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07-03-2018, 09:07 AM - 4 Likes   #1
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The News here is not the first three

Supposedly, the German Stiftung Warentest is known to be a neutral review platform. (From Wikipedia)
Look at what is 5th and 6th here ahead of Canon
Sony haters please ignore that part and look at how well our kids did!

Sony A7III with 1.5 points (Amazon, B&H, Adorama, eBay)
Sony A7rIII with 1.6 points (Amazon, B&H, Adorama, eBay)
Sony A99II with 1.7 points (Amazon, B&H, Adorama, eBay)
Nikon D850 with 1.8 points
Pentax K-1II with 2.0 points
Pentax K-1 with 2.0 points
Canon EOS 5D IV with 2.0 points
Canon EOS 6D II with 2.1 point

I lifted this from the Sony Rumors site. I offer it not to praise Sony but to show that our K-1s are doing pretty well in some reviews.

07-03-2018, 09:12 AM - 1 Like   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
Supposedly, the German Stiftung Warentest is known to be a neutral review platform. (From Wikipedia)
Look at what is 5th and 6th here ahead of Canon
Sony haters please ignore that part and look at how well our kids did!

Sony A7III with 1.5 points (Amazon, B&H, Adorama, eBay)
Sony A7rIII with 1.6 points (Amazon, B&H, Adorama, eBay)
Sony A99II with 1.7 points (Amazon, B&H, Adorama, eBay)
Nikon D850 with 1.8 points
Pentax K-1II with 2.0 points
Pentax K-1 with 2.0 points
Canon EOS 5D IV with 2.0 points
Canon EOS 6D II with 2.1 point

I lifted this from the Sony Rumors site. I offer it not to praise Sony but to show that our K-1s are doing pretty well in some reviews.
Being close to both the Sony A7Riii and to the Nikon D850 is good!
07-03-2018, 09:17 AM   #3
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First of all, they are like a German version of consumer reports - generalists and masters of none/nothing. No one else would rate the Sony A99II or Canon EOS 6dII anywhere near the Pentax K1, since these both have either a compromised sensor, performance, or design. Also, to rate the Sony A7III in front of the Nikon D850, Pentax K1, or Canon 5d IV is simply absurd, unless video capability is given huge weight in this report (which I have not seen - how about a link?).
07-03-2018, 09:18 AM - 9 Likes   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtgmansf Quote
First of all, they are like a German version of consumer reports - generalists and masters of none/nothing. No one else would rate the Sony A99II or Canon EOS 6dII anywhere near the Pentax K1, since these both have either a compromised sensor, performance, or design. Also, to rate the Sony A7III in front of the Nikon D850, Pentax K1, or Canon 5d IV is simply absurd, unless video capability is given huge weight in this report (which I have not seen - how about a link?).
Yes, of course, and so what? We need to stop thinking we need to argue with and attack every listing that doesn't say Pentax is tops. It doesn't really matter. I just thought some people would be interested that they did so well.

07-03-2018, 09:31 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
Yes, of course, and so what? We need to stop thinking we need to argue with and attack every listing that doesn't say Pentax is tops. It doesn't really matter. I just thought some people would be interested that they did so well.
If they are a consumer reports type of organization, then I suspect actual image quality has equal; or more weight than video, since it is a test of DSLRs. Good to see some more tests by what are hopefully unbiased groups.
07-03-2018, 09:37 AM - 1 Like   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtgmansf Quote
First of all, they are like a German version of consumer reports - generalists and masters of none/nothing. No one else would rate the Sony A99II or Canon EOS 6dII anywhere near the Pentax K1, since these both have either a compromised sensor, performance, or design. Also, to rate the Sony A7III in front of the Nikon D850, Pentax K1, or Canon 5d IV is simply absurd, unless video capability is given huge weight in this report (which I have not seen - how about a link?).
Digitalkameras im Test - Heftartikel als PDF - Test - Stiftung Warentest it's $5 to unlock the test results
07-03-2018, 09:39 AM - 1 Like   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote
Yes, of course, and so what? We need to stop thinking we need to argue with and attack every listing that doesn't say Pentax is tops. It doesn't really matter. I just thought some people would be interested that they did so well.
Not defending or trying to uplift Pentax. Just trying to put the source of this information/review into perspective...


Last edited by mtgmansf; 07-03-2018 at 09:40 AM. Reason: correction.
07-03-2018, 09:41 AM - 6 Likes   #8
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What exactly is being ranked? What does 1.6 points signify, and why is that more than 2.0 points?

I get your point. It's a list and Pentax is on it, even ahead of some other stuff.

If ranked by the most letters in the brandname, Pentax would be on top.
Pentax
Canon
Nikon
Sony

And if ranked by the least characters in the model name, Pentax would still be on top.
K-1
D850
K-1 II
A7III
A99II
A7rIII
EOS 5D IV
EOS 6D II
07-03-2018, 09:41 AM - 1 Like   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtgmansf Quote
First of all, they are like a German version of consumer reports - generalists and masters of none/nothing. No one else would rate the Sony A99II or Canon EOS 6dII anywhere near the Pentax K1, since these both have either a compromised sensor, performance, or design. Also, to rate the Sony A7III in front of the Nikon D850, Pentax K1, or Canon 5d IV is simply absurd, unless video capability is given huge weight in this report (which I have not seen - how about a link?).
Stiftung Warentest tests cameras for consumers and clearly states criteria for rankings. It is a completely independent foundation - no add online or in the printed paper. Same reason why there is no link, you pay for the paper verion or the online test.

They test what you need while we tend to be carried away by features we think we need. If you are into a certain technology you do not need consumer test results. If you need an overview, go for it.

Resuls are rankend from 1-5, one meaning very good and five meaning something is wrong.

If you have not read the test criteria, you should not judge any ranking. Consumer magazines often test materials for dangerous components, quite often some fishy plastic part can cause a low rating. So you can always learn something, get a new pesrspective... and if your are fedup with tests that present a Amazon, B&H, Adorama link at the end, this is the place to go.
07-03-2018, 09:43 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by funkythiru Quote
About $4 US, but requires me to have a German resident address as well...go figure and Nein Danke!

Last edited by mtgmansf; 07-03-2018 at 09:46 AM. Reason: Error...
07-03-2018, 10:15 AM - 2 Likes   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtgmansf Quote
First of all, they are like a German version of consumer reports - generalists and masters of none/nothing. No one else would rate the Sony A99II or Canon EOS 6dII anywhere near the Pentax K1, since these both have either a compromised sensor, performance, or design. Also, to rate the Sony A7III in front of the Nikon D850, Pentax K1, or Canon 5d IV is simply absurd, unless video capability is given huge weight in this report (which I have not seen - how about a link?).
The SONY a7III was likely ranked so high for the same reasons it's been ranked high by many other reviewers. It's a combination of AF speed, FF, outstanding S/N and DR, superb 4K video and bang for the buck. Plus you can use any number of various AF and MF lenses with adapters. And SONY has finally improved out of camera JPG processing. I own it, as well as a K1, and they are both excellent cameras for different purposes. And FWIW, the a7III, aside from being an inconsequential 6 megapixels short of the Canon 5DIV, outperforms it on S/N, DR, likely AF speed and 4K video performance, not to mention being about a $1,000 less in cost.
07-03-2018, 10:17 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by tvdtvdtvd Quote
What exactly is being ranked? What does 1.6 points signify, and why is that more than 2.0 points?
Their camera test methodology is public:
Google Übersetzer

While generally a very good source for really independent product quality tests (even includes financial products, insurances etc), their camera and lens test methodology is transparent, but not good IMHO.
07-03-2018, 10:17 AM - 7 Likes   #13
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Why are people not talking about how well the Pentax cameras did? That is the point of the thread.
07-03-2018, 11:13 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtgmansf Quote
First of all, they are like a German version of consumer reports - generalists and masters of none/nothing. No one else would rate the Sony A99II or Canon EOS 6dII anywhere near the Pentax K1, since these both have either a compromised sensor, performance, or design. Also, to rate the Sony A7III in front of the Nikon D850, Pentax K1, or Canon 5d IV is simply absurd, unless video capability is given huge weight in this report (which I have not seen - how about a link?).
If they put much importance at all on low-light performance, the Nikon D850 would plummet, because the D850 did relatively poorly on DxOMark tests, while the A7iii and Pentax K-1 did very well, and even the Canon 5Div had a respectable ranking. I can see very easily how this sort of ordering could result.
07-03-2018, 11:19 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by tvdtvdtvd Quote
What exactly is being ranked? What does 1.6 points signify, and why is that more than 2.0 points?

I get your point. It's a list and Pentax is on it, even ahead of some other stuff.

If ranked by the most letters in the brandname, Pentax would be on top.
Pentax
Canon
Nikon
Sony

And if ranked by the least characters in the model name, Pentax would still be on top.
K-1
D850
K-1 II
A7III
A99II
A7rIII
EOS 5D IV
EOS 6D II
And if ranked purely by low-light performance, the ranking would be
Sony
Pentax
other-rans
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