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09-29-2008, 02:49 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by barondla Quote
Tell you Pentax's niche. Only have your product sold thru brick & mortar stores. No mail order what so ever. Has been working in car audio for a number of years. Then all b&M stores would get behind something they could actually make a little money on. C&N would find themselves in trouble. Mail order has lived off B&M for years. If something like this doesn't happen there won't be any B&M stores and no one to show Penttax vs C&N.
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barondla
They only trouble there is what if the only B&M store doesn't carry Pentax? Since the don't now, its likely they are going to stick with C&N. Then I wouldn't be able to get Pentax at all here in the hinter land.

Edit: Ritz had a one page add in the local paper over the weekend that had a C&N body in it with details. Pentax has got to get on the page and make a point.

09-29-2008, 03:13 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by barondla Quote
.... Only have your product sold thru brick & mortar stores. No mail order what so ever. Has been working in car audio for a number of years. Then all b&M stores would get behind something they could actually make a little money on.
thanks
barondla
I don't think that's going to happen, many of the successful B&M stores also have online stores also. If Pentax did something like you're suggesting, those B&M stores would stop selling Pentax and Pentax would be worse off. Good pricing is the key to enabling B&M stores to compete.
The reason B&M stores do so well with car audio is....... installation. If cars and car audio were made so that the equipment just 'slots in', B&M stores for car audio would start to close down.
09-29-2008, 03:25 PM   #33
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My advice to all you USian Pentaxians: don't come to Australia.

I mean, what is this "Pentax kit lens" you people all keep talking about?

And go easy on Cardnick. Unlike your average internet warehouse seller, he's got shop overheads to think about. Got to pay about twice as many staff as an internet store, too, I'll bet.
09-29-2008, 05:04 PM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by lithos Quote
My advice to all you USian Pentaxians: don't come to Australia.

I mean, what is this "Pentax kit lens" you people all keep talking about?

And go easy on Cardnick. Unlike your average internet warehouse seller, he's got shop overheads to think about. Got to pay about twice as many staff as an internet store, too, I'll bet.
We aren't giving Cardnick a hard time. We wish Ritz had more like him! As far as internet stores go, Adorama and B&H have "real" stores. There are other B&M around the country that I do business with as well. I have to!

09-30-2008, 06:34 AM   #35
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While car stereo shops do have installation to help differentiate them from internet sellers it usually isn't a big money maker. It is comparable to repair. Very few consider repair a profitable department that could stand on its own.
An even better example of the no internet sales would be highend audio sales. You won't be buying Krell, Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Mark Levinson, B&W, Magnepan, etc. Even if these companies have internet sales they aren't to companies that just blow things out at ultra cheap prices all the time.
Not sure I understand the more competitive prices statement. Are you saying the B&M need to sell cheaper? If so not vey likely. The big internet stores sell at most B&M cost! Wonder how much cheaper they are getting product? Even if B&M sold at cost the stuff would still sell for 7-10% more because of state sales tax! It is a no win situation.
The US internet sales have started to cause problems for distributors in other countries and the camera manufacturers themselves. This can't go on forever. One day the camera manufacturers will have to act.

thanks
barondla
Check out POINT & SHOOT CONTEST # 10 WINNERS in P&S forum. Enter #11. Any brand camera. Any subject. Enter now. Hurry ending soon.

Last edited by barondla; 10-01-2008 at 05:44 AM. Reason: countries instead of companies
09-30-2008, 08:35 AM   #36
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What is the difference of me ordering from BH or Adorama by mail, or walking into their stores of the street in NY? This attitude of internet sales is ridiculous. It is no different than the "old" days when Sears Roebuck was a major catalog companies . . . wait, they still are. Granted, Montgomery Ward went done the tubes for other reasons and Speigel has shrank compared to what they were in the 70s.

When you talk about internet sales, it isn't all black and white. Many major companies that have B&M stores also sell via the net. There are many independents that do as well. I think the distribution system IS the problem.
09-30-2008, 09:52 PM   #37
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The San Francisco bay area has a couple places for Pentax equipment. I have been to the Calumet branch in San Francisco, and they do have Pentax equipment, albeit a very scant supply. Last time I was there, they ran out of K20Ds and the 16-50 was sold out. They did have a K200D and a 360FGZ in stock, but that was about it. Prices weren't outrageous, and you can check online too.

A bit further away in Palo Alto, Keeble & Schuchat has a great supply of Pentax equipment. They had the K20D, K200D, and a very respectable selection of lenses in stock, including DA* lenses. Furthermore, their secondary store across the street also has a great supply of used Pentax lenses. Do note that their prices aren't cheap, but they will price match (at least to Calumet's prices). I bought my K20D and 16-50 from them, and will likely return for more.

- Jason
10-01-2008, 02:34 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by barondla Quote
While car stereo shops do have installation to help differentiate them from internet sellers it usually isn't a big money maker. It is comparable to repair. Very few consider repair a profitable department that could stand on its own.
An even better example of the no internet sales would be highend audio sales. You won't be buying Krell, Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, Mark Levinson, B&W, Magnepan, etc. Even if these companies have internet sales they aren't to companies that just blow things out at ultra cheap prices all the time.
Not sure I understand the more competitive prices statement. Are you saying the B&M need to sell cheaper? If so not vey likely. The big internet stores sell at most B&M cost! Wonder how much cheaper they are getting product? Even if B&M sold at cost the stuff would still sell for 7-10% more because of state sales tax! It is a no win situation.
The US internet sales have started to cause problems for distributors in other companies and the camera manufacturers themselves. This can't go on forever. One day the camera manufacturers will have to act.

thanks
barondla
Check out POINT & SHOOT CONTEST # 10 WINNERS in P&S forum. Enter #11. Any brand camera. Any subject. Enter now. Hurry ending soon.
I know the installation isn't a money maker but it's what gets the customers in to buy in the first place, not many people can install their own.

High end audio is a much better example, you really do have to try before you buy.

By more competitive pricing, I think you answered your own question by mentioning the camera manufacturers having to act. I meant that those manufacturers could do more to level the playing field. Remove some of the restrictions on those retailers, provide them with equipment that can be loaned out on a trial basis, give special reductions so that the small stores can sponsor local photographers, sponsor local events.
How about something like a discount scheme for forum members (any large camera specific forum) who want to buy locally. hope you are reading this Ned.

I also think 'approved dealers', not that that means anything anymore, should be monitored more closely by the manufacturers and that there should be some kind of feedback mechanism direct to the manufacturers so that customers can say how their local store is letting them down (or providing great service).

B&M stores have lost the edge of 'providing customer service' because there is such a price disparity. If I'm saving 20-30% by buying online, it doesn't matter if I get a blow job with every lens at a small store (well alright, let me see who's giving the blow job first).

11-06-2008, 07:01 AM   #39
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I called my local shop the other day. They told me they would order anything I want but they were not going to stock Pentax anymore. And the K20 I was inquiring about was $450 more from them than amazon or buydig. I'm all about supporting my local shop, but I can't pay an extra $450 for it!
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