[Larrymc]

This facebook comment is something I am not aware of.
No flagship apsc would be a disaster for the brand, they really should have a look to the breakdown of K1+K1II vs the rest of historical units sold over the last 2 cycles K5 + K3...

Wonder what Ricoh/Pentax might expect us to do who have an abundance of APS-C lens in our Kit? Suck it up and buy FF lens or use the APS-C setting on the FF?

At my age I'm not buying into the FF equipment I'll just stick with my APS-C cameras and be content but I think there will be an APS-C high spec camera next year.

[monochrome]

He Who?? What about the K-3II, KP as well as the K-1II? FWIW, I stay off of Facebook completely so if you're referring to anyone there I'm not getting on Facebook just to take a peek at his Signature.

D1N0.

The sig tag here says FF IS HERE. It used to say FF IS COMING.

No one ever knows (or can say, if they do) everything, but many people have insights. Nothing is certain, especially as close to the vest as Pentax plays. I think it is important not to hang my wishes and desires on any one desired outcome because I am highly likely to be disappointed if I do. Over the years I’ve learned to be happy with what I have and what Pentax releases. If I am unhappy the only alternative is Canon, Nikon or Sony, because Pentax will never be them.

Given the recently released D FA*50/1.4, the announced DA*11~18/2.8, the rumored D FA*85/1.4, the hinted *35/1.4 and the roadmap, I think it unlikely Pentax will release ANY camera that is below the standard of those lenses. My guess is they’re completely re-engineering the entire platform from the ground up, perhaps to use an image sensor and image processor from different manufacturers. Doing that would require completely recoding core logic (abandoning SocioNext and SAFOX altogether, doing video right and starting fresh on AF logic, plus a new AF sensor - or even on-sensor PDAF, for instance). That takes time and money, and a FF probably has a much higher per unit margin than APSc, so the new tech might be released in new FF’s first to recover development costs faster.

Looking at the past, eventually Pentax has released lower APSc and also 645 cameras with newly developed tech inside because the additional unit volume spreads the cost, but the unit margin on APSc is lower. This happened with the K-7 and K-3 (645D and 645z*) and goes back to the film versions of MF cameras. It makes a sort of business sense that such a small company would develop an APSc flagship after a flagship (or two*) FF is released because FF is now the flagship camera. That’s the way they’ve always done things.

Pentax told us for years they were studying the FF market - then suddenly they were actually developing the K-1. Now they’re telling us they’re studying MF and looking at or beginning development of an APSc flagship. In the past that kind of language has meant in Pentax speak, “Maybe, Probably, but not Now.”

If asahi man and D1N0 and others are hinting FF is the current priority and APSc and 645 are later - APSc and 645 are probably later. Be patient.

Just my humble, speculative opinion.

OBTW LX is Roman Numerals for 60; the LX was released around the 60th Anniversary. Could there be a K-1C?

* On another thread someone wrote, “645C.” C is Roman Numerals for 100, as in Centennial.
** Is there a FF 645 sensor available? Does a new 35mm FF and a new 645 FF = 2 FF SLR’s?

My completely unfounded speculation is as valid as anyone else’s completely unfounded speculation - and worth the same 2c - since I know nothing.

.:

[Fcsnt54]

With all this talk of things to come, what is a full frame medium format? Are we saying 6X7, 6x4.5, 6x6, 6x8, etc? Just a little confused

[RGlasel]

what is a full frame medium format? Are we saying 6X7, 6x4.5, 6x6, 6x8, etc? Just a little confused

It's late on a Friday night, but I'll chip in, even though I suspect your question is rhetorical. The Pentax digital 645 cameras only have 44mm by 33mm sensors, so preserving the 4:3 aspect ratio, but definitely cropped from the 60mm by 45 mm "full" frame in 645 film cameras. In the end, it doesn't matter how big the sensor is, you have to have lenses with an image circle that covers it and while there are a good number of "full frame" 645 lenses, a smaller number of them are modern enough to work well with a high resolution digital sensor in a modern camera body with AF.

---------- Post added 10-19-18 at 11:38 PM ----------

Is there a FF 645 sensor available?

A better question might be is there a buyer for a 60mm by 40mm digital sensor that will pay for the cost of developing it. I don't think Sony will commercialize such a sensor just on spec.

[ogl]

D1N0.



OBTW LX is Roman Numerals for 60; the LX was released around the 60th Anniversary. Could there be a K-1C?

* On another thread someone wrote, “645C.” C is Roman Numerals for 100, as in Centennial.

.:

I've heard the same...But it's just guess...100 MP 645C or K-1C retro style FF ....Maybe...or maybe not

[ogl]

D1N0.


** Is there a FF 645 sensor available? Does a new 35mm FF and a new 645 FF = 2 FF SLR’s?


.:

There are TWO Sony sensors: BSI 100 MP 44*33 mm and FI 100 MP 53.4x40 mm

[Kunzite]

Look at his sig. The word ‘here’ replaced ‘coming’ when K-1 shipped. The word ‘coming’ was quietly in his sig for at least a year before we had concrete news of a FF.

IIRC, he had accurate insight about K-5 ll / lls and K-3 also.

FWIW.

So? I knew the FF was coming since October 2012; it was public information.
No offense, but in this instance I'm asked to believe someone saying something on Facebook. And by someone and something I mean exactly that: I don't know who, I don't know what.

This isn't an attack on D1N0, just presenting how things looks like from here. If he has some stronger information, he's welcome to share it.

---

Last edited by Kunzite; 10-20-2018 at 12:25 AM.

[RonHendriks1966]

I don't think these 645 dreams are coming true. 645 is on hibernation for some years now. Sales are probably too. With no new lenses in the past years (except that refresh 35mm) and the 645Z going 5 years old, the sales must be low. So investing in new lenses and new body's (two, one with 44x33 and one with 53.4x40) is a way to big risk to take. Simply not happening. The cheapest way to update would be a refresh 645Zii with just a new sensor and maybe even the accelerating processor. Shake Reduction would be great, but no idea if that is possible.

[thibs]

It's late on a Friday night, but I'll chip in, even though I suspect your question is rhetorical. The Pentax digital 645 cameras only have 44mm by 33mm sensors, so preserving the 4:3 aspect ratio, but definitely cropped from the 60mm by 45 mm "full" frame in 645 film cameras. In the end, it doesn't matter how big the sensor is, you have to have lenses with an image circle that covers it and while there are a good number of "full frame" 645 lenses, a smaller number of them are modern enough to work well with a high resolution digital sensor in a modern camera body with AF.

The 645FF image is not 60*45mm. The fim is, the real image produced is 56 mm × 41.5 mm (in Pentax 645 film cams case). Not a lot less but not 60*45 either.

[edri]

If Pentax will only deal with FF, I will not buy anything from Ricoh as of next year, perhaps I will spend my money on a m43 system.

[RobA_Oz]

I don't think these 645 dreams are coming true. 645 is on hibernation for some years now. Sales are probably too. With no new lenses in the past years (except that refresh 35mm) and the 645Z going 5 years old, the sales must be low. So investing in new lenses and new body's (two, one with 44x33 and one with 53.4x40) is a way to big risk to take. Simply not happening. The cheapest way to update would be a refresh 645Zii with just a new sensor and maybe even the accelerating processor. Shake Reduction would be great, but no idea if that is possible.

The MF market segment is different to the other parts of the photographic equipment market, though. People who buy there tend to be either people making money from their gear, or well-heeled amateurs. We don’t really know what the sales figures are, let alone what the newer entries are doing to the market.

On the matter of a new sensor, given the size of the existing body and the fact that SR isn’t present currently and is probably not necessary for the uses that MF cameras are put to (PS is another matter, though), the major investments required would be for the supporting hardware and firmware. Although margins for MF bodies are probably not as large as they were when the 645D came out, I imagine they’re still substantial, so those investments may well be small enough to ensure a satisfactory return from the resulting sales boost. PS would probably be gilding the lily for a 100MP MF image, too.

[Kunzite]

If Pentax will only deal with FF, I will not buy anything from Ricoh as of next year, perhaps I will spend my money on a m43 system.

The DA* 11-18mm f/2.8 is (still) scheduled for 2019, so that claim can't be true. Regardless of what someone says somewhere.

[RonHendriks1966]

The DA* 11-18mm f/2.8 is (still) scheduled for 2019, so that claim can't be true. Regardless of what someone says somewhere.

We will learn more about that lens on CP+, only 131 nights of sleeping away.

[Mistral75]

(...)
** Is there a FF 645 sensor available? (...)

As underlined by @thibs film 645 is 41.5x56mm. The closest to these dimensions in digital era is 40x53.4mm. Sony propose two such sensors: the older, front-side illuminated 100MP and the newer, back-side illuminated 150MP.

There are also two 33x44 Sony sensors: the older, front-side illuminated 50MP and the newer, back-side illuminated 100MP.

A 645C in 2019, C (100 in Latin) being both for centennial and for 100MP (33x44 BSI), would be nice but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for it.

[Mistral75]

I don't think these 645 dreams are coming true. 645 is on hibernation for some years now. Sales are probably too. With no new lenses in the past years (except that refresh 35mm) and the 645Z going 5 years old, the sales must be low. So investing in new lenses and new body's (two, one with 44x33 and one with 53.4x40) is a way to big risk to take. Simply not happening. The cheapest way to update would be a refresh 645Zii with just a new sensor and maybe even the accelerating processor. Shake Reduction would be great, but no idea if that is possible.

I presume it is since the Fujifilm GFX 100Megapixels, the development of which was announced at Photokina, includes sensor stabilisation.

Fujifilm unveils GFX 100Megapixels Concept | Fujifilm Global

http://www.fujifilm.com/products/digital_cameras/pdf/gfx100M_catalogue_01.pdf