[RonHendriks1966]

Ron isn't a customer.
If I'm not mistaken, he gave up on photography altogether. OTOH, I am a customer.

We don't know if you are a customer. We never saw any images taken with your acclaimed gear.

[reh321]

Yes. And Customers are buying into SYSTEM. Not into camera. Ricoh can have excellent K1 (Which it is not!), but WITHOUT comparable portfolio of LENSES the whole system is fu..ked up right from start. And what is worst, they are not even able to catch breath and deliver few new FF lenses every year. Instead we have 1-2 products per year. And considering the fact, that Pentax has lost Tokina, Tamron, Zeiss and Sigma, the situation is even worse. Because Canon, Nikon and Sony do have options to use these new lenses. Not to mention that they are able to deliver bunch of own lenses every year. Who on earth is going to invest into Pentax system over the fully established and supported systems. Just few strange gus and hardcore pentaxians or pentax believers who already have many old FF lenses. Many of them already left.. I saw several offerings of barely used K1 setups during last months as new FF systems were delivered by C/N/S.

I don't need new lenses every year.
The 'A' 50mm f/1.7 that was kitted with my Super Program served me well for all twelve years that the Super Program was my primary camera (*).
The 18-135mm I purchased three years ago will serve me well for many years to come.
The 55-300mm I purchased Black Friday last year will serve me well for many years to come.

FF battle for Ricoh is lost. But it seems that they are too slow to realize this and they, as we can see now, decided to let neglected 645 and APS-C systems die, while they are trying to do unrealistic marketing miracle with very weak FF system.

Maybe my words are wstrong,

Very wrong indeed {I fixed it for you}



(*) and later I used it with my K-30.

[Kunzite]

We don't know if you are a customer. We never saw any images taken with your acclaimed gear.

Who are "we"?

(Speaking of which... just 2 days ago, I posted on the other forum an image involving 3 of the Pentax products I own: the K-1 II, the D FA* 50mm f/1.4 and the DA 35mm Limited macro. What a surprise, another false accusation!)

[Rondec]

Nice.. so you have two tamron lenses that are available for canon and nikon with working VC, longer varranty and are cheaper. And then you have overpriced 70-200 which has outdated AF motor, while other users can get cheaper, faster focusing and still optically excellent Tamron 70-200/2.8 G2 that ruled through many tests.. so where is the point of investing into Pentax?

Maybe your pink glasses are too pinky that you cannot see through




Or maybe the new DFA50/1.4 is the gem that should attract everybody?
Nope.
Others simply can buy the Tokina version... or any other 50/1.4 like Zeiss Otus, Zeiss Milvus, or own system 50/1.4 lenses or even F1.2 lenses. They DON'T CARE about that lens at all. Only pentaxians do. Its like religion.. but very weird religion.

I happen to shoot pictures. I don't particularly care about the brand, but I do own a lot of Pentax glass and at this point, it seems to work well. Yes, the 15-30 and 24-70 are Tamron rebadges, but that's OK. They still work well. They are slightly more expensive than the Tamron versions available elsewhere, although Black Friday sales had them equal or slightly cheaper.

Regardless, there is no reason to attack other folks who shoot Pentax gear. I certainly have nothing to say about what gear the company releases next year. I do hope they keep the k mount going for a long time though, as I have a lot of lenses that seem quite attached to that.

(Image with aforementioned Tamron rebadged 15-30)

Instead the right way was to introduce camera later introduced as Q7 is and combine it with just three solid performer lenses. Some 24-60/2.8-4 + 50-200/4-5.6 and some 35/1.8 35mm equivallent lenses. Thats all for start. No toy stuff. Just proper glass+metal lenses with perfect image quality straight wide open. Zero care about initial price, just provide solid camera that many people want. Later add some faster telephoto like 75/1.8 and maybe some wide lens like 12/4 equiv.. That might have been superb tiny travell kit for people who want to travell light and still have option to play with camera on higher level with good image output. Something like film A110 used to be.

As I understand, the sensor in the Q7 wasn't available at the time of the Q's introduction.


All of these things you stated the Q already has, and then some. Using C-mount lenses I've got pocketable equivalents of 115mm f1.4, 230mm f1.4 and a 345mm f1.3 (all image stabilized). I've got four Q bodies and I've found them to be "solid" over four years (including surviving several drops) and tens of thousands of shots.


The film A110 was toy stuff in comparison (I've had two, both of which self-destroyed), IQ of 110 film was marginal at best, the Qs IQ is equal or superior to 35mm FF film.

[kooks]

Oh my!! .. this topics are always like runnin in circles chasing tails.. for some people the system will be perfect for their needs as it is.. for some other the system could be not good at all.. Some of the points mention by @xmedia are true, hard, ugly, nasty true, but it will be only true to the ones that expect something else from what Ricoh is doing now and that is fine. Is Pentax as a brand running behind the other brands?? IMO yes, other systems are moving constantly and with Ricoh everything seems to be just in "stand by", just as an example, if you compare the pentaxrumors.com feed, against the sonyalpharumors.com page there is a BIG difference in announcements of every kind, and this influence the people about investing or not in a new system.

Ricoh/Pentax marketing i think that we can all agree that is THE WORST, they just simply can not sell their products at the right time, to the right people and using the right channels... for the old die folks using Pentax that might not be important, for the ones searching for a path to follow this is a "no no " thing.


Just as an example yesterday i was reading an article at PetaPixel - Photography and Camera News, Reviews, and Inspiration ( Where Mirrorless is Headed in 2019 ) and this is how the article mentioned Pentax:

"Pentax

Incomplete. Hasn’t showed up to class since 2014, and then only to turn in a revised homework assignment that didn’t change their grade at all.

I’m wondering if Pentax is still a student. Should I put in a missing person’s report?

Less work for me with Pentax absent, I suppose, which is fine."

and as i see it is not just about the mirrorless thing.. its about the all camera thing.. seems like Pentax is the missing student in all this crazy camera world... or is just the one that shows to the party when all the other people already ate.. that doesn't mean at all the the products are bad, it just means that their timming is way off track.. and the priorities are just mmm unknown.. for somebody that is just investing in a system and wants a path to follow this "business strategy" it is terrible..

[reh321]

Oh my!! .. this topics are always like runnin in circles chasing tails.. for some people the system will be perfect for their needs as it is.. for some other the system could be not good at all.. Some of the points mention by @xmedia are true, hard, ugly, nasty true, but it will be only true to the ones that expect something else from what Ricoh is doing now and that is fine. Is Pentax as a brand running behind the other brands IMO yes, other systems are moving constantly and with Ricoh everything seems to be just in "stand by", just as an example, if you compare the pentaxrumors.com feed, against the sonyalpharumors.com page there is a BIG difference in announcements of every kind, and this influence the people about investing or not in a new system.

Ricoh/Pentax marketing i think that we can all agree that is THE WORST, the just simply can not sell their products at the right time, to the right people and using the right channels.. Just as an example yesterday i was reading an article at PetaPixel - Photography and Camera News, Reviews, and Inspiration ( Where Mirrorless is Headed in 2019 ) and this is how the article mentioned Pentax:

"Pentax

Incomplete. Hasn’t showed up to class since 2014, and then only to turn in a revised homework assignment that didn’t change their grade at all.

I’m wondering if Pentax is still a student. Should I put in a missing person’s report?

Less work for me with Pentax absent, I suppose, which is fine."

and as i see it is not just about the mirrorless thing.. its about the all camera thing.. seems like Pentax is the missing student in all this crazy camera world... or is just the one that shows to the party when all the other people already ate.. that doesn't mean at all the the products are bad, it just means that their timing is way off track.. and the priorities are just mmm unknown.. for somebody that is just investing in a system and wants a path to follow this "business strategy" it is terrible..

Part of the issue is that in the early days of digital, we become accustomed to 'break through' developments every year. That isn't happening any more. For example, Nikon introduced the D5 and D500 three years ago, and only now are they reaching the point where people are talking 'refresh'; the AF system they share is still excellent. Nikon, Canon, and Sony each is able to have many cameras in their current catalog, so they can offer a camera "just right" for each person. Pentax's finances limit them to a much smaller catalog, so they can be "just right" for many fewer people.

[kooks]

Part of the issue is that in the early days of digital, we become accustomed to 'break through' developments every year. That isn't happening any more. For example, Nikon introduced the D5 and D500 three years ago, and only now are they reaching the point where people are talking 'refresh'; the AF system they share is still excellent. Nikon, Canon, and Sony each is able to have many cameras in their current catalog, so they can offer a camera "just right" for each person. Pentax's finances limit them to a much smaller catalog, so they can be "just right" for many fewer people.

Yes.. and the question here that i wonder is.. Is it to late??

[xmeda]

99% religion 1% reality here..

[reh321]

99% religion 1% reality here..

Not at all.
I am extremely pleased with my KP, which provides fabulous SOOC photos at ISO levels that have never been available to me before.
My expectation is that I will have little or no need for flash during the reception at my daughter's wedding reception this coming Saturday, which to me is a wonderful attainment.

That is 100% reality!

[reh321]

Zero care about initial price, just provide solid camera that many people want. Later add some faster telephoto like 75/1.8 and maybe some wide lens like 12/4 equiv.. That might have been superb tiny travel kit for people who want to travel light and still have option to play with camera on higher level with good image output. Something like film A110 used to be.

We totally disagree here. Yes, the Q-7 you posted here is not very attractive, but if I had purchased the silver Q-7 my camera would have closely resembled the rangefinder cameras that introduced me to adjustable cameras. My Q-7 is my traveling kit, and it delivers very good photos to me - all it needed was an EVF to make it perfect in my experience. Have you actually used a Q-7 or Q-S1??

[Rico]

To me "compete with" and "compete against" mean the same thing.

If Pentax had been third entry into MFT field, with camera built as "Q", I cannot think of any reason for someone to buy one .... I would have purchased Olympus MFT instead of Q MFT.

Issue with "Q" was lack of EVF - not innovative size of sensor.

You make no sense reh321.

Whether or not you think "compete with" and "compete against" mean the same thing they are not. The whole purpose of the 4/3 mount consortium was so the manufactures were not competing against each other as there was a standard between them. If Pentax made the Q with a 4/3 sensor and mount you would have went with Olympus? How can you be so sure since Pentax didn't use industry standards instead made the Q that was a dead end system for users. Pentax should have modeled the Q after the A110. The 110 film size is roughly the same size as 4/3 sensor so Pentax already had a camera and lenses that utilized this same format size. Pentax could have still made the claim they had the smallest mirrorless camera on the market.

As I said Pentax M4/3 lenses bought by Olympus and Panasonic M4/3 users would have been more than enough to sustain a M4/3 Q system. Instead Pentax created the Q with a tiny sensor that only appealed to a very few like you which lead Pentax to abandon the project.

---------- Post added 01-07-19 at 08:24 PM ----------

Not really. Some people, myself included came from different reason - Pentax promised a bright APS-C future.

So you came to Pentax for APS-C but the DA LTD's were not a factor. I highly doubt that. Certainly some people didn't move to Pentax for the FA LTD's and DA LTD's but the majority did.

---------- Post added 01-07-19 at 08:27 PM ----------

Yes. And Customers are buying into SYSTEM. Not into camera. Ricoh can have excellent K1 (Which it is not!), but WITHOUT comparable portfolio of LENSES the whole system is fu..ked up right from start. And what is worst, they are not even able to catch breath and deliver few new FF lenses every year. Instead we have 1-2 products per year. And considering the fact, that Pentax has lost Tokina, Tamron, Zeiss and Sigma, the situation is even worse. Because Canon, Nikon and Sony do have options to use these new lenses. Not to mention that they are able to deliver bunch of own lenses every year. Who on earth is going to invest into Pentax system over the fully established and supported systems. Just few strange gus and hardcore pentaxians or pentax believers who already have many old FF lenses. Many of them already left.. I saw several offerings of barely used K1 setups during last months as new FF systems were delivered by C/N/S.

FF battle for Ricoh is lost. But it seems that they are too slow to realize this and they, as we can see now, decided to let neglected 645 and APS-C systems die, while they are trying to do unrealistic marketing miracle with very weak FF system.

Maybe my words are strong, but we will see... K mount market share is disappearing rapidly..

xmeda you are not even close to being accurate on anything you have said here. Really this is just a poorly composed troll post.

[Larrymc]

Yes. And Customers are buying into SYSTEM. Not into camera. Ricoh can have excellent K1 (Which it is not!), but WITHOUT comparable portfolio of LENSES the whole system is fu..ked up right from start. And what is worst, they are not even able to catch breath and deliver few new FF lenses every year. Instead we have 1-2 products per year. And considering the fact, that Pentax has lost Tokina, Tamron, Zeiss and Sigma, the situation is even worse. Because Canon, Nikon and Sony do have options to use these new lenses. Not to mention that they are able to deliver bunch of own lenses every year. Who on earth is going to invest into Pentax system over the fully established and supported systems. Just few strange gus and hardcore pentaxians or pentax believers who already have many old FF lenses. Many of them already left.. I saw several offerings of barely used K1 setups during last months as new FF systems were delivered by C/N/S.

FF battle for Ricoh is lost. But it seems that they are too slow to realize this and they, as we can see now, decided to let neglected 645 and APS-C systems die, while they are trying to do unrealistic marketing miracle with very weak FF system.

Maybe my words are strong, but we will see... K mount market share is disappearing rapidly..

Dude you ARE the expert aren't you?

[Rico]

99% religion 1% reality here..

100% trolling by xmeda.

[Larrymc]

99% religion 1% reality here..

Well maybe you need to move on to the Reality site where you usually hang out with all your realist Pals. For the life of me I really don't know what motivates "Realists" like you........I guess you get some perverted pleasure coming here trolling every so often. Do you need to keep your trolling proficiency license by dropping in with a few troll posts???