[photoptimist]

I agree with the others that these are two FF DSLRs. It's "two classes" not "two formats." Back when Pentax only sold APS-C cameras, they often offered two or three classes such as the K-5, K-50, and K-500.

Now they are focusing on FF. That seems to suggest they might offer a high-end flagship FF plus a lower-end featherweight FF.

[Not a Number]

It doesn't mean they have to be new FF cameras. Just different anniversary editions of the K-1 mk ii, say gold or platinum.

[RonHendriks1966]

Now they are focusing on FF. That seems to suggest they might offer a high-end flagship FF plus a lower-end featherweight FF.

The thing that puzzles me is the following. Pentax put all their technology in the K-1ii. So when they develop something new, that would also go into the follower to that K-1ii. When you have two classes......where would they differ, other then the sensor? It could be more lightweight using plastic or other materials, but most all tech from K-1ii would be in it. So where would that camera become cheaper then the K-1ii? It is not the price that is a big issue with the K-1ii.

[6BQ5]

The thing that puzzles me is the following. Pentax put all their technology in the K-1ii. So when they develop something new, that would also go into the follower to that K-1ii. When you have two classes......where would they differ, other then the sensor? It could be more lightweight using plastic or other materials, but most all tech from K-1ii would be in it. So where would that camera become cheaper then the K-1ii? It is not the price that is a big issue with the K-1ii.

For as great as the K-1 and K-1 II are there is plenty of room for better performance whether it's better/faster AF with wider coverage, increased burst modes, hybrid viewfinders, video capabilities, etc. All these features (and more) can easily be divided up between two classes of bodies. Even targeting different users is easy enough. One body would be a field/landscape/travel camera while the other could be more action and video oriented. Lots of options exist.

[Fenwoodian]

For as great as the K-1 and K-1 II are there is plenty of room for better performance whether it's better/faster AF with wider coverage, increased burst modes, hybrid viewfinders, video capabilities, etc. All these features (and more) can easily be divided up between two classes of bodies. Even targeting different users is easy enough. One body would be a field/landscape/travel camera while the other could be more action and video oriented. Lots of options exist.

Here's my biggest concern...

Whatever new features/format they might offer in the future be fully supported by multiple major image editing softwares.

It's unacceptable that there's still not a single software out there that will edit RAW files taken using the new version of pixel shift that's offered on the K-1 markII .

Lots of my friends are now using Capture One. Capture One even has a special version of their software (at a discounted price) that's just for editing Fuji files. However, you guessed it, no version of Capture One will edit either version of Pentax's pixel shift files.

I, like many here, shoot full frame RAW files in order to ring every bit of goodness we can out of an image file. Without proper RAW support, we might as well shoot jpgs.

[Tesla]

I bet one of the two FF is just a special edition of the K-1 II.

---------- Post added 10-16-18 at 12:56 PM ----------

It doesn't mean they have to be new FF cameras. Just different anniversary editions of the K-1 mk ii, say gold or platinum.

Just saw your post.. I think the same!

I think this thread should be renamed "Asahiman Rumors"

[boriscleto]

There must be a yellow brick road around here. If only I could find it.....

Who cares about the yellow brick road? I want to know where the red brick road went to...

[boriscleto]

I bet one of the two FF is just a special edition of the K-1 II.[COLOR=Silver]

Because that requires the full research attention of Ricoh...

[usernametaken]

Because that requires the full research attention of Ricoh...

Choosing the right body color and size of the grip is not easy.

[H.Abendsen]

What's the rush? The latest Canon crop DSLR was the EOS 7D mk II announced in 2014 and Nikon's flagship DX500 was announced at the beginning of 2016.

Are Canon and Nikon users champing at the bit for a new crop flagship?

According to some, Ricoh/Pentax cannot possibly survive unless they copy everything Nikon and Canon does. Isn't taking their time with a new crop flagship doing that?

Copying is kinda okay, but only if you do it the right way.
and keep in mind, that Nikon first had a D7500, D5, D500 and D850 out on the market before they quickly tinkered a mirrorless together.
So at least their DSLR department seems to be aware, that pussyfooting around is not a way to win customers...

So actually I am with you, it's a good thing to be a bit(only a bit) slower than the others but delivering better...
But it would really be good for our brand if they make a big leap forward so they overtake the competition in certain areas...(or at least step up to the same level of up-to date features...) so, we PENTAXIANS and also the guys in Japan at Ricoh-Imaging can lean back, take a deep breath and concentrate on fast and accurately auto-focusing lenses.
Because that is where the real battle will be fought.
Since every company is raising the resolution in its cameras... more precise lenses that laser a higher resolution onto the pixel-dense sensors, will be needed in photography like
the energy industry needs a TOKAMAK reactor... like YESTERDAY.

But the newest developments(looking at a new supersharp 50mil with fast AF or a 55-300 PLM lens here - but for sure not at a high-class compact thats still missing 4K and a movable display)
at RICOH-Imaging look very promising...

Ah... well, back to the point:

Canon is blasted for the worst Eye-AF feature ever seen
(even Pentax's face detection focus method in Live-View on our DSLRs is way more accurate and deceisive...)
and WTF? the single SD-Slot?

And though Nikon gets praised for making XQD their standard,
their firmware still seems to be the same c-fu...
NIKON IBIS doesnt seem to do so great...
they dont offer EYE-AF at first...
and People still feel a bit of betrayed when they take a look over the hedge into the "Sony Garden" because both Zs are single memcard-slot cameras, whilst even the new FF intro model from Sony already offers 2 memory-card slots...
... but hey, at least their mount is bigger than yours. LOL


... That should make clear what mistakes RICOH should avoid. --- I sincerely hope they keep away from mirrorless but beat the others with more feature-richness and well-engineered/mature technology that works like it should...
(see canons Eye-AF debacle... gosh. what where those guys actually thinking??)

So lets all keep all our fingers crossed for a bright RICOH-Imaging/PENTAX future.

[Chris Mak]

You're posting a lot on this subject, so I'd say it matters to you
Don't get me wrong, I appreciate your presence on these forums; and as a wildlife/birding expert you're adding a lot to them.

No, it's not fairly sure we can expect two FF DSLRs for the next year. Even if asahiman was talking about two new FF DSLRs in 2 classes. Nope, he never said two FF DSLRs for the next year; that's what you said.
It's not impossible, of course - make a cheaper K-1 II and a more advanced model. As I've gone FF, you realize I'm not against this idea; I just find it unreasonably optimistic. Despite all that's been said about me, I always try to keep a balanced view on Pentax

And I don't like when it's used to push a negativist view on Pentax, as in "they won't make any APS-C!"

Up to CP+ I have kept the door open for a new Pentax crop camera for my DA560 + 1.4TC combo. It's not a trivial matter to spend 5500,- or more on such a lens, and then simply switch brands, because the proper body upgrade for it is not available.
So I know all about waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and.... for Pentax to come up with a decent K3 successor. I tried the KP shortly, and was underwhelmed.
The "announcement" in the CP+ interview, that Pentax "...are now starting to develop a DSLR that can be positioned as the K3 successor..." might have many here or wherever adding a year or two to their waiting time, but for me it's enough, certainly after the appalling Photokina interview.

There is a limit to my patience, and that does not mean I take on your supposed negative view about "Pentax not making an APSC camera", because I never said anything of the sort. They dó make an APSC camera right now, and it is the KP, and surely they will make another, who knows when or where, or what it will look like. But there's no doubt that such a body will be made.

In the meantime however:
-the K3II is discontinued and not for sale anymore where I live.
-we get info from what I regard as a credible source (sparse info), that full development power at this moment is not at all going to a new APSC body, which should absolutely be the case if a K3 successor was truly taken seriously, instead of the lip-service "now starting to develop". Instead, apparently, the bulk of development resources are at this moment being spent on a full frame line up.
-the KP is doing duty as the Pentax APSC flagship.
-Time is progressing and there is a lot going on outside of the Pentax universe.

Due to my investment in the DA560 and 1.4TC combo, I will probably be one of the last to leave, so yeah, I have hung around debunking some blind faith myths about the super Pentax APSC flagship, that is, and has been, the subject of a few 500+ page threads that go on forever with never anything else than wishful thinking.
But luckily for you my time has now finally come.
The release of the Nikon 500mm f5.6 PF has offered me a way out of the Pentax waiting room, luckily, because I have read all the magazines a thousand times by now.........

Chris

[Larrymc]

Copying is kinda okay, but only if you do it the right way.
and keep in mind, that Nikon first had a D7500, D5, D500 and D850 out on the market before they quickly tinkered a mirrorless together.
So at least their DSLR department seems to be aware, that pussyfooting around is not a way to win customers...

So actually I am with you, it's a good thing to be a bit(only a bit) slower than the others but delivering better...
But it would really be good for our brand if they make a big leap forward so they overtake the competition in certain areas...(or at least step up to the same level of up-to date features...) so, we PENTAXIANS and also the guys in Japan at Ricoh-Imaging can lean back, take a deep breath and concentrate on fast and accurately auto-focusing lenses.
Because that is where the real battle will be fought.
Since every company is raising the resolution in its cameras... more precise lenses that laser a higher resolution onto the pixel-dense sensors, will be needed in photography like
the energy industry needs a TOKAMAK reactor... like YESTERDAY.

But the newest developments(looking at a new supersharp 50mil with fast AF or a 55-300 PLM lens here - but for sure not at a high-class compact thats still missing 4K and a movable display)
at RICOH-Imaging look very promising...

Ah... well, back to the point:

Canon gets blasted for the worst Eye-AF feature ever seen
(even Pentax's face detection focus method in Live-View on our DSLRs is way more accurate and deceisive...)
and WTF? the single SD-Slot?

And though Nikon gets praised for making XQD their standard,
their firmware still seems to be the same c-fu...
NIKON IBIS doesnt seem to do so great...
they dont offer EYE-AF at first...
and People still feel a bit of betrayed when they take a look over the hedge into the "Sony Garden" because both Zs are single memcard-slot cameras, whilst even the new FF intro model from Sony already offers 2 memory-card slots...
... but hey, at least their mount is bigger than yours. LOL


... That should make clear what mistakes RICOH should avoid. --- I sincerely hope they keep away from mirrorless but beat the others with more feature-richness and well-engineered/mature technology that works like it should...
(see canons Eye-AF debacle... gosh. what where those guys actually thinking??)

So lets all keep all our fingers crossed for a bright RICOH-Imaging/PENTAX future.

And a "Thumb stick' too, huh??

[Larrymc]

Up to CP+ I have kept the door open for a new Pentax crop camera for my DA560 + 1.4TC combo. It's not a trivial matter to spend 5500,- or more on such a lens, and then simply switch brands, because the proper body upgrade for it is not available.
So I know all about waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and.... for Pentax to come up with a decent K3 successor. I tried the KP shortly, and was underwhelmed.
The "announcement" in the CP+ interview, that Pentax "...are now starting to develop a DSLR that can be positioned as the K3 successor..." might have many here or wherever adding a year or two to their waiting time, but for me it's enough, certainly after the appalling Photokina interview.

There is a limit to my patience, and that does not mean I take on your supposed negative view about "Pentax not making an APSC camera", because I never said anything of the sort. They dó make an APSC camera right now, and it is the KP, and surely they will make another, who knows when or where, or what it will look like. But there's no doubt that such a body will be made.

In the meantime however:
-the K3II is discontinued and not for sale anymore where I live.
-we get info from what I regard as a credible source (sparse info), that full development power at this moment is not at all going to a new APSC body, which should absolutely be the case if a K3 successor was truly taken seriously, instead of the lip-service "now starting to develop". Instead, apparently, the bulk of development resources are at this moment being spent on a full frame line up.
-the KP is doing duty as the Pentax APSC flagship.
-Time is progressing and there is a lot going on outside of the Pentax universe.

Due to my investment in the DA560 and 1.4TC combo, I will probably be one of the last to leave, so yeah, I have hung around debunking some blind faith myths about the super Pentax APSC flagship, that is, and has been, the subject of a few 500+ page threads that go on forever with never anything else than wishful thinking.
But luckily for you my time has now finally come.
The release of the Nikon 500mm f5.6 PF has offered me a way out of the Pentax waiting room, luckily, because I have read all the magazines a thousand times by now.........

Chris

Well, just ship me that useless DA560 I don't even want the TC!

[photoptimist]

The thing that puzzles me is the following. Pentax put all their technology in the K-1ii. So when they develop something new, that would also go into the follower to that K-1ii. When you have two classes......where would they differ, other then the sensor? It could be more lightweight using plastic or other materials, but most all tech from K-1ii would be in it. So where would that camera become cheaper then the K-1ii? It is not the price that is a big issue with the K-1ii.

Didn't the K-5, K-50, and K-500 all share the same 16 MPix sensor?

I'd think that differences in body size, number of knobs & buttons, stilty-tilty screen versus fixed screen, two or one card slot, accelerator chip versus not, GPS versus not, pixelshift versus not, etc. provide a good basis for differentiating the classes.

In general, companies profit from a multi-class product system based on a shared technology platform by getting a higher margin on the high-end version but using the volume created by the low-end version to get better economies of scale. In essence, the flagship model pays for the R&D and the featherweight model keep the factory humming.

[monochrome]

As far as the technology inside an APSc Flagship, it’s just going to be everything in the FF with a smaller prism and sensor, so how much ‘development’ is there really left to do?