural"? Something else? Yet the test makes the implicit assumption that the goal is color accuracy.
Then, about people with no idea - would they have any idea about, or pursue color accuracy, then?

IMO the people most likely to care are those who would tune the camera/processing flow as necessary.
07-31-2018, 07:20 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
I agree. It has always seemed to me that these posts about "canon colors" etc are only talking about stock out of camera jpgs. Maybe I am missing something.
Despite what all the artists claim, SOOC JPEGs are important. It is what most news and sports photographers use. It is what many amateurs use. Once you start using Lightroom, almost anything can be done, so you would be comparing PP skills more than anything else.
07-31-2018, 07:32 AM - 5 Likes   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Despite what all the artists claim, SOOC JPEGs are important. It is what most news and sports photographers use.
How many professional news or sports photographers use SOOC JPEGs, AND never touch the in-camera settings to adjust the JPEGs to their liking? I never shoot just JPG, but if had to I'd definitely do some work with the camera settings to make sure they suited my preferences.
07-31-2018, 07:51 AM - 1 Like   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by ThorSanchez Quote
How many professional news or sports photographers use SOOC JPEGs, AND never touch the in-camera settings to adjust the JPEGs to their liking? I never shoot just JPG, but if had to I'd definitely do some work with the camera settings to make sure they suited my preferences.
That's fine, but you have to start somewhere.

We have to believe that each manufacturer chooses defaults which are viewed as putting their best foot forward, so that is the logical output to compare.

Pentax did well - why do we have to look every gift horse in the mouth???
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