[reh321]

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I also re-stated that the Sony camera we are referring to is the A7rIII. Which is a similar price and 42MP. Though it is imaterial as we are talking about a Product range offering not a particular camera for a particular use.. And going forward how Pentax will retain its market share. With now having competition on a similar price level from a larger player in the market place...

You do realize that details matter? The A7Riii currently costs $2800 at B&H {'holiday saving' of $450) - 50% more than the K-1ii. There is absolutely no reason to compare those two cameras - they are not similarly priced. Punct.

[BigMackCam]

Wasnt that what I said.. Going forward. Pentax needs to decide where it wants to position itself in the market place.. If it wants to run with the ones that have the larger market share. It needs more product.. But it may decide not to invest as it may not get a worthy return from what is at present a diminishing market..

Per an earlier response, I believe Ricoh has already set out its stall quite clearly, and for some time now. I don't think there's any lack of clarity as to where it wants or intends to participate. In its current inacarnation, the Pentax brand represents a range of very high quality cameras that aren't leading edge, but offer extremely good value for money if the image quality, supporting lenses and accessories are to the buyer's liking.

There are some who would like Pentax to be something it used to be, could arguably be in the future, but in any case currently isn't. Ricoh hasn't given any hints or suggestions to prompt those wishes, so they remain nothing more than the wishful thinking of those concerned.

Many times before in these forums, I've recommended to others that there's no mileage in waiting for what might be. Life's too short for that, and no commercial corporation (or division thereof) deserves our loyalty unless we know as certain fact that they're going to service our needs in a time frame we consider acceptable. We should buy and use exactly what we want and need, regardless of brand. It's better for us as individuals, and I personally believe it's better for the manufacturers as it provides them with a clear point-in-time opinion of their product offering.

But... many (I'd suggest most) folks who believe Pentax can't service their needs are blaming their equipment instead of themselves. That's not true for everyone, of course, but most people can get everything they need - cameras, lenses and accessories - right now from any brand, Pentax included. They might think they need a certain resolution, continuous frame rate, specific focal length lens with specific maximum aperture or performance characteristics etc. etc. - but mostly, these are excuses. Any current brand of DSLR or mirrorless camera - and their respective lens ranges - are capable of servicing the photographic requirements of anyone here.

For now, I'm very happy with Pentax for a large portion of my photography needs. The next data-point I'm interested in is the announcement of a new APS-C flagship - though, in all honesty, I doubt I'll buy it until long after its release...

On a separate point - as I mentioned in my last response, and as others have now stated, the A7 Mk3 which is comparably priced to the K-3II, has only a 24MP sensor. The A7R Mk3 - the one with the 42MP sensor you mention - is way, way more expensive

[stub]

For a lot more money.
DxO rates the the 645z the #2 camera out of hundreds, and the K-1 #8 out of hundreds.

The simple fact is, others have better offerings is just nonsense. Other manufacturers have produced thousands of cameras that are not Pentax quality. Last time I check even the K-5 was still in the top 50. Your understanding fo Pentax's place in the camera world is so skewed as to be called farce. There i sone camera abetter than the 645z, There are 7 better than the K-1 one of which is the 645z, so 6 made by other manufacturers. Using Dxo metrics those are the facts. The above quote is absolute nonsense.

Yet I don here you saying "Even though Pentax has 2% market share they still have 2 of the top 10. Instead you concentrate on the very small number of offerings that might be in some way marginally better.

And though the 645z is a fabulous offering. I certainly wont comment on, as Ive no experiece of it.. I do hear comments from its users. Just like the K1, K1II. Could we please have more lens offerings..!!

[Ash]

The A7Riii currently costs $2800 at B&H

At the same time, The K-1 II is going for $1899 (with grip).
Big price difference.
Furthermore, look at the lenses. Sony high end lenses are not cheap; they're significantly more expensive than those that Pentax offer:
Tamron 28-75 is $799 on E-mount (currently $399 on K-mount)
Sony 16-35 is $2,198 (Pentax 15-30 is $1,096)
Sony 24-105 f/4 is $1,298 (Pentax 28-105 is $446)
Sony 24-70 f/2.8 is $2,198 (Pentax 24-70 f/2.8 is $846.95)

[stub]

You do realize that details matter? The A7Riii currently costs $2800 at B&H {'holiday saving' of $450) - 50% more than the K-1ii. There is absolutely no reason to compare those two cameras - they are not similarly priced. Punct.

If you look back at my link to Amazon Uk. Its £1799.. So a very similiar price here in the UK. So now very comparable...

[BigMackCam]

If you look back at my link to Amazon Uk. Its £1799.. So a very similiar price here in the UK. So now very comparable...

No, that's the A7 MkIII... NOT the A7R MkIII. Very different cameras... the former has a 24MP sensor, while the latter (at roughly GBP £2,900) has a 42MP sensor. That's a HUGE difference in spec, hence the price difference.

So, you get a 36MP Pentax for the same price as a 24MP Sony... or, you can spend a boat-load more for a 42MP Sony

[stub]

At the same time, The K-1 II is going for $1899 (with grip).
Big price difference.
Furthermore, look at the lenses. Sony high end lenses are not cheap; they're significantly more expensive than those that Pentax offer:
Tamron 28-75 is $799 on E-mount (currently $399 on K-mount)
Sony 16-35 is $2,198 (Pentax 15-30 is $1,096)
Sony 24-105 f/4 is $1,298 (Pentax 28-105 is $446)
Sony 24-70 f/2.8 is $2,198 (Pentax 24-70 f/2.8 is $846.95)

But as Ive been pointing out Sony have third party lens support which is less expensive.. Still maybe more expensive than Pentax I accept. But overall a fuller range offering.. As do Canon and Nikon..

[wibbly]

If you look back at my link to Amazon Uk. Its £1799.. So a very similiar price here in the UK. So now very comparable...

the sony for 1799 is the a7r ii, not the a7r iii, which is 2390 gbp

[c.a.m]

If you look back at my link to Amazon Uk. Its £1799.

Is that the price for the A7R III (three) or A7R II (two)?

[reh321]

If you look back at my link to Amazon Uk. Its £1799.. So a very similiar price here in the UK. So now very comparable...

No, that's the A7 MkIII... NOT the A7R MkIII. Very different cameras... the former has a 24MP sensor, while the latter (at roughly GBP £2,900) has a 42MP sensor. That's a HUGE difference in spec, hence the price difference.

This sloppiness is what makes accepting your {@stub's} words at face value. You seem to mix A7ii, A7iii, A7Riii, A7Rii as though they were the same camera.

[c.a.m]

Sony have third party lens support which is less expensive..

My understanding is that for the full-frame format, a 70-200mm f/2.8 zoom is a fairly standard lens for pros. I think that for Sony, this is a crucial gap in third-party offerings -- I can't find any source for a Sigma or Tamron model. Of course, Sigma/Tamron offer other lenses for Sony FE, but not in that important 70-200/2.8 slot.

[stub]

Sony ILCE7RM2 Full Frame Compact System Camera Body: Amazon.co.uk: Electronic


Mark II granted ... told you I was no Sony expert But £1800 and 42mp

[BigMackCam]

Sony ILCE7RM2 Full Frame Compact System Camera Body: Amazon.co.uk: Electronic

That's the A7R Mk2 (released 2015), not the A7R Mk3 (released 2017, and much more expensive). Older model, older features, older performance Still a really great camera for the relevant use cases, but not the Mk3...

[stub]

You wont also find a Tamron offering in Pentax for the 24-70 f2.8. Which is a very standard lens for obvious reasons...

[Ash]

But as Ive been pointing out Sony have third party lens support which is less expensive.. Still maybe more expensive than Pentax I accept. But overall a fuller range offering.. As do Canon and Nikon..

But you're shifting the goalposts now, citing the 3rd party lens support as being the driving force for your/others' decision to choose the brand. I don't believe that is the case for most people choosing a brand. As for the fuller range, at the moment for FF in K-mount, there is for Pentax alone:

15-30, 24-70, 50, 70-200, 300, 150-450, 560.

Most shooting applications would be covered by these FLs - and all these lenses are top-notch in speed/performance/IQ.

Third party lenses are plentiful, though mostly on 2nd hand markets as Sigma and Tamron have gone on the back burner with their K-mount offerings.

What are missing are the more niche lenses such as the fish eye (11-16 may be coming) and super-fast 300/2.8, 500/4, 800/5.6, etc. that Canon and Nikon have. They're not even available in Sony E-mount to make it a talking point. Are you looking for those high end telephoto lenses that you would compare Pentax with Canon and Nikon? If so, then I would encourage you to make the price comparison with the equivalent bodies and lenses in those systems and see how you go in terms of price.